FSD Beta v11.x

The next big milestone for FSD is 11. It is a significant upgrade and fundamental changes to several parts of the FSD stack including totally new way to train the perception NN.

From AI day and Lex Fridman interview we have a good sense of what might be included.

- Object permanence both temporal and spatial
- Moving from “bag of points” to objects in NN
- Creating a 3D vector representation of the environment all in NN
- Planner optimization using NN / Monte Carlo Tree Search (MCTS)
- Change from processed images to “photon count” / raw image
- Change from single image perception to surround video
- Merging of city, highway and parking lot stacks a.k.a. Single Stack

Lex Fridman Interview of Elon. Starting with FSD related topics.

Here is a detailed explanation of Beta 11 in "layman's language" by James Douma, interview done after Lex Podcast.

Here is the AI Day explanation by in 4 parts.

Deep Understanding Tesla FSD Part 1: HydraNet

From Theory to Reality, Analyze the Evolution of Tesla Full Self-Driving

saneryee-studio.medium.com

Here is a useful blog post asking a few questions to Tesla about AI day. The useful part comes in comparison of Tesla's methods with Waymo and others (detailed papers linked).

Twelve Questions about Tesla Autopilot Technologies Exposed at 2021 AI Day

On Aug. 19 2021, Telsa held an AI day , exposing more technologies about Autopilot , from perception, planning, data labeling, simulation…

yuhuang-63908.medium.com

 

[DrGriz]

Yeah. And there's a word for that type of person. And the cause, often, is, "For the yuks." Other causes are much nastier.

I sure hope that's not happening here. Too much of that kind of thing can, well, destroy a subforum as a useful source of information.

Anybody who self identifies as a jebinc probably is one!

 

[Kablooie]

Elon has refused to respond to numerous requests for an update on the release of v11.4.7. Will cousin Timmy, Jake, or commando wife Rita give v11.4.7 its last rites?

Maybe he's lost interest in updating v11 because he's really into v12.
That's probably still an alpha version so won't be going out to any of us for a long, long time.

 

[WilliamG]

11.4.7 is still going to be FSDj, let's not kid ourselves. Really, the best part of it will be, potentially, getting a more up-to-date (main) software revision.

 

[Knightshade]

FSDb continues to be used for like 95% of my driving, and this past week I actually was driving around a friend who owns a non-FSD (basic AP only) Model 3 and she was so impressed she's seriously thinking about buying FSD now.

It still makes stupid lane selections- that's EASILY my biggest gripe currently- and still sometimes is too slow dealing with stop and yield signs- those 2 things and the lane selection issue are mostly the 5% I have to take back over--- but for the other 95% mostly works good enough as an L2 ADAS (it's nowhere remotely near capable of >L2 off highways) as long as you're paying at least "I know this is the wrong lane" levels of attention to it that it remains much more worth using than not.

 

[GWord]

Judging by how much s/he seems hates them s/he must be a complete masochist.

No doubt. I ended up having to put this person on ignore. Musk seems to live in his/her head rent free.

 

[kpanda17]

Why can’t Tesla Vision check IT’s map Intel to understand rhe immediate environment for when it gets confused? My previous example of being in a lane ending right lane and properly meeging left, it went straight across the lines and I intervened

 

[jebinc]

Maybe he's lost interest in updating v11 because he's really into v12.
That's probably still an alpha version so won't be going out to any of us for a long, long time.

Or maybe he's just a Charlatan who spouts shite randomly for effect?

 

[Richard34212]

OT: ‘Pibot’ Better Than Human Pilots Say Researchers

“Pibot is a humanoid robot that can fly an [airplane] just like a human pilot by manipulating all the single controls in the cockpit, which is designed for humans,” David Shim, an associate professor of electrical engineering at KAIST, told Euronews Next."

'Pibot' Better Than Human Pilots Say Researchers - AVweb

Korean researchers are developing a humanoid “pibot” that looks like a character from a 1960s science fiction sitcom but unlike most autonomous flight systems, this one can literally fill in for pilots in any aircraft. The team at the Korea Advanced Institute of Science and Technology (KAIST)...

www.avweb.com

 

[rlsd]

Once FSD, always FSD.

It's a little bit uncomfortable for me to drive an ICE car in Houston in the last 2 days after getting used to FSD with my MY for 8 months. The car kept jumping forward when I just slightly lifted my foot from the brake pedal. It was a little bit scary when getting close to the stop signs. I also had to constantly watch the lane markers to keep the car inside the lanes. The car had lane departure warning feature but I did not bother to think of it. It would be a lot more difficult for me if I drove this car in California. People don't go 15-20 miles over speed limit and don't tailgate in Texas. Texan people even drive below speed limit, a rare thing in California.

