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The trade surplus China runs vs. the U.S. is mostly "natural" according to Krugman (who got a Nobel for international trade macroeconomics), and the Trumpian sabre rattling is mostly misplaced:


Last year US goods imports from China were $539 billion, US goods exports $120 billion. That's 4.5 to 1. Why so much asymmetry? I think 4 reasons: Hong Kong, macroeconomics, value-added, and oil.​

Krugman's argument is that much of the U.S. China trade imbalance is composed of these factors:
  • Hong-Kong is an importing facility that is to a large part Chinese imports,
  • Another large chunk of Chinese surplus is the iPhone style value add: China imports parts worth $200, assembles it as $50 contract work for Apple and exports a $1,000 iPhone (extremely simplified numbers). What looks like $750 of export surplus is an optical illusion, it is Apple who keeps most of that money, China keeps ~$50 for assembly labor and did not apply tariffs on Apple exports before the trade war. Apple revenue in 2018 was $258 billion, and U.S. sales were only ~$70 billion - and Apple is only one of the U.S. companies using China as a remote factory.
  • "the US runs overall trade deficit, with imports 1.5 times exports. China runs overall surplus, with imports only 0.8 exports. On some sort of gravity-ish story, this suggests ratio "should" be around 2."
  • China needs to import a lot of oil, which means it runs a big deficit with oil exporters - and needs to balance it with a similar surplus with other countries such as the U.S.. In 2018 China's crude oil imports were $239 billion.
Understanding the Chinese trade imbalance with the U.S. requires a lot of nuance - but nuance is lost under Trumpian gaslighting...
One nuance you neglected to mention is that Krugman is solidly on the left, progressive even.

I stopped reading his columns years ago, once it became clear to me just how much he allows his politics to skew his opinion pieces.

No offense, but it’s the same reason I usually skip over your political posts. I really appreciate your other, thoughtful analyses though.

Where is IP appropriation in that list? It’s ‘free’ so it doesn’t factor into the balance? Presumably it matters otherwise it wouldn’t be a sticking point for the Chinese in the negotiations.
 
One nuance you neglected to mention is that Krugman is solidly on the left, progressive even.

I stopped reading his columns years ago, once it became clear to me just how much he allows his politics to skew his opinion pieces.

No offense, but it’s the same reason I usually skip over your political posts. I really appreciate your other, thoughtful analyses though.
Krugman is solidly neo-liberal. Not left or progressive. Remember he supported Hillary over both Obama and Bernie.

Economics is definitely something that is closely tied to politics. Not just Krugman - but every economist. Afterall one major aspect of politics is economic ideology. So how can politics & economics be not connected ? Remember this when you read opinion by *any* economist.
 
One nuance you neglected to mention is that Krugman is solidly on the left, progressive even.

As long as his analysis is better than that of others this does not matter - and his track record is very good:


Or do facts have a liberal bias? ;)


I stopped reading his columns years ago, once it became clear to me just how much he allows his politics to skew his opinion pieces.

Please link to any specific Krugman column where his political views are invalidating his professional opinion as a Nobel laureate economist.

I know about one such mistake Krugman made, out of hundreds of articles: in 2016 on election night he predicted a market crash and recession - that was a mistake he corrected three days later.

(I think we all should grant Krugman, who is Jewish, a single emotional lapse in judgement when a white nationalist gets elected the President of the United States...)
 
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As long as his analysis is better than that of others this does not matter - and his track record is very good:


Or do facts have a liberal bias? ;)




Please link to any specific Krugman column where his political views are invalidating his professional opinion as a Nobel laureate economist.

I know about one such mistake Krugman made, out of hundreds of articles: in 2016 on election night he predicted a market crash and recession - that was a mistake he corrected three days later.

(I think we all should grant Krugman, who is Jewish, a single emotional lapse in judgement when a white nationalist gets elected the President of the United States...)

That's easy. When he supported universal healthcare for most of his professional career as a columnist only to flip-flop to support Hillary's position in 2016 against Bernie (he wanted to be on Hillary's cabinet) and then back again today.

Krugman Recants On Healthcare; The Left Is Apoplectic

There are other examples on where he flip-flops on deficits in an 8 week span once Trump won the presidency.

