I want to file for the SGIP rebate my self. Does anyone have the the technical specs needed such as: Amp-Hour Capacity of Each Battery,Nominal Battery Voltage, and Continuous Power Output of Inverter? I can't get through to my Tesla rep. He insists that customers can't apply for the rebate on their own. SGIP says I can. I just need the technical info. Thanks in advance. -K
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Powerwall 2: SGIP/Incentives
- Thread starter avesraggiana
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- Powerwall Tesla Energy
astrothad
Member
I had Tesla contacting me repeatedly about a final contract after my installation was complete.
It turns out, because they didn't need to do a main panel upgrade, they were attempting to return $2400 to me.
After it became clear this is what they were trying to do, I signed the final contract immediately.
This should lower what I get back from SGIP, if the books are checked correctly.
This seems to be the thread to throw every bit of information into regarding Powerwalls. Unless we start seeing reasonable breakouts of topics into separate threads, I'll continue to update here.
Also - no pics yet. My wife wants the stucco repairs repainted before I start making pictures of our installation public. It has been running really well, though, and the only days we draw grid energy are if we have to run the AC a lot and charge our electric smart at night. That is with letting the 2 Powerwalls drop to 20% state-of-charge.
It turns out, because they didn't need to do a main panel upgrade, they were attempting to return $2400 to me.
After it became clear this is what they were trying to do, I signed the final contract immediately.
This should lower what I get back from SGIP, if the books are checked correctly.
This seems to be the thread to throw every bit of information into regarding Powerwalls. Unless we start seeing reasonable breakouts of topics into separate threads, I'll continue to update here.
Also - no pics yet. My wife wants the stucco repairs repainted before I start making pictures of our installation public. It has been running really well, though, and the only days we draw grid energy are if we have to run the AC a lot and charge our electric smart at night. That is with letting the 2 Powerwalls drop to 20% state-of-charge.
Ulmo
Active Member
Pragmatically and practically, Tesla is basically correct, and technically, SGIP is correct. Pick your poison
As I recall, the inside sticker of each battery said their capacity is 14.3kWh (so 14,300 amp hours). Mine is currently slightly over-rated at around 28,800Wh for two batteries (so 14,400Wh), but that fluctuates with time; it's a BMS that guesses the capacity through time and deterioration. I would have to look at the sticker for the nominal battery voltage. Continuous power output of each battery inverter is 5kW, peak is 7kW.
No, they didn't tell the truth. You can't be doing home, X, and 3 from 1 PW2 & a 3.6kW panels and be 95% reliant on the solar, unless your commute is like 20 miles or something and you have no electric heating or air conditioning or dryers, in which case I say maybe. Your location is Long Beach; at least it's not implausible. But there seems to be a fog of unreality around this. Long Beach: long drives on the long freeways? Not with what they said.
Yes, I had solar already, and got two PW2 installed. I'm not the only one.
Thank you Ulmo. My complaint with my Tesla Rep is if he feels I can't apply for my own rebate, then let SGIP reject my application. Don't prevent me from at least trying by not giving me the correct info I need. SGIP says they have several Tesla customers managing their own rebates. Anyway, so amp-hours = capacity??? Okay, if the nominal voltage is on the sticker, please let me know that when you get a chance. I appreciate it. -KPragmatically and practically, Tesla is basically correct, and technically, SGIP is correct. Pick your poison
As I recall, the inside sticker of each battery said their capacity is 14.3kWh (so 14,300 amp hours). Mine is currently slightly over-rated at around 28,800Wh for two batteries (so 14,400Wh), but that fluctuates with time; it's a BMS that guesses the capacity through time and deterioration. I would have to look at the sticker for the nominal battery voltage. Continuous power output of each battery inverter is 5kW, peak is 7kW.
No, they didn't tell the truth. You can't be doing home, X, and 3 from 1 PW2 & a 3.6kW panels and be 95% reliant on the solar, unless your commute is like 20 miles or something and you have no electric heating or air conditioning or dryers, in which case I say maybe. Your location is Long Beach; at least it's not implausible. But there seems to be a fog of unreality around this. Long Beach: long drives on the long freeways? Not with what they said.
Yes, I had solar already, and got two PW2 installed. I'm not the only one.
