Model S First Drive Reviews

[brianman]

Why would anyone criticize anyone who shares an opinion?

I'll bite. A lot of people do that.

Having the same opinion for different reasons is where a lot of long debates come from, even on this forum.

Nor do they laden it with political overtones, many of which are completely irrelevant, regardless of your political orientation. If I want unbiased political news, I'll watch CNN or Fox*, not buy Automobile.

*that's a joke

I do find it amusing that people can't help inserting a dig into posts like this. It hurts your point rather than helps. Tagging "joke" doesn't fix it. It reminds me of "with all due respect, I don't respect you at all."

 

[brianman]

The point of my editorial letter was that I wanted objectivity.

I think others have hit it on the head though: we need objective, unbiased REVIEWS of the CAR, not political and personal opinions about the company and their employees. Beyond that, I couldn't care less about the company or persons behind it. I just want some infos to cling to

While objective evaluation of the vehicles is critical and the primary reason I tend to read the reviews, it's not the only reason. While slant is a potential problem, opinions about the viability of the company delivering the vehicle are definitely fair game. When you buy a vehicle, you're investing in the company surviving so that you can have it serviced.

 

[spatterso911]

While objective evaluation of the vehicles is critical and the primary reason I tend to read the reviews, it's not the only reason. While slant is a potential problem, opinions about the viability of the company delivering the vehicle are definitely fair game. When you buy a vehicle, you're investing in the company surviving so that you can have it serviced.

All true, but let's save the defense for those that deserve defending. Perhaps those that exhibit a viable opposing viewpoint. I'm all for that. The Automobile article is just plain inflammatory...

 

[brianman]

Here's what I took away from the AutomobileMag.com article...

Status Update: 2013 Tesla Model S

2013 Tesla Model S

Wrong model year.

Takeaway: Editorial is not as nitpicking about fact-checking as some of us.

heavily subsidized Tesla Motors

What's a Subsidized Loan?
"Subsidized loans are loans for which the borrower does not pay interest."
Tesla gets loan approval from US Department of Energy | Press Releases | Tesla Motors
"Tesla Motors has received approval for about $465 million in low-interest loans from the US Department of Energy"

The article is using "subsidized" either incorrectly or in a way that probably deserves at least a footnote.

Takeaway: Article is editorially soft on either journalistic ethics or quality, or both.

began delivering in small quantities on June 22

Technically incorrect as Founders vehicles 1 and 2 were delivered prior to that.
Technically incorrect even if you exclude all founders vehicles, since they didn't deliver any non-Founder vehicles on June 22.

Takeaway: Editorial is not as nitpicking about fact-checking as some of us.

it's not over styling but the the half-billion dollars in federal loans, state tax breaks, and bargain-priced factory space that Tesla has obtained.

Typo "the the" should have been caught by editorial review.
Sentence structure makes it sound like Tesla obtained "state tax breaks". This is news to me, and a footnote would be great so that I could learn more.

Takeaway: Opportunity to provide information lost (Tesla-specific "state tax breaks") or incorrect implication. Both are editorial "opportunities for improvement."

So...necessary.

Takeaway: I didn't read this paragraph as negative towards Tesla. Actually, I read it as a positive -- that Staubel is aware of the political and economic climate. It's placement is a bit odd for my tastes but not "wrong."

Neverthelesss...party.

Takeaway: The love of metaphors that only have 1 dimension of relation with the original topic made this paragraph completely useless to me as a reader.

Starry-eyed at the prospect of being the first Model S owners in their chapters of the Sierra Club, they had put down deposits of $40,000 and waited for their Signature models, priced at $97,900.

I'm fairly confident they have different price tags, given that at least one of them doesn't have a panoramic roof. Further, the "detail" of the tax credit was completely omitted.
Takeaway: Lazy journalism, but not really skewed for/against Tesla.

noting the low seating position

Here, I actually want an opinion. Was it good low or bad low? A review should at least offer an opinion of the first thing they considered worthy of observing when sitting in the car.
Takeaway: Are they reviewing the car or just jotting down the specifications?

sports-bar-sized central touchscreen

No human-fitting sports bar is 17" in any dimension. No self-respecting sports bar would have 17" screens for anything but register-type activities.
Takeaway: Nothing useful as a reader.