Opinion | Time to Borrow

“So what should [Hillary Clinton] do to boost America’s economy, which is doing better than most of the world but is still falling far short of where it should be? There are, of course, many ways our economic policy could be improved. But the most important thing we need is sharply increased public investment…How should we pay for this investment? We shouldn’t–not now, or any time soon. Right now there is an overwhelming case for more government borrowing.”

Opinion | Deficits Matter Again

Krugman is a political hack. Whatever economic bona-fides he had have been thrown away in support of the neo-liberal establishment.
 
Krugman is solidly neo-liberal.

Huh, Krugman's policy views are almost the opposite of "neoliberalism":

Neoliberalism - Wikipedia

Neoliberalism or neo-liberalism is the 20th-century resurgence of 19th-century ideas associated with laissez-faire economic liberalism and free marketcapitalism.

While it is most often associated with such ideas, the defining features of neoliberalism in both thought and practice have been the subject of substantial scholarly discourse.

These ideas include economic liberalization policies such as privatization, austerity, deregulation, free trade and reductions in government spending in order to increase the role of the private sector in the economy and society.​

Krugman's policy preferences are solidly Keynesian: against privatization, austerity, deregulation and free flow of capital.

Krugman is, within reason, for free trade and against tariffs - as is Trump ...

But more importantly, Krugman goes to great length to separate his policy preferences from his economic analysis - and has numerous times offered economic analysis that didn't support liberal talking points of the day.

So is the China argument I cited free of policy preferences: he listed easily verifiable facts about China's trade patterns.
 
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That's easy. When he supported universal healthcare for most of his professional career as a columnist only to flip-flop to support Hillary's position in 2016 against Bernie (he wanted to be on Hillary's cabinet) and then back again today.

Krugman Recants On Healthcare; The Left Is Apoplectic

That's policy recommendations - not economic analysis. (You are free to change your mind about which policy works best - in fact I think orthodoxy and unwavering ideological dogma are a failing, not a virtue.)

There are other examples on where he flip-flops on deficits in an 8 week span once Trump won the presidency.

Opinion | Time to Borrow

“So what should [Hillary Clinton] do to boost America’s economy, which is doing better than most of the world but is still falling far short of where it should be? There are, of course, many ways our economic policy could be improved. But the most important thing we need is sharply increased public investment…How should we pay for this investment? We shouldn’t–not now, or any time soon. Right now there is an overwhelming case for more government borrowing.”

Opinion | Deficits Matter Again

I don't see any flip-flop: the utility of deficits depends on the level of unemployment: deficits while there's high unemployment are beneficial, but they are harmful (inflationary) when the economy is near full employment.

Krugman's views about deficits have been remarkably consistent during the years.
 
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That's policy recommendations - not economic analysis. (You are free to change your mind about which policy works best - in fact I think orthodoxy and unwavering ideological dogma are a failing, not a virtue.)



I don't see any flip-flop: the utility of deficits depends on the level of unemployment: deficits while there's high unemployment are beneficial, but they are harmful (inflationary) when the economy is near full employment.

Krugman's views about deficits have been remarkably consistent during the years.

It was obvious he changed his policy on universal healthcare based on his support of a specific candidate, not on any fundamental economic view.

His change in deficits was within EIGHT weeks before and after the election based on who won.

He has changed his opinion on minimum wage from what he wrote in his economic text book to what is politically correct today.

Krugman Contra Krugman on the Minimum Wage? | HuffPost
 
That's easy. When he supported universal healthcare for most of his professional career as a columnist only to flip-flop to support Hillary's position in 2016 against Bernie (he wanted to be on Hillary's cabinet) and then back again today.

Krugman Recants On Healthcare; The Left Is Apoplectic

There are other examples on where he flip-flops on deficits in an 8 week span once Trump won the presidency.

Opinion | Time to Borrow

“So what should [Hillary Clinton] do to boost America’s economy, which is doing better than most of the world but is still falling far short of where it should be? There are, of course, many ways our economic policy could be improved. But the most important thing we need is sharply increased public investment…How should we pay for this investment? We shouldn’t–not now, or any time soon. Right now there is an overwhelming case for more government borrowing.”