SoundDaTrumpet
Member
I hope you are aware that applying is a very time consuming endeavour, and may end-up being a 100% academic exercise (aka waste of time). I have one last program requirement remaining to provide, and have uncovered deep resistance from PG&E SGIP (an 11th hour surprise).
The hint I will be providing is your pill "down the rabbit hole." Don't read below this if you aren't willing to swallow the pill.
...
...
[Information is available from selfgenca-->resources-->real-time public report. Use 1:1 info submitted by other successful applications.]
Yeah I know. But at this point, I have nothing to loose and all to gain by going down the path of futility. If I don't get step 2 then I am have to take step 3 with Tesla. But this is why I want to make sure I have the exact information and specification asked for in the application. I didn't expect to have resistance from Tesla as they have nothing to loose or gain by me handling my own rebate.
I'm not sure why applying yourself would change what step you get. My reading is that who submits the application doesn't determine who is considered the developer. Did you see something that implies otherwise? I think Tesla would still be the developer since they hold the contract for installation of the system, thus their developer cap still applies.
SoundDaTrumpet
Member
To my chagrin, I do recall that anyone can submit the application provided you have the developer key (this is something I noted 2016 as well). Being a registered applicant with SGIP, I was emailed that homeowners doing self-installs require a developer key. To obtain a key, you are deemed a "developer" by process. By the definition provided by SGIP for Developer, it speaks to be the holder of the contract for installation. I am not familiar with this terminology "holder of the contract." Can anyone elaborate?
I ask then what is the point of a homeowner developer key unless one is to build their own battery storage system? (or to act as the general contractor and decide who are the subcontactors?)
I believe what is happening is that there is confusion due to the terminology. If you go through the application process for the SGIP rebate, they clearly allow the Homeowner to administrate their own rebate. But for some reason, after you sign up as a homeowner administrating your own rebate, the SGIP now calls you a "Developer" in their terminology. You have to sign up to be a developer but this is a straight forward process and many homeowners have received this status. Obviously I am not the same type of Developer as Tesla. They are actually a technological developer whereas I am merely a rebate administrator. So I think that is where the confusion is. Filling out the rebate as a homeowner is long and laborious process. But the application doesn't specifically ask for any information from Tesla other than the name of the storage device manufacturer (Tesla, LGChem, Sonnen etc.) and in a separate page it requests the name and contract license of the installer. Here again, doesn't necessarily have to be Tesla. The section of the application where it get's difficult is when it asks for specific manufacture's data. This is where Tesla is unwilling to help. If they were to help and provide the technical data, the assumption is that the SGIP rebate would be awarded to the homeowner who self applied at the current step. Which at the moment is Step 2....except for the large manufacturers such as Tesla, who have reached their allotted amount of rebate funds that they are allowed to have and issue. So they are waiting for Step 3.
Ulmo
Active Member
I don't know either, but just what it seems like is I think what you said in the italicized part is possibly what it's getting at. I know a lot of people who build their own stuff, being a construction worker myself. I've also worked for those who do. From my point of view, it's very common.
Delays, due to filling out the app wrong, due to inexperience. Tesla/SolarCity also filled it out wrong in my case, but they got a lot further with it than I would have gotten by myself, so I didn't really mind overall. These apps are very difficult to fill out right every time. Also, the step 1 basically filled up instantly, so there's basically not much room for error.
The reason that it is so confusing for me is that the SPIG representatives are giving me their interpretation of the rules They are the ones who are handing out the rebates. So I tend to take their interpretation of the policy over Tesla. But we shall see...
Hengist
Member
And, still waiting, waiting, waiting. They promise info and never deliver. They say to expect a call on Friday for a firm install date, then a week after that Friday, still no call, no information. Terrible, aweful, very bad communications. They don't treat this like a serious part of the business. I'm tempted to bring up at next stockholder call.
SoundDaTrumpet
Member
Jeffgtx, visit this page for real time updates:
https://www.selfgenca.com/report/public/
I hope this helps.
https://www.selfgenca.com/report/public/
I hope this helps.
Brovane
Member
I am still waiting. I am SCE territory and SCE in almost 4-months has managed to move 1 SGIP application past the technical review.