With ... ; ... mph.

Takeaway: Editorial nit -- semicolon misuse.

Frankly, we didn't notice anything exceptional about the cornering in comparison to, say, an Audi A7 or Fisker Karma;

Takeaway: <What other TMC posters have said eloquently.>

After our sampling, we see the opposite happening.

Takeaway: Assertion with no backing information. Useless. At minimum this needs a footnote to elaborate.

And what happens to Tesla when the first 10,000 acolytes receive their servings?

Takeaway: I'm not sure the author or editor know what acolyte means.


Overall takeaway: Lazy blog format with low signal, high noise. Less than a dime a dozen.


Edit: no idea where the thumbs up icon came from or how to remove it.

 

[Doug_G]

2013 Tesla Model S - Status Update - Automobile Magazine


I didn't think the karma cornered particularly well. I'll need to check this.

I've driven a Karma recently. The Model S is far more nimble in corners. The Karma doesn't feel heavy until you turn a corner, then it's a bit of a boat.

 

[vfx]

I've driven a Karma recently. The Model S is far more nimble in corners. The Karma doesn't feel heavy until you turn a corner, then it's a bit of a boat.

By the way Doug_G I would have driven exactly like you.

 

[Lyon]

I've driven a Karma recently. The Model S is far more nimble in corners. The Karma doesn't feel heavy until you turn a corner, then it's a bit of a boat.

That's the same thing that I heard from EVERY other review of the Karma until the asshat from Automobile said that it handled like an A7 and the Model S. After riding in the Model S I know that it handles amazingly so the equation just isn't adding up. I have no basis for comparison with the other two (A7 or Karma) but all the credible things I've read about them tell me that they're night and day different from each other... especially when it comes to handling.

 

[Zextraterrestrial]

I've driven a Karma recently. The Model S is far more nimble in corners. The Karma doesn't feel heavy until you turn a corner, then it's a bit of a boat.

that just sounds scary to me. The S felt really nice going through the sweeping onramp to NB 880 while pushing the TC just a touch


To anyone who has driven either:
How is a fully loaded A7 or S7 compared to the Model S performance? they're not as good, right?

 

[CapitalistOppressor]

that just sounds scary to me. The S felt really nice going through the sweeping onramp to NB 880 while pushing the TC just a touch


To anyone who has driven either:
How is a fully loaded A7 or S7 compared to the Model S performance? they're not as good, right?

Depends on which Model S model you compare it to. Based on MSRP the closest Model S to the A7 is the base Model S with the 60kWh battery. The A7 has a 0-60 time of 5.4 seconds which will handily beat the 5.9 second time of the Model S in a straight line drag race. Racing on a road course, the 60kWh Model S can probably hang with or beat the A7 if the course is especially tight, thanks to a much lower Cg and ideal weight distribution.

Based on a 5 year total cost of ownership calculation, the 85kWh base Model S is in the same league as the A7 despite retailing for $10k more. You will save at least that much in gas and maintenance. With a 5.6 second 0-60 it wont be embarrassed in a drag race with the A7. On a road course the base 85kWh Model S is a clear winner vs the A7, thanks to superior handling.

At $80k the Audi S7 is a direct competitor with the $79,900 Model S Performance. In that matchup the S7 will be hopelessly crushed, it's women sold into slavery and its children left to cry in the fields.

The S7 is a very nice car, has a 0-60 time of just 4.9 seconds and great handling. Outside of styling it just isn't in the same league as the Model S Performance. The Model S Performance is a better match for the $110k Panamera, which it will likely spank on a road course. But at least the Panamera will keep up in a straight line.

 

[AustinPowers]

..aaand there it is:

...

TM, this forum tried to tell ya...

True. As great as the Model S may be, map pockets are useful even if you don't use maps at all. Like the glove compartment, which I don't think anybody actually uses to store gloves.

And really, the Autoweek review is my current favorite of all the reviews at hand.

 

[onlinespending]

True. As great as the Model S may be, map pockets are useful even if you don't use maps at all. Like the glove compartment, which I don't think anybody actually uses to store gloves.