Opinion | Deficits Matter Again

Krugman is a political hack. Whatever economic bona-fides he had have been thrown away in support of the neo-liberal establishment.

Krugman is the ultimate tool.
 
As long as his analysis is better than that of others this does not matter - and his track record is very good:


Or do facts have a liberal bias? ;)




Please link to any specific Krugman column where his political views are invalidating his professional opinion as a Nobel laureate economist.

I know about one such mistake Krugman made, out of hundreds of articles: in 2016 on election night he predicted a market crash and recession - that was a mistake he corrected three days later.

(I think we all should grant Krugman, who is Jewish, a single emotional lapse in judgement when a white nationalist gets elected the President of the United States...)
Nice try. As you know, I wasn’t calling out Krugman at least not beyond lacking the objectivity I would like to see. That’s why I don’t read him anymore.

Rather I was merely pointing out the irony of your habit of elision as you cast shade regarding nuance in that particular post.

But as I do still read the NYT (somewhat difficult as it triggers almost as much eye-rolling in me as the WSJ), I really don’t need or care for the politics here unless it really is pertinent.

FWIW, I hold the politicians at either end of the political spectrum in equally high regard. ;)
 
That's easy. When he supported universal healthcare for most of his professional career as a columnist only to flip-flop to support Hillary's position in 2016 against Bernie (he wanted to be on Hillary's cabinet) and then back again today.

Krugman Recants On Healthcare; The Left Is Apoplectic

It was obvious he changed his policy on universal healthcare based on his support of a specific candidate, not on any fundamental economic view.

That's plain out false, Krugman supported Obamacare during Obama's first term, way before Clinton became a candidate vs. Sanders:

The Forbes article you cited doesn't survive basic fact checking...

But all of this is beside the point: you might not agree with his policy preferences and political views - but so far you have not been able to link to a single Krugman piece with a major mistake that Nobel laureate Paul Krugman made in economic analysis.

Not a single one - all of the citations so far were attacking his political views.
 
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That's plain out false, Krugman supported Obamacare during Obama's first term, way before Clinton became a candidate vs. Sanders:

The Forbes article you cited doesn't survive basic fact checking...

But all of this is beside the point: you might not agree with his policy preferences and political views - but so far you have not been able to link to a single Krugman piece with a major mistake that Nobel laureate Paul Krugman made in economic analysis.

Not a single one - all of the citations so far were attacking his political views.

I've never said he's a bad economist. He's proven to be brilliant on many occasions. But he has let politics blind his economics and that's a problem to me.

He did made a mistake on minimum wage as I pointed out earlier.
 
That's plain out false, Krugman supported Obamacare during Obama's first term, way before Clinton became a candidate vs. Sanders:

Opinion | Obamacare’s Secret Success
The Forbes article you cited doesn't survive basic fact checking...

So the tally so far:
  • "Krugman flip-flopped on healthcare": false
  • "Krugman flip-flopped on deficits": false
  • Number of TMC comments discussing the numerous facts cited in Krugman's China trade deficit analysis: zero.
Krugman is being treated in conservative circles similarly to how Elon Musk is treated: false claims, innuendo, smear attacks and character attacks.
 
I've never said he's a bad economist. He's proven to be brilliant on many occasions. But he has let politics blind his economics and that's a problem to me.

He did made a mistake on minimum wage as I pointed out earlier.

Even the "Krugman flip-flopped on minimum wage" argument doesn't stand up to scrutiny - what happened is that in 2015 Krugman changed his opinion about the topic, based on new data.

He clearly spelled this out in the following article, and he wasn't hiding that he had a different opinion before:

Opinion | Liberals and Wages

"Until the Card-Krueger study, most economists, myself included, assumed that raising the minimum wage would have a clear negative effect on employment. But they found, if anything, a positive effect. Their result has since been confirmed using data from many episodes. There’s just no evidence that raising the minimum wage costs jobs, at least when the starting point is as low as it is in modern America."​

The study that changed is mind was:


The Krugman quotes you linked to were before that study - his new opinion was afterwards.

Since then he has been consistently in favor of minimum wage rises up to a certain level - and he consistently argued that the current federal minimum wage is way too low, even if you disagree about what level you want to raise it to.