I talked to Swell Energy last week and they told me that SCE will start moving the applications faster. Maybe that means they will approve 2 applications every 4-months instead of 1.
That's what I was wondering. Looking at the realtime report and the weekly report, it seems as though no one in SCE step 2 has gotten beyond the Technical Review. I would have hoped step 1 rebates were a little further along but if so I can't see it. PG&E seems to be making more progress.
Hi,
I scheduled to install 2 PW2s in a couple of weeks (no solar). Much to my embarassment, i still don't seem to get pretty basic things. I will appreciate any help with clarification.
(1) Legal:
(1a) Solar City sent me PGE's agreement today with a bunch of previously undisclosed information in it (Generating facility interconnection agreement). They say i have to maintain an isurance, marked it seems up to 200k per instance. They request sending insurance confirmation back to them. What is this? A special kind of insurance, or the home owner's insurance covers it? What's the additional cost of this?
(1b) they say they may bill me for interconnecting. Why? I just install an electric device behind the main panel which is not going to pump anything back. This is just a load shifting and backup device. If there's additional recurring financial burden to be added to this, this will eat up any load shift benefits, which are already barely worth worrying about aside from my purely altruistic motivations behind electrification of the energy industries.
Bottom line, i am not sure what they expect me to do and what an additional cost to me might be. Is this somehow connected to SGIP rebate? SC can't immediately explain it to me (at this point). Although i know this must be standard for any Solar install though, so I am sure somebody here could give me a clue what they expect me to do.
(2) Technical -- load shifting. As i see many people say TOU is still not supported. But the whole premise of my conversation with SC advisers was based on TOU load shifting and they assured me it would be possible. In fact, the SGIP rebate is pre-conditioned on doing that. What exactly is possible and what is not (w.r.t. to simple idea of charging at night, discharging down to backup margin during peak?) Sorry if this was explained before. I tried to read thru the entire thread, but i don't think i found an accessible (to me) explanation ... Thank you for helping a newbie.
I scheduled to install 2 PW2s in a couple of weeks (no solar). Much to my embarassment, i still don't seem to get pretty basic things. I will appreciate any help with clarification.
(1) Legal:
(1a) Solar City sent me PGE's agreement today with a bunch of previously undisclosed information in it (Generating facility interconnection agreement). They say i have to maintain an isurance, marked it seems up to 200k per instance. They request sending insurance confirmation back to them. What is this? A special kind of insurance, or the home owner's insurance covers it? What's the additional cost of this?
(1b) they say they may bill me for interconnecting. Why? I just install an electric device behind the main panel which is not going to pump anything back. This is just a load shifting and backup device. If there's additional recurring financial burden to be added to this, this will eat up any load shift benefits, which are already barely worth worrying about aside from my purely altruistic motivations behind electrification of the energy industries.
Bottom line, i am not sure what they expect me to do and what an additional cost to me might be. Is this somehow connected to SGIP rebate? SC can't immediately explain it to me (at this point). Although i know this must be standard for any Solar install though, so I am sure somebody here could give me a clue what they expect me to do.
(2) Technical -- load shifting. As i see many people say TOU is still not supported. But the whole premise of my conversation with SC advisers was based on TOU load shifting and they assured me it would be possible. In fact, the SGIP rebate is pre-conditioned on doing that. What exactly is possible and what is not (w.r.t. to simple idea of charging at night, discharging down to backup margin during peak?) Sorry if this was explained before. I tried to read thru the entire thread, but i don't think i found an accessible (to me) explanation ... Thank you for helping a newbie.
My understanding is that TOU load shifting will be supported in future software updates.
I believe that the SGIP rebate, however, only applies if you have the ability to generate renewable energy on site (solar PV, wind, or small hydro). The goal of SGIP, as I understand it, is to foster more self-consumption of renewable energy while reducing peak load on the grid.
But they did put me in review for step 2. and it's been in technical review for a while and "conditionally approved". More over, their status review status sheet mentioned above has a lot of installations similar to mine which has battery-only status just as mine.
Interesting! I stand corrected. This motivated me to have another look through the SGIP Handbook, and I see in 5.3 that energy storage projects may be stand-alone. Probably because such projects will still help to reduce grid reliance during peak periods.
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