GM Chevy Volt

[doug]

Driving the car at 78mph is not the standard freeway speed test. It may be a real world test but the EPA freeway fuel economy tests are done at 50 - 60 mph.
...
It is entirely possible that the Volt gets better mileage at steady 78mph than a Prius.

True. I made this point elsewhere, but perhaps not here. Need to reserve judgment till we have the EPA numbers in CS mode. Not that I think the EPA tests are best, but they at least represent a standard. Nonetheless, the PopMech results are not encouraging.

 

[doug]

Here's a thoughtful article on the media hubbub from TTAC:
Chevy Volt: Truth And Consequences

 

[dpeilow]

Here's a thoughtful article on the media hubbub from TTAC:
Chevy Volt: Truth And Consequences

One of the commenters asks whether the Volt now qualifies for the $7500 tax credit. That is a very good point. Is this the real reason GM kept schtum?

 

[doug]

Why wouldn't it?

 

[richkae]

Since PopMech did their ridiculous 78mph "highway" test, I do not trust them to not jackrabbit start every light in their "city" driving test.

If I drive the Prius aggressively I can easily get the mpg below 40, if I drive it with some thought to efficiency I get a little over 50mpg.

 

[richkae]

I bet that if it was known that it was "just another hybrid" at the time they lobbied for the tax credit it would have been harder to get.
The credit was carefully crafted so that the Volt qualified and other hybrids did not... GM couldnt figure out how to exclude real BEVs though.

 

[vfx]

...
A Nissan Leaf will require you to make 17 charging stops of 20-30 minutes ( level 3 ) ( 30 mins yields 8.5 hours total ) ...

Or look at it this way. It takes about 20 seconds max to plug in the car in and 10 secs to unplug it. That's 30 seconds per charge.

Multiplied by 17 fill-ups is only 8.5 minutes of your time since the car charges while you sleep.

...If the tank holds 10 gallons you will need to stop for gas 6 times ( 10 minutes each - 1 hour total )...

Just saved 51.5 minutes of time standing around a smelly gas station! :smile:

 

[mattjs33]

The Volt’s Gas Engine DOES Turn the Wheels. Sometimes.

Earlier reports pretty much on the mark. Previous GM staff either none the wiser or lying through their teeth.

Nothing against the car but it certainly isn't the "EV" they would like you to believe.

My gosh! That's a mechanical hybrid, like a Prius. The gasonline engine can drive the wheels directly. It's not a pure EV with a range extender. You're right... they've been spinning a tale!

I never expected a Tesla forum to have much love for the Volt, but let's not get off on a "let's-bash-GM" mode, or a "GM-was-lying" tangent.

As I understand it, from the article, the Volt's gas engine only directly powers the wheels when the batteries are depleted, and the car's speed is in excess of 70mph, at which point I might mention it would exceeds the maximum speed limit in many states in the U.S. Yes, it was mentioned previously that this would never be the case, but honestly I don't think it's that big of a deal. Here's why:

Rather than argue what the Volt isn't, we should carefully consider what it really is. It could be said to be two cars in one. It's an electric car that can do what no other electric car can do, that is, drive beyond the depletion of battery charge. It is also a gasoline car that can do what no other gasoline car can do, that is, drive for a significant distance and speed without using any gas at all. I don't really care how they link it all together, the bottom line is the Volt is a brilliant piece of engineering. The minute the Volt hits the market, every conventional hybrid becomes obsolete.

 

[SByer]

Dragging us back on topic; Is the Volt more efficient with the occasional mechanical connection? Probably, almost certainly. Is it brilliant tech? Yes. Is it an EV, no, it's a hybrid. GM has a bad PR/marketing department and they need to try and be more honest and genuine or their message will fall flat in the current culture.

Now is it any good? I hope to get to try it tomorrow. Susan got to drive it on Monday. GM is apparently making the round in Silicon Valley with some sort of try-it roadshow.

As for gas stations, I think most people won't realize how bad they are until they can not have to stop at one for a few months. And it always surprises me how people 'subsidize' their time at a gas station - every time I actually timed it, I got 8-10 minutes, not the 5 most people think.

 

[TEG]

Dragging us back on topic; Is the Volt more efficient with the occasional mechanical connection? Probably, almost certainly. Is it brilliant tech? Yes. Is it an EV, no, it's a hybrid. GM has a bad PR/marketing department and they need to try and be more honest and genuine or their message will fall flat in the current culture.