So this episode too is actually proof of Paul Krugman's professional integrity: instead of rigidly, dogmatically, ideologically insisting on his earlier opinion, he changed his views based on new data and wrote an article about it.

So the fact checking score is 3:0 so far - please take Krugman's analysis about China seriously, international trade macro is his strongest field.
 
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Huh, Krugman's policy views are almost the opposite of "neoliberalism":
The meaning of neoliberalism - as used in the US - has changed over the years. He is solidly behind the Clinton-Blair-Bush-Obama "consensus" of Globalization.

ps :

The neoliberalism we are talking about is really a reaction to Regan by Dems. It led to "blue dog" Dems like Clinton taking over power in Democratic party and they still hold the power.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...nifesto/21cf41ca-e60e-404e-9a66-124592c9f70d/

Recently even neoliberals are having second thoughts.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...ocrat-explains-why-its-time-give-left-chance/
 
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Paul Krugman on Tesla yesterday:

If you’re one of those people who bought bitcoin or another cryptocurrency near its peak last fall, you’ve lost a lot of money. Is it any consolation to know that you would have lost a similar amount if you had bought Tesla stock instead?

OK, probably not. Still, Tesla stock’s plunge is an opportunity to talk about what makes businesses successful in the information age. And in the end, Tesla and bitcoin may have more in common than you think.



It’s natural to attribute Tesla’s recent decline — which is, to be sure, part of a general fall in tech stocks, but an exceptionally steep example — to Elon Musk’s purchase of Twitter and the reputational self-immolation that followed. Indeed, given what we’ve seen of Musk’s behaviour, I wouldn’t trust him to feed my cat, let alone run a major corporation. Furthermore, Tesla sales have surely depended at least in part on the perception that Musk himself is a cool guy. Who, aside from MAGA types who probably wouldn’t have bought Teslas anyway, sees him that way now?

On the other hand, as someone who has spent much of his professional life in academia, I’m familiar with the phenomenon of people who are genuinely brilliant in some areas but utter fools in other domains. For all I know, Musk is or was a highly effective leader at Tesla and SpaceX.



Even if that’s the case, though, it’s hard to explain the huge valuation the market put on Tesla before the drop, or even its current value. After all, to be that valuable Tesla would have to generate huge profits, not just for a few years but in a way that could be expected to continue for many years to come.



Now, some technology companies have indeed been long-term moneymaking machines. Apple and Microsoft still top the list of the most profitable US corporations some four decades after the rise of personal computers.



But we more or less understand the durability of the dominance of Apple and Microsoft, and it’s hard to see how Tesla could ever achieve something similar, no matter how brilliant its leadership. Apple and Microsoft benefit from strong network externalities — loosely speaking, everyone uses their products because everyone else uses their products.

In the case of Microsoft, the traditional story has been that businesses continued to buy the company’s software, even when it was panned by many people in the tech world, because it was what they were already set up to use: Products like Word and Excel may not have been great, but everyone within a given company and in others it did business with was set up to use them, had IT departments that knew how to deal with them, and so on. These days Microsoft has a better reputation than it used to, but as far as I can tell its market strength still reflects comfort and corporate habit rather than a perception of excellence.

Advertisement



Apple’s story is different in the details — more about individual users than institutions, more about physical products than about software alone. And Apple was widely considered cool, which I don’t think Microsoft ever was. But at an economic level it’s similar. I can attest from personal experience that once you’re in the iPhone/iPad/MacBook ecosystem, you won’t give up on its convenience unless offered something a lot better.



Similar stories can be told about a few other companies, such as Amazon, with its distribution infrastructure.

The question is: Where are the powerful network externalities in the electric vehicle business?

Electric cars may well be the future of personal transportation. In fact, they had better be, since electrification of everything, powered by renewable energy, is the only plausible way to avoid climate catastrophe. But it’s hard to see what would give Tesla a long-term lock on the electric vehicle business.



