Competition is good. Tesla has a few things to learn from how Jaguar is introducing ipace globally. I wish Jaguar all the best and hope they eat up a good part of the EV market across the pond. Sometimes lessons are only learnt the hard way.
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Jaguar have something the Teslas all lack, actual leather on the seats. Which is insane that it is lacking from a car that price.
I can see the I-Pace appeal to the people who wants a luxury car that is electric, while the Teslas will appeal to us that want a more thechy car. I can forego actually nice materials for the nice screen, some people can't.
I can see the I-Pace appeal to the people who wants a luxury car that is electric, while the Teslas will appeal to us that want a more thechy car. I can forego actually nice materials for the nice screen, some people can't.
Shock-On-T
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Agree, especially on the dealership and autopilot points.
I'd care more about the US balance of trade if I were American
Well, Tesla is probably the only car maker in the world that take away 1 foot rollout from there acceleration times on some of there cars and Drag times do the same thing. If you look at the true 0-100 time wish I'm 99% sure that Jaguar use then I Pace is faster.
The Supercharger network is clearly a huge selling point for most people. In terms of the head-to-head comparison with the Model 3, I think the biggest advantages of the Model 3 AWD LR are:
- Price: ~$49K for Model 3 v. ~$70-75K iPace (US pricing released March 6)
- Range: 310+ v. 240
- Supercharging network
- Autopilot
To me, the iPace is a repeat of the Bolt scenario -- it is priced at a huge premium to comparable ICE cars and cannot conveniently be driven long distances because of the lack of a fast charging network. I think we likely see the same results -- disappointing sales.
That's too bad, because the iPace does seem like an attractive CUV that people might buy in significant numbers at a better price point (~$45-$50K base) with a good fast charging network.
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Reciprocity
Active Member
The only thing you are wrong about is that they will sell every one they can make, which won't be that many. None of the magical new EVs are slated for much production. Mostly compliance level. Jag maybe 10k this year and 20k/y going forward and they will sell everyone they make.
Speaking of compliance, Tata motors should be able to use this vehicle for Zev credits in California for all the land rovers they sell.
30.000 this year and between 30.000 and 60.000 next year, thats what you could read in articles about suppliers here in Germany. According to this numbers a complience car like Model S and X.
30.000 this year and between 30.000 and 60.000 next year, thats what you could read in articles about suppliers here in Germany. According to this numbers a complience car like Model S and X.
If that's true then it's great but what I have read on several websites is that production was planed for about 15k per year. Do you have any source for that information?
Love the interior of the Jag - can't wait to see it in person.
On a separate note, my wife and I keep switching between our 2 new cars - a Model 3 and a Merc E 4Matic coupe. We both agree that:
1. The interior of the Merc is better (fit and finish, love the ambient color).
2. The drive is more comfortable in the Merc (less harsh suspension, and very surprising to me more quiet despite being an ICE).
3. Model 3 looks better on the outside and accelerates faster.
4. The minimalist look of Model 3 is growing on me, but is overdone. Should have some buttons (glove compartment, climate), and traditional functions on the sticks (wiper settings, 3rd stick for cruise control).
I think a magical blend between the 2 (Tesla exterior and acceleration, Merc fit and finish, ambient color, a touch less buttons for Merc or a touch more buttons for Tesla) would be an ideal car for us. We will probably end up trading up the model 3 for either performance AWD with air suspension or for a re-styled model S whenever these become available. Unless Porsche Mission E or the announced Jaguar EV sedan are more compelling at that time.
It is great to see that finally we have more options in the EV world.
On a separate note, my wife and I keep switching between our 2 new cars - a Model 3 and a Merc E 4Matic coupe. We both agree that:
1. The interior of the Merc is better (fit and finish, love the ambient color).
2. The drive is more comfortable in the Merc (less harsh suspension, and very surprising to me more quiet despite being an ICE).
3. Model 3 looks better on the outside and accelerates faster.
4. The minimalist look of Model 3 is growing on me, but is overdone. Should have some buttons (glove compartment, climate), and traditional functions on the sticks (wiper settings, 3rd stick for cruise control).
I think a magical blend between the 2 (Tesla exterior and acceleration, Merc fit and finish, ambient color, a touch less buttons for Merc or a touch more buttons for Tesla) would be an ideal car for us. We will probably end up trading up the model 3 for either performance AWD with air suspension or for a re-styled model S whenever these become available. Unless Porsche Mission E or the announced Jaguar EV sedan are more compelling at that time.
Any thoughts? It seems like the Jaguar I-PACE is really nice car. Will cost around the same as fully speced TM3. Has a little less range, but is more roomy , has basically the same acceleration. Also has normal dash and knobs you know
Edit : Also the interior materials looks much better than TM3 or even S or X
It certainly offers a decidedly-different interior alternative:
Versus ...
Each will appeal to a decidedly different set of style tastes.
I know my preference, but everyone is certainly entitled to theirs.
Excuse me, could not find the article i talked about. It was more detailed. But I found this:
Elektrische Achsantriebe gehen in Serie
and another about magma where they are talking about a minimum of 20.000.
I think it's all about the demand.
Intresting to me, the article above is from November and production-line is completely build and is working. Production starts in March. Maybe Tesla should schedule like this?
T34ME
Active Member
The answer to that question will depend on each individual and how many long distance miles they drive each year. It is not possible to state an empirical value.
I think Tesla has understated the range of the 3SR at 220 miles (like they have understated the range on the 3LR). I think the range is going to be around 240 miles using EPA testing methods.
I think Jaguar has optimistically overstated the I-Pace range at 240 miles. We will see what the EPA says about that.
So would I rather have a $35K car with 200 mile real world range and existing Supercharger network or a >$70K car with a 200 mile real world range and no plans for a Supercharger network? The answer is easy for me, but others will come to a different conclusion.
Not great at all, compared with the Model 3 value of 0.23
In addition the I-Pace is both wider (2011mm vs 1933mm with folded mirrors) and higher (1565mm vs 1440mm). Taken together this means it's almost certain to use rather more power at speed, which translates to a lower range on the highway, which is where you really want the range (in the city distances are short and chargers are easy to find).
I can see that several car companies are producing CUVs/crossovers for their first electric car. That seems like a mistake. The CUV aesthetic requires a flatter nose and a steeper windshield. Both are bad for the Cd value, and CUVs are also taller which is bad for the CdA. This affects range and means you need a bigger battery to get a given range and faster charging to get a given average speed.
CUVs announced:
Jaguar i-Pace
Hyundai Kona Electric
Mazda unnamed with optional range extender ("A crossover model would be nice": Mazda’s elektrische auto krijgt optioneel wankelmotor als range-extender )
Considering the Model 3 in winter beats the Model S in summer for coast-to-coast times I think it's the best great electric car for longer distances at highway speeds. Obviously a hybrid or ICE car will still be faster though.
I think this is why they are doing it as the height probably helps to move up the seat a bit without killing the headroom.
jgs
Active Member
... and has been famous for their quality that entire time. Not famous in a good way, mind.
Q: "Why does a Jaguar have two seats?"
A: "The left seat is for the mechanic."
sreams
Member
30.000 this year and between 30.000 and 60.000 next year, thats what you could read in articles about suppliers here in Germany. According to this numbers a complience car like Model S and X.
Not as a percentage of their total production. The whole point of a compliance car is to produce it in small numbers compared to the other vehicles you actually want to sell.
sreams
Member
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