Right. Many cars have it that you can place water bottles in the map pockets, even going as far as building notches specifically for that purpose. This really would be a nice addition to the Model S, and strange that it was omitted.

 

[Zextraterrestrial]

So.. the Model S performance will spank a $110k Panamera and S7 in almost everything except top speed? (and range on 1 charge)

and there is no real EOS for TESLA yet!!

BADASS....all I can say

 

[AnOutsider]

Model S Performance vs Audi S7

Now that we know actual HP/Torque numbers, even more win!

 

[CapitalistOppressor]

Model S Performance vs Audi S7

Now that we know actual HP/Torque numbers, even more win!

The Model S Performance is a gigantic bargain at $79,900. It likely has the best all around combination of performance and features of any sedan that costs less than $100k. The biggest quibble is that the interior is a shade or two less refined than other high end sedans. But it is plenty luxurious enough to compete and with extended feedback Tesla can rapidly fix minor issues with the interior in succeeding model years. The competition though can't change the basic physics of their cars.

Model S Performance v1.0 is already a performance leap over 100 years of cutting edge refinement of ICE technology. It's main limitation (batteries) are undergoing profound and rapid improvement. In 4 years when Model S v2.0, comes out we can expect an ICE massacre for anything costing more than $50k-$60k, as big batteries and better performance are pushed down the product scale.

 

[CapitalistOppressor]

This is a customer test drive review. Apologies if it has already been posted.

Rowan Trollope | Test drive - Tesla model S - AWESOME

 

[CapitalistOppressor]

Nice test drive reviews by JasonS and rd2 at

Tesla Test Drive Questions | Forums | Tesla Motors

 

[CapitalistOppressor]

JasonS looks to be single handedly responsible for the new driving limitations during test drives

"Took a longer sweeping corner rated for 35 at 85. Took a 90 degree corner at 60 (or so - wasn’t staring at the speedometer) and got a little slide but it was sooo well controlled. I might’ve just thought it slid, because it was so smooth."

I can just imagine the Tesla rep sitting there quietly relaxed in Elon Musk's donated #2 car as JasonS takes a corner at 60 and puts the car into a nice "smooth" slide ...

 

[Right_Said_Fred]

Right. Many cars have it that you can place water bottles in the map pockets, even going as far as building notches specifically for that purpose. This really would be a nice addition to the Model S, and strange that it was omitted.

I have to say that one of the doubts I still have with changing my registration into an order is the lack of practical solutions in the interior. No (standard) consoles, no door pockets, no folding mirrors.

How could they have forgotten/skipped/ deleted (Alpha had them!) such simple, but important things? It can't be the cost, as those are low. Some important people must have had an off-day when they decided to go the minimalistic route.

It's a pity, because so much attention was given to the drivetrain, the suspension, the brakes/regeneration, the exterior. How, after all that attention to making the perfect car, can you put potential customers in a position that they have to walk away because the interior is simply not practical enough for storing maps, bottles, sun glasses, coins and all that other stuff people want within reach? I hope Tesla can make the necessary changes, there is still time!

 

[dsm363]

There is definitely time for the EU version for some of those items but I'd think that if folding mirrors didn't make the launch, they probably won't make the EU version either.

 

[medved]

I have to say that one of the doubts I still have with changing my registration into an order is the lack of practical solutions in the interior. No (standard) consoles, no door pockets, no folding mirrors.

How could they have forgotten/skipped/ deleted (Alpha had them!) such simple, but important things? It can't be the cost, as those are low. Some important people must have had an off-day when they decided to go the minimalistic route.

It's a pity, because so much attention was given to the drivetrain, the suspension, the brakes/regeneration, the exterior. How, after all that attention to making the perfect car, can you put potential customers in a position that they have to walk away because the interior is simply not practical enough for storing maps, bottles, sun glasses, coins and all that other stuff people want within reach? I hope Tesla can make the necessary changes, there is still time!

Exactly. Looks to me like they were in a hurry trying to get the car out ASAP and forgot about the little things. But I am sure this will be fixed in the future models.