I’m not talking about how great Teslas are or aren’t right now; I’m not a car enthusiast (I should have one of those bumper stickers that say, “My other car is also junk”), so I can’t judge. But the lesson from Apple and Microsoft is that to be extremely profitable in the long run, a tech company needs to establish a market position that holds up even when the time comes, as it always does, that people aren’t all that excited about its products

So what would make that happen for Tesla? You could imagine a world in which dedicated Tesla hookups were the only widely available charging stations, or in which Teslas were the only electric cars mechanics knew how to fix. But with major auto manufacturers moving into the electric vehicle business, the possibility of such a world has already vanished. In fact, I’d argue that the Inflation Reduction Act, with its strong incentives for electrification, will actually hurt Tesla. Why? Because it will quickly make electric cars so common that Teslas no longer seem special.



In short, electric vehicle production just doesn’t look like a network externality business. Actually, you know what does? Twitter, a platform many of us still use because so many other people use it. But Twitter usage is apparently hard to monetise, not to mention the fact that Musk appears set on finding out just how much degradation of the user experience it will take to break its network externalities and drive away the clientele.

Which brings us back to the question of why Tesla was ever worth so much. The answer, as best as I can tell, is that investors fell in love with a storyline about a brilliant, cool innovator, despite the absence of a good argument about how this guy, even if he really was who he appeared to be, could have found a long-lived money machine.



And as I said, there’s a parallel here with bitcoin. Despite years of effort, nobody has yet managed to find any serious use for cryptocurrency other than money laundering. But prices nonetheless soared on the hype, and are still being sustained by a hard-core group of true believers. Something similar surely happened with Tesla, even though the company does actually make useful things.



I guess we’ll eventually see what happens. But I definitely won’t trust Elon Musk with my cat.
 
Paul Krugman on Tesla yesterday:

If you’re one of those people who bought bitcoin or another cryptocurrency near its peak last fall, you’ve lost a lot of money. Is it any consolation to know that you would have lost a similar amount if you had bought Tesla stock instead?

OK, probably not. Still, Tesla stock’s plunge is an opportunity to talk about what makes businesses successful in the information age. And in the end, Tesla and bitcoin may have more in common than you think.



It’s natural to attribute Tesla’s recent decline — which is, to be sure, part of a general fall in tech stocks, but an exceptionally steep example — to Elon Musk’s purchase of Twitter and the reputational self-immolation that followed. Indeed, given what we’ve seen of Musk’s behaviour, I wouldn’t trust him to feed my cat, let alone run a major corporation. Furthermore, Tesla sales have surely depended at least in part on the perception that Musk himself is a cool guy. Who, aside from MAGA types who probably wouldn’t have bought Teslas anyway, sees him that way now?

On the other hand, as someone who has spent much of his professional life in academia, I’m familiar with the phenomenon of people who are genuinely brilliant in some areas but utter fools in other domains. For all I know, Musk is or was a highly effective leader at Tesla and SpaceX.



Even if that’s the case, though, it’s hard to explain the huge valuation the market put on Tesla before the drop, or even its current value. After all, to be that valuable Tesla would have to generate huge profits, not just for a few years but in a way that could be expected to continue for many years to come.



Now, some technology companies have indeed been long-term moneymaking machines. Apple and Microsoft still top the list of the most profitable US corporations some four decades after the rise of personal computers.



But we more or less understand the durability of the dominance of Apple and Microsoft, and it’s hard to see how Tesla could ever achieve something similar, no matter how brilliant its leadership. Apple and Microsoft benefit from strong network externalities — loosely speaking, everyone uses their products because everyone else uses their products.

In the case of Microsoft, the traditional story has been that businesses continued to buy the company’s software, even when it was panned by many people in the tech world, because it was what they were already set up to use: Products like Word and Excel may not have been great, but everyone within a given company and in others it did business with was set up to use them, had IT departments that knew how to deal with them, and so on. These days Microsoft has a better reputation than it used to, but as far as I can tell its market strength still reflects comfort and corporate habit rather than a perception of excellence.

Advertisement



Apple’s story is different in the details — more about individual users than institutions, more about physical products than about software alone. And Apple was widely considered cool, which I don’t think Microsoft ever was. But at an economic level it’s similar. I can attest from personal experience that once you’re in the iPhone/iPad/MacBook ecosystem, you won’t give up on its convenience unless offered something a lot better.



Similar stories can be told about a few other companies, such as Amazon, with its distribution infrastructure.

The question is: Where are the powerful network externalities in the electric vehicle business?

