Mobile Charger Issue with 14-50. Works fine with 14-30.

[AlexanderWD]

I recently had a 14-50 outlet installed, but as soon as I went to use the mobile charger I got nothing. The charger does not light up when plugged in. The charger works fine with a 14-30 or 120v adapter and outlet.

I have tested two different 14-50 adapters and checked the outlet carefully to make sure it was properly installed. It was. Yet, no matter what the mobile charger is dead when I try to plug it into the 14-50. There are no lights. Nothing. Can anyone point me in the right direction for possible solutions?

 

[jjrandorin]

If 2 different 14-50 adapters dont work, then the issue is likely not the adapter. Did you try turning the breaker off and back on? What have you done to verify that the outlet is, in fact, powered?

 

[AlexanderWD]

I have tried the breaker on-off. I have a multimeter and have checked for voltage in the outlet as well as removed the cover and checked that all the terminals are connected to a wire.

 

[flixden]

I have tried the breaker on-off. I have a multimeter and have checked for voltage in the outlet as well as removed the cover and checked that all the terminals are connected to a wire.

What readings/values are you getting between which terminals with the multimeter?

 

[AlexanderWD]

So, 120v-125v when going hot to ground or neutral, but Nothing when going Hot to Hot which I think is where the issue is sitting. Which, if that is the case what is a likely solution?

 

[flixden]

So, 120v-125v when going hot to ground or neutral, but Nothing when going Hot to Hot which I think is where the issue is sitting. Which, if that is the case what is a likely solution?

Yes, that's the issue. Looks like the two hot terminals are on the same phase. Can you take a picture of the breaker(s) in your panel, and post?

 

[AlexanderWD]

The only 50amp on the stack.

 

[flixden]

That looks like a dual pole breaker, which is what you need.
Are you sure the panel has two phases?

 

[stopcrazypp]

The only 50amp on the stack.

Where does the 40A go? Does that one work properly? If you read 120 for each going to ground or neutral, but nothing on the two hots, they are on the same phase.

Is there any exposed input into the panel where you can use the multimeter to measure if the two hots are 240V between each other?

Also you can measure the breaker directly too. If you don't see 240V there, obviously the outlet doesn't see it either.

 

[AlexanderWD]

That looks like a dual pole breaker, which is what you need.
Are you sure the panel has two phases?

I am pretty sure it does because the 30Amp dryer outlet works and those are 240v.

Where does the 40A go? Does that one work properly? If you read 120 for each going to ground or neutral, but nothing on the two hots, they are on the same phase.

Is there any exposed input into the panel where you can use the multimeter to measure if the two hots are 240V between each other?

Also you can measure the breaker directly too. If you don't see 240V there, obviously the outlet doesn't see it either.

The 40A is I think for the solar system the house came with. I will look into measuring at the breaker. Thanks for the advice.

 

[flixden]

Not sure about the panel specifics, but maybe it doesn't work at the location where the breaker is installed.

 

[Sophias_dad]

I'd wager if you pop the single half-breaker below the 50 amp breaker out of its position and move the 50 amp pair down one spot you'll get what you want. Assuming that works, put the half-breaker you pulled out above the newly-shifted 14-50.

Just stick the meter across the lower conductor of the 50 amp breaker and the one below it to verify my suspicion. You should get 240V.

 

[jjrandorin]

I'd wager if you pop the single half-breaker below the 50 amp breaker out of its position and move the 50 amp pair down one spot you'll get what you want. Assuming that works, put the half-breaker you pulled out above the newly-shifted 14-50.

Just stick the meter across the lower conductor of the 50 amp breaker and the one below it to verify my suspicion. You should get 240V.

If this is actually the case, then I hope the OP installed this themselves and didnt pay someone to install it. The statement "I recently had a 14-50 installed, implies "someone else did this" but thats not explicitly stated. If someone else did this, for money, and its an issue of incorrectly installed at the breaker box, then the OP should get a refund from them.

 

[flixden]

I'd wager if you pop the single half-breaker below the 50 amp breaker out of its position and move the 50 amp pair down one spot you'll get what you want. Assuming that works, put the half-breaker you pulled out above the newly-shifted 14-50.

Just stick the meter across the lower conductor of the 50 amp breaker and the one below it to verify my suspicion. You should get 240V.

That was my thinking as well.
It could also be that the 50A double needs to be moved all the way next to the 40A, but that's less likely, I'd say ...

 

[flixden]

If this is actually the case, then I hope the OP installed this themselves and didnt pay someone to install it. The statement "I recently had a 14-50 installed, implies "someone else did this" but thats not explicitly stated. If someone else did this, for money, and its an issue of incorrectly installed at the breaker box, then the OP should get a refund from them.

Yeah, for sure.
An electrician should also have tested it, you'd think.