The car was a Chrysler hybrid minivan. The car was nice but it had one problem: the engine check light was on after I drove one hour from the airport to the hotel. It took me 3 hours roundtrip on Sunday to bring the car to Hobby airport to exchange for a new car. Alamo people told me the check engine light could be a false alarm because of the complexity of a hybrid. Regardless, I did not want to take risk because I had a really bad experience with engine check warning before: my old ICE was stalled on the freeway after I drove 20 minutes with the engine check warning on.

 

[kpanda17]

Also when leaving the vehicle and locking the keys inside. EVs simplify life and I locked the keys in the vehicle while in Costco
Crazy

 

[kabin]

Judging by how much s/he seems hates them s/he must be a complete masochist.

Desperate ad hominens continue. Sigh...

Bottom line - when customers spend good money for top of the line TSLA products and, in return, get junk they deserve to be heard. The ball is in TSLA's court.

 

[kabin]

J

U

 

[kabin]

It's just.. so weird.

Yesterday, the SO and I piled into our 2018 M3 with FSD-b and took a trip from Central Jersey to this, "It's near the Delaware River, so it's full of cutesy gift shops" on the Pennsylvania side, "Peddlar's Village".

Not a bad place. Food was a bit high priced, though, so drove from there to New Hope, which actually is on the Delaware. And from there to home.

Let's see: local roads in Central Jersey (this is, like congestion, for those who don't know) onto a 3/4 lane interstate, left exit some distance up onto one of thse vaguely country, two lanes in each direction, with the occasional stop light; through a toll booth onto the Pennsylvania side, then another ten or twelve miles to this village thing, relatively fast two-lane road.. Horrors: the car wanted me to turn right into what looked like a lane, so I intervened. The first intervention that day. And the car was right: That was the lane into one of the big parking lots. Had to dodge considerable foot traffic to get into the same lot a couple hundred yards up and on the right. (I could have let FSD-b dodge the pedestrians.. but there are Limits, here.) Oh, yeah: The autopark worked fine.

On the way back, figuring the foot traffic wasn't worth the risk, got back on the two-lane road and let FSD-b do its thing to the restaurant. It did a decent job all the way to Downtown and, with roughly the same amount of foot traffic as back in Peddlar's Village, took over again and parked.

After dinner, rather than going over the toll bridge, turned left, instead, then hung a left over the ancient bridge across the Delaware, then stop-and-go through the town on the Jersey side. When got out of downtown there, hung a left and let FSD-b do its thing. All the way home, two-way country roads, 50 mph, 55 on the four-lane roads, traffic circles, off ramps, on ramps, back onto the interstate and home. No interventions.

About 90 miles of driving. I think one phantom brake experience, but the car was possibly looking at somebody coming up fast on the right and got cautious.

FSD-b didn't try to kill anyone. A bit jerky at times, sure. And, sure, it doesn't drive the same way I do.

Don't quite get it. If one reads this sub-forum, one gets the idea that the FSD-b is completely unreliable, a threat to public safety, full of bugs, and dangerous as all get out. On the other hand, I just drove 90 (or the car drove, you guys pick it) miles in a five year-old Tesla Model 3 with the Gen 3 computer, an upgrade. Yeah, the car's got RADAR and the USS, but those aren't even supposed to be turned on in 11.4.4.

I'll admit that this car can get in trouble sometimes. There's this red light-controlled intersection that it likes to run, probably because of some flickering issue. There's a particular unprotected left turn that, on my side, has room to let other cars through on the right, but the car moves right-ward, blocking traffic. On a particular on-ramp, if there's heavy traffic in the travel lane the car has trouble getting over, especially as the merge area is pretty short. So, bugs. But life-threatening? Nope.

Something about these older cars that work better than the newer ones? Dunno.

Of course there hasn't been a recent update so evaluations have dried up and that always presents the opportunity to suggest things aren't that bad. But reality is much different. V11.x releases have been unsafe, unpredictable, uncomfortable, and of late there's been no signs of significant improvement for something that has so far to go to be a relaxing $15k feature for safe roadway use. For many it all comes down to how FSD performs now not some time later when and if a mindblowing version x.y.z hits the road. Until then it's an embarrassment that my family doesn't want used while they are car occupants.

 

[jebinc]

Desperate ad hominens continue. Sigh...

Bottom line - when customers spend good money for top of the line TSLA products and, in return, get junk they deserve to be heard. The ball is in TSLA's court.

Right? So hypocritical…. Whining about other members and making it personal is preferred and more helpful to the forum than being critical (or supportive) of Tesla FSDj performance. Right; got it!