Electric cars may well be the future of personal transportation. In fact, they had better be, since electrification of everything, powered by renewable energy, is the only plausible way to avoid climate catastrophe. But it’s hard to see what would give Tesla a long-term lock on the electric vehicle business.



I’m not talking about how great Teslas are or aren’t right now; I’m not a car enthusiast (I should have one of those bumper stickers that say, “My other car is also junk”), so I can’t judge. But the lesson from Apple and Microsoft is that to be extremely profitable in the long run, a tech company needs to establish a market position that holds up even when the time comes, as it always does, that people aren’t all that excited about its products

So what would make that happen for Tesla? You could imagine a world in which dedicated Tesla hookups were the only widely available charging stations, or in which Teslas were the only electric cars mechanics knew how to fix. But with major auto manufacturers moving into the electric vehicle business, the possibility of such a world has already vanished. In fact, I’d argue that the Inflation Reduction Act, with its strong incentives for electrification, will actually hurt Tesla. Why? Because it will quickly make electric cars so common that Teslas no longer seem special.



In short, electric vehicle production just doesn’t look like a network externality business. Actually, you know what does? Twitter, a platform many of us still use because so many other people use it. But Twitter usage is apparently hard to monetise, not to mention the fact that Musk appears set on finding out just how much degradation of the user experience it will take to break its network externalities and drive away the clientele.

Which brings us back to the question of why Tesla was ever worth so much. The answer, as best as I can tell, is that investors fell in love with a storyline about a brilliant, cool innovator, despite the absence of a good argument about how this guy, even if he really was who he appeared to be, could have found a long-lived money machine.



And as I said, there’s a parallel here with bitcoin. Despite years of effort, nobody has yet managed to find any serious use for cryptocurrency other than money laundering. But prices nonetheless soared on the hype, and are still being sustained by a hard-core group of true believers. Something similar surely happened with Tesla, even though the company does actually make useful things.



I guess we’ll eventually see what happens. But I definitely won’t trust Elon Musk with my cat.

There was a very good reason Alfred Nobel did not include economics in its prize list. Its later posthumous addition unfortunately led to quacks like Krugman getting unjustifiably perceived as having a coherent chain of thoughts.
 
The entire text is so much bullshit. Very little concrete than can be falsified in the future, just putting words together making it sounds like he is saying something. Start with the conclusion, then ever justifying it by surely it must be that way.

Even if that’s the case, though, it’s hard to explain the huge valuation the market put on Tesla before the drop, or even its current value. After all, to be that valuable Tesla would have to generate huge profits, not just for a few years but in a way that could be expected to continue for many years to come.

So it's hard to explain... But if they generate huge profits for many years, then yeah that would explain it. Which is what the market is betting on. So hard to explain!

But we more or less understand the durability of the dominance of Apple and Microsoft, and it’s hard to see how Tesla could ever achieve something similar, no matter how brilliant its leadership.

Hard to see. Unless you actually try to see it. HW3, Dojo, 4680, FSD, Gigacasting, octovalve etc etc. Must be only the leadership fooling investors. Not the engineering team making huge innovations much faster than the competition.

So what would make that happen for Tesla? You could imagine a world in which dedicated Tesla hookups were the only widely available charging stations, or in which Teslas were the only electric cars mechanics knew how to fix. But with major auto manufacturers moving into the electric vehicle business, the possibility of such a world has already vanished. In fact, I’d argue that the Inflation Reduction Act, with its strong incentives for electrification, will actually hurt Tesla. Why? Because it will quickly make electric cars so common that Teslas no longer seem special.

Already vannished you say. Which figures support the conclusion? Quickly make electrical cars so common, how? Who will build them? Where will they get the batteries? So if VW somehow magically makes 10M ID4, Tesla will no longer seem special? With FSD, with OTA, with gigacasting, with octovalve, with storage, with solar, with optimus etc?

And as I said, there’s a parallel here with bitcoin. Despite years of effort, nobody has yet managed to find any serious use for cryptocurrency other than money laundering. But prices nonetheless soared on the hype, and are still being sustained by a hard-core group of true believers. Something similar surely happened with Tesla, even though the company does actually make useful things.


Surely...

Over and over he just states his contrarian position, the market is wrong etc. The reasoning? Surely it must be that way. Surely he is an idiot.