 

[brkaus]

Not related, but most breakers don’t allow a double tap either. 4th and 5th down.

 

[AlexanderWD]

Yeah, for sure.
An electrician should also have tested it, you'd think.

You'd think. But it was getting late and the job had run long. I know he tested the Hot to ground/neutrals. Not impossible he missed the hot to hot. I will call the electrician, most likely. It is just a pain in the ass they don't work weekend so I have to coordinate to WFH to support their visits. Thank you everyone who commented and helped.

 

[Tronguy]

I think I see the problem.

You have an open somewhere on one of the hots.

From the top: Your house has two phases of hot; 120VAC/_0 degrees, and 120VAC/_180 degrees.

Second: If you take a multimeter and stick one probe on the ground frame and put the other probe on either the Big Red Wire or the Big Black Wire, you'd expect to get 120 VAC to either of those wires.

But you said that you put the probes of the multimeter across the Big Red Wire and the Big Black Wire and got Zero volts. Whoops!

Now, as a thought experiment, suppose that the breaker connected to the Big Black Wire happens to be busted and is open. And you've got the Mobile Connector plugged into the socket.

Under this scenario, there's 120/_0 degrees on the Big Red Wire since its breaker is in good working order. That voltage goes all the way down to the socket, into the wire in the mobile connector, through A Lot Of Resistance (but not infinity resistance) in the Mobile Connector, back into the other hot wire in the Mobile Connector, back to the wall socket, onto the Big Black Wire, and There It Stops. 120VAC/_0 degrees on both the Big Red Wire and the Big Black Wire.

Remember that there's not a lot of current flowing around in here; the multimeter has an internal resistance of MegaOhms and the internal resistance of the Mobile Connector is probably a couple of hundred kOhms.

Result: 120 VAC/_0 degrees on both Big Wires, so the voltage difference between them is Zero. Check. The voltage difference between the Big Red or the Big Black and Ground/Neutral is 120 VAC, check.

Like I said, you got an open somewhere. Could be:

1. The duplex breakers clip onto the two hot bus bars. One or the other of the clips might not be working right.
2. Breakers are mechanical devices. The get broken. If you're confident in your abilities (and, seriously, don't do this if you're not), turn off the power to the breaker panel, pop the breaker out of the panel (it clips, like I said), and check for continuity from a clip to the red wire and the other clip to the black wire. Then turn off the breaker and verify that both sides go to open. Use the Ohms function on your multimeter.
3. Check continuity of the red wire to one of the hots on that NEMA14-50 socket contacts and verify that there's no continuity from that red wire to any of the other blade connections.
4. Check continuity of the black wire to the other hot on that NEMA14-50 socket and verify that there's no continuity from that black wire to any of the other blade connections.

You're likely going to find something busted in steps 1-4 above. Fix whatever it is, put the breaker back where it came from, turn on the power, and check things.

By the by: If you're a-gonna do this, you darn well should have a helper with a rope/bunch of clothesline, standing physically clear of you. If you get stuck on something and can't unclench, they're to throw the rope over you and pull you off. And if they're not happy with the idea of that job, then get an electrician in to do the work.

 

[RandyS]

I agree with @Sophias_dad . It looks like your new breaker is not plugged into the bus correctly to get 240v across both legs. Since you're using half-height breakers, you need to make sure that the breaker set goes across both sides of the panel bus that look interwoven (see photo). The electrician who installed it can help (since they didn't do it correctly), or another knowledgable person. When they remove the double-breaker for your charger from the panel, you'll probably see from the connections on the rear that the breaker that it is not tapping both sides of the bus (which is necessary to get 240 volts). You may have to reconfigure a breaker or two higher or lower to get your EV breaker to connect to the bus correctly.

 

[stopcrazypp]

I am pretty sure it does because the 30Amp dryer outlet works and those are 240v.

The 40A is I think for the solar system the house came with. I will look into measuring at the breaker. Thanks for the advice.

If the 40A is working right and measures 240V and the 50A does not, @Sophias_dad is probably right.

From the picture, you are using a THQP250, which is a compact half sized breaker:
GE Q-Line 50-Space Amp 1 in. Double-Pole Circuit Breaker THQP250 - The Home Depot

You can see how they clamp on the panel using the two clamps that are perpendicular to the breaker:

Conventional full size THQL breakers instead use parallel clamps that clamp onto the slots.

It's possible to install such half size breakers such that both sides are on the same phase when you install a double pole. That is one of the downsides to using such space saver breakers. The full size breakers won't have this problem because they would always be on an alternating side.

Here's a diagram of how the various breakers clamp onto the panel:

Here's a labeled picture assuming the 40A is connected correctly. The red bars simulate how the slots are. The numbers correspond to which side slot each breaker is connected to. You can see the 50A breaker would end up having both sides connecting to the same slot, so they would be on the same phase.