Performance not getting 310 miles promised

[JeffK]

Because seals, gears and bearings are comparatively stiff and have not settled very well. In ICE vehicles this is more pronounced because of piston friction and more gearing, but should be different from zero even in EVs.

I'm calling hooey on any noticeable difference after 500 miles.

 

[mswlogo]

Just went on a 40 minute trip today. ~ 30 miles including some city but mostly highway. 90% of it was on autopilot driving between 60 and 70 mph. Key points are

- I was using 18 inch wheels but with aero covers off. (Performance Stealth)
- It was raining
- It was 40 degrees F, I had manual defogging on but no heat (Set temperature to 60F, fanspeed to 1, only defogging, no AC, no recycling air). Instead, I used a cigarette lighter heater to heat myself with seat heaters and a sweater. Felt very comfortable inside.
- Did 2-3 of 20-65 accelerations.

Here are the results of my trip. That's 287 miles range.View attachment 366311

You were using heat. But not much.

It would have to display LO or have HVAC be Off to not use any heat.

 

[Glamisduner]

I'm not asking about EPA, I am asking compared to my previous LR RWD M3. Same Driver, different range advertised.

I had another thought. Are you regen braking allot? I found the performance model gets up to speed so quickly I almost always overshoot and let my foot off the throttle. This causes me to regen brake which is bad for efficiency. Try to watch the juice meter while your driving and see if you can avoid regen braking from overshooting the speed limit.

BTW thanks for making me feel better about the P3d- I ended up with

 

[dhanson865]

Then why don't other companies do this? Here's the Mustang comparison for example, almost every single trim gets it's own EPA estimates.

I, for one, would prefer they use estimates that are as accurate as possible and not simply set the number to alleviate some people's unwarranted range anxiety.

Lots of pictures of cars there but not a lot if "every single trim gets it's own EPA estimates"

* 4 of them are 15/25
* 2 of them are 20/28
* 2 of them are 21/31

If every one got it's own estimate had any real value you'd have 8 different numbers and I wouldn't be able to condense it to 3 sets.

 

[dhanson865]

I did recently find this out. I went to Town Fair Tire the other day, the don't offer a winter tire in 235/35/20 so I'm still researching

at that size your option is one tire on tire rack https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...SAS3PLXL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

but if it were me I'd buy 18 or 19 inch wheels for winter use and widen your non summer tire choices.

 

[TheLocNar]

I did ok today with my P3.

 

[SomeJoe7777]

Even though there are fewer parts to break in in EVs, shouldn’t efficiency increase over the first 10,000 to 20,000 miles? It has been my impression that things improve after a while by 5% in EV and up to 10% in ICE compared to new.

You won't get much, if any improvement from gearing and drivetrain break-in.

Tires can improve slightly with use due to the rubber and sidewalls becoming a little more flexible. In my Model S, I saw about 5% better range from mid-life Michelin Primacys than from new Primacys. End-of-life Primacys saw a slight decrease in efficiency, along with a rougher and noisier ride.

 

[Perry]

I did ok today with my P3.

Amazing. Never been able to do that no matter how slow I drive.

 

[JeffK]

I did ok today with my P3.

Because you averaged 26 mph? haha

 

[Dan_LA]

You're driving 75 mph+ you're not going to get close to the rated range. That's all there is to it.

I got it with LR RWD which is same as P3D advertised 310 miles. I understand 280-260 on the cold etc... can't accept 200 miles.

Well after I inflated tires to 44, helped a bit now, not using heater.. I am getting 220miles total.. still not acceptable range to drive like a grandma.

 

[Dan_LA]

Your complaint should be why is the RWD exceeding EPA rating. Not that your Performance is not meeting it. Elon was smart how he spec’d The cars.

20” wheels, cool weather, driving 75+ mph. 327 wh/mi sounds about right.
>> yea, tire was 40 psi cold. Now 44 getting 300 wh/mi ... I need to check on all.

That’s about 23% below EPA rating. I don’t think EPA tested 20” tires because it was an option when tested.
>> How did you calculate % below? EPA is 310 miles, battery is 75kWh, that gives 240 Wh/mi, not? I am doing some math wrong, please correct me. Even though I come from Financial/Banking industry we do make mistakes.

You’ll probably be closer to EPA rating when it warms up.
>> That's what I suspect, gotta wait closer to summer, tires worn out, probably around 5,000 miles if I can get what our friend in Diamond Bar is getting 280 miles, I'm more than fine with it. But 200-220 miles won't cut it, sorry, again Love Tesla, Elon, Spacex, but don't mess with my pocket.

BTW if your temperture is on 68F (AC on or not) and it’s less than 68F outdoors, your heat is ON.
>> Yes, hence I turned off now and will check on that. But I can't control BMS and we can't access that data... which I think plays a big part.. will be checking battery SOC before leaving the car outside.

Your claim of 130 wh/mi on RWD is exceeding EPA rating by 93%. That’s a bit hard to believe for lifetime of 10,000 miles. Guess they accidentally put in a 2020 Roadster battery in it.

>> It's insange, happened many many times when I arrived at work and checked trip consumption. That with AP, summer, 70mph average, carpool lane no traffic, 20miles straight... well first 2 miles downhill.. so that might play some. But yes, I loved that range on the Battery was exactly what I was getting, coming from BMW i3, that's a bless haha...