Yep...

 

[vfx]

Hope an owner can turn that horn off!

 

[SByer]

So, I got to drive one today. Competent. It's got the normal advantages of an EV - low latency response on the throttle, no vibration. Steering was pretty good. I guess American cars have finally gotten halfway decent on steering. The center console is interesting, but not to my taste. Yeah, capacitive touch switches (easy to keep clean), but didn't register quick taps. Not Apple quality touch. The data displays are over-simplified and over-illustrated - I didn't spend much time, but there wasn't anything that popped out as immediately obvious as the Roadsters current flow display, much less the nanny-graph. There's one vertical bar with a green bubble inside of it that moves up and down, and gets smaller & turns yellow if you're not driving 'efficiently'. I found it more annoying than helpful. I called it a hybrid, the representative had probably been coached given the re-emphasis on the phrase extended-range electric vehicle (wake up GM, stop it!).

But, for me, the BIG annoyance was the combination of the blended-on-the-brake regen (which sucks, sucks, sucks), and those aforementioned lack-of-real-info displays. I can only guess that when the stupid floaty green ping pong ball got to the first tick down that I had hit the limit of regen (and if so, pretty wimpy!). They did too good a job on blending, I could not tell when the friction brakes were kicking in. Absolutely the wrong answer!

My verdict: they've nailed it for the soccer mom worried about the environment and who has a bit of range anxiety and isn't willing to give that up to reason.


(I also got to drive a Corvette for the first time. Gawd, do people actually buy these things? I don't care how fast it goes 0-60 when the steering isn't even as good as the Volts', and the power output is so non-linear and unpredictable! When I stomped on it and the other 4 cylinders kicked in it was just a loud, obnoxious, unruly mess. It was fun for 5 minutes in an I-hate-the-earth-and-everyone-around-me kind of way, but after sitting at a stop light and missing the peacefulness with the shaking and the rumbling and the wasting... They had some other cars to drive, but that pretty much sopped up any ICE tolerance I may have had.)

 

[TEG]

Oh wait! Now I get it:

It means 23MPG if you don't plug it in!

 

[stopcrazypp]

GM got a lot of (deserved) flack for that media event touting 230mpg knowing fully it was not a final or official rating. People defending GM say Nissan also twittered that day saying they got ~300mpg for the Leaf (same DOE formula that gave the Roadster 256mpg), but twittering rather than a big media event, shows Nissan is aware that rating isn't something to be widely advertised (and relatively meaningless for a lot of consumers).

 

[bolosky]

That video showed that the Volt has a feature that I'd love to have on my Roadster: instead of telling the car when to START charging, you tell it when to FINISH. As it is, I have my charge start set what is too early for most days, but I need it for the few days that I drive farther.

Maybe some day in a new firmware update...

 

[mpt]

A smidgen OT but an amusing dig at the Volts 40 mile range from my friend that puts plugs on Prii. http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/7350857

 

[EVNow]

Well, the EPA is going to test and give some numbers. GM thinks the EV range will be less than 40 ...

http://www.detnews.com/article/2010...exec-predicts-60-000-Volt-models-built-in-’12

He said he expects the EPA will set a single figure as the expected electric range for the Volt “somewhere in the middle of this 25- to 50-” mile range that GM has announced.

He said it’s possible the figure will be below the 40 mile range that GM had long advertised.

Leaf is also getting tested.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/15/business/energy-environment/15auto.html?hp

 

[dpeilow]

Clarification: Gas Engine Can Help Drive the Chevrolet Volt Starting at 30 MPH

I wondered when this was coming.

If the gearbox is diverting torque to the road, what is providing juice for the electric motor? Is it dipping further into the DoD of the battery? If not, then why not just send all the torque to the road?

 

[mpt]

On twitter this morning from Chelsea Sexton:

Drove Volt today for 45.8 miles in EV mode, 12 miles left upon arrival. Range record on the media drives so far!

Not too bad though in my world that range would cover almost every individual trip but I'd be plugging in two or three times a day on top rate electricity.

 

[mpt]

If not, then why not just send all the torque to the road?

The "towable generator" crowd has long since figured out that pushing the car is more efficient than turning motion into electricity then back into motion. In some respects it would make a lot of sense for the Volt to use as much direct engine torque as possible given that they have the mechanics to do it.