Anyway, I know folks will say ahn you got P3D what you expect blah, and that Tesla is not doing something illegal etc... but it's shady it is... if proved is the case, which is not good for its Brand with so much naysayers and short-sellers. At the end of the day, just need to get over that this won't be my last car for 10 years haha... and see if any 400-600 miles comes up.. well it does.. just need to hunt extra $250k for the Roadie

 

[Dan_LA]

I have a M3P 18inch wheels no aero caps with 3k miles since September and my lifetime is 245wh/mi I'm in NJ so it has been cold...

Yep, just wasn't happy with 18" LR RWD tires performance... not sure which tires are on yours. Aero cap helps a lot I have to agree, 10k miles and I tested and checked Youtube, I agree is 10-12% increase on range.

 

[Dan_LA]

Same here I get about 140 miles from 100% to 0 SOC with no AC or heater usage. Less if I use climate control.

Holy crap really? That's terrible, probably someone forgot to add half batteries units in yours. Yea check that up.. that's not right. I mean, if was my first tesla... whatever... but I have something to compare, 10k miles driven LR RWD, before swapping to this. Just didn't know I was trading a Range Beast for a Drag Beast haha.. I mean I knew the 3s haha.. anyways... first world problems (is there any post here not?

 

[Dan_LA]

The German configurator shows 30km (~19mi) less for the M3P vs D.

530km (331mi) vs 560km (350mi). Both more optimistic than US EPA. But they indicate a difference between the models.


View attachment 366225

View attachment 366226

That's a clear sign for me Tesla screwed up with misleading advertisement.

 

[Dan_LA]

This has been a very helpful thread for me. I have already gone from 42psi to 45psi and have my next road trip next week. Will be anxious to see the improvement. My experience on my first road trip was close to what Dan is explaining. But I was on I10 and going 80-85 mph.

yep my tires were 40 cold by the time I wrote this post, now 44 I saw 10% improvement already.. although still low for me 220 miles range... but Troy explained above why.. basically he's telling me, go do more things so I can have $250k extra in 2 years haha... then range will be least of worries haha.

Hum.. i "might" have gone that too 80-85 on the 60 freeway but again I wasn't paying attention which I will now this week.

 

[Feathermerchan]

I think Europe has a different rating system. Certainly different rules than the EPA.

Drove about 100 miles today. Mostly freeway (>=80%) ~72 mph then some 60 mph. First half of trip was ~40 degF but car was in garage at about 57 deg F. Second hahl was at about 60 deg F. No heat but seat heater on 1 or 2. Energy use was about 300 Wh/mile. With usable battery capacity capacity of 75 kWh that gives about 250 miles. I have been guessing about 220 miles at frwy speeds so that is pretty close.

At 250 Wh/mile the range would be 300. So that is the efficiency number to shoot for if you want near EPA numbers.
BTW I just bought some tires from Tire Rack on sale.
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...8MXM4PXL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

I know these are 245/45-18 instead of 235 but they'll fit. Now to find some light 18" wheels. I'd like to buy some Tesla Aeros with covers if I could find a set for a decent price. They would have to be modified to fit my car but that is doable.

 

[NathanielHrnblwr]

BTW, multi-quote is a thing.

 

[Dan_LA]

I had another thought. Are you regen braking allot? I found the performance model gets up to speed so quickly I almost always overshoot and let my foot off the throttle. This causes me to regen brake which is bad for efficiency. Try to watch the juice meter while your driving and see if you can avoid regen braking from overshooting the speed limit.

BTW thanks for making me feel better about the P3d- I ended up with

Didn't pay attention on Regen Brakes frequency... but will do, thanks! I hotught Regen would help with Wh/mi? Not?

Not sure I got why I helped you feel happier, glad I did though haha..

 

[Dan_LA]

I think Europe has a different rating system. Certainly different rules than the EPA.

Drove about 100 miles today. Mostly freeway (>=80%) ~72 mph then some 60 mph. First half of trip was ~40 degF but car was in garage at about 57 deg F. Second hahl was at about 60 deg F. No heat but seat heater on 1 or 2. Energy use was about 300 Wh/mile. With usable battery capacity capacity of 75 kWh that gives about 250 miles. I have been guessing about 220 miles at frwy speeds so that is pretty close.

At 250 Wh/mile the range would be 300. So that is the efficiency number to shoot for if you want near EPA numbers.
BTW I just bought some tires from Tire Rack on sale.
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tire...8MXM4PXL&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes

I know these are 245/45-18 instead of 235 but they'll fit. Now to find some light 18" wheels. I'd like to buy some Tesla Aeros with covers if I could find a set for a decent price. They would have to be modified to fit my car but that is doable.

Thanks for sharing your experience... I am assuming your wheels are 20"? Yea I drove 52 miles so far... and is showing average 305 Wh/Mi, due to tire pressure from 40 to 44... will be checking this week how it goes now that I have more data from the Forum... Really appreciate everyone inputs here.

 

[Dan_LA]

BTW, multi-quote is a thing.

haha I think I did 1 time by accident... how do I do that? sorry if sounds spammy or needy.. that's the last of my intentions here. But rather sharing my experience and checking others experiences...

Oh so I see there is a + Quote and when I click says Multi Quote... is that? Then I click reply will reply all quotes? Thanks.