Likewise, “pumping up,” and promoting FSDj, when real issues continue to exist does not help new Tesla owners trying to decide whether or not getting FSD is worth it to them - as the “all roses” commentary is at best misleading. Could also be self serving for some as well; those being members who hold Telsa stock and are really here trying to manage their investment, vs offering real experience views and opinions of the product.

F’n hysterical, this thread and its posters (posers)…

 

[mtndrew1]

It's just.. so weird.

Yesterday, the SO and I piled into our 2018 M3 with FSD-b and took a trip from Central Jersey to this, "It's near the Delaware River, so it's full of cutesy gift shops" on the Pennsylvania side, "Peddlar's Village".

Not a bad place. Food was a bit high priced, though, so drove from there to New Hope, which actually is on the Delaware. And from there to home.

Let's see: local roads in Central Jersey (this is, like congestion, for those who don't know) onto a 3/4 lane interstate, left exit some distance up onto one of thse vaguely country, two lanes in each direction, with the occasional stop light; through a toll booth onto the Pennsylvania side, then another ten or twelve miles to this village thing, relatively fast two-lane road.. Horrors: the car wanted me to turn right into what looked like a lane, so I intervened. The first intervention that day. And the car was right: That was the lane into one of the big parking lots. Had to dodge considerable foot traffic to get into the same lot a couple hundred yards up and on the right. (I could have let FSD-b dodge the pedestrians.. but there are Limits, here.) Oh, yeah: The autopark worked fine.

On the way back, figuring the foot traffic wasn't worth the risk, got back on the two-lane road and let FSD-b do its thing to the restaurant. It did a decent job all the way to Downtown and, with roughly the same amount of foot traffic as back in Peddlar's Village, took over again and parked.

After dinner, rather than going over the toll bridge, turned left, instead, then hung a left over the ancient bridge across the Delaware, then stop-and-go through the town on the Jersey side. When got out of downtown there, hung a left and let FSD-b do its thing. All the way home, two-way country roads, 50 mph, 55 on the four-lane roads, traffic circles, off ramps, on ramps, back onto the interstate and home. No interventions.

About 90 miles of driving. I think one phantom brake experience, but the car was possibly looking at somebody coming up fast on the right and got cautious.

FSD-b didn't try to kill anyone. A bit jerky at times, sure. And, sure, it doesn't drive the same way I do.

Don't quite get it. If one reads this sub-forum, one gets the idea that the FSD-b is completely unreliable, a threat to public safety, full of bugs, and dangerous as all get out. On the other hand, I just drove 90 (or the car drove, you guys pick it) miles in a five year-old Tesla Model 3 with the Gen 3 computer, an upgrade. Yeah, the car's got RADAR and the USS, but those aren't even supposed to be turned on in 11.4.4.

I'll admit that this car can get in trouble sometimes. There's this red light-controlled intersection that it likes to run, probably because of some flickering issue. There's a particular unprotected left turn that, on my side, has room to let other cars through on the right, but the car moves right-ward, blocking traffic. On a particular on-ramp, if there's heavy traffic in the travel lane the car has trouble getting over, especially as the merge area is pretty short. So, bugs. But life-threatening? Nope.

Something about these older cars that work better than the newer ones? Dunno.

Give me a DM the next time you’re in Los Angeles and bring some Dramamine and Ativan.

 

[kpanda17]

Of course there hasn't been a recent update so evaluations have dried up and that always presents the opportunity to suggest things aren't that bad. But reality is much different. V11.x releases have been unsafe, unpredictable, uncomfortable, and of late there's been no signs of significant improvement for a feature that has so far to go to be a relaxing $15k feature for safe roadway use. For many it all comes down to how FSD performs now not some time later when and if a mindblowing version x.y.z hits the road.

Hate to be that person to say
But this is rhe advantage of the subscription option
I jumped on this month and waiting to see if 11.4.7 drops in my T
If it doesn’t then I will end my sub and wait for rhe next big version update with benefits
Before jumping in again

 

[aronth5]

Why can’t Tesla Vision check IT’s map Intel to understand rhe immediate environment for when it gets confused? My previous example of being in a lane ending right lane and properly meeging left, it went straight across the lines and I intervened

You're assuming the "map intel" is always accurate. For all we know relying on the map intel is why FSD made the mistake in the first place.

 

[kpanda17]

You're assuming the "map intel" is always accurate. For all we know relying on the map intel is why FSD made the mistake in the first place.

Thought it’s mostly Tesla Vision now

 

[aronth5]

Thought it’s mostly Tesla Vision now

FSD uses both Tesla Vision and map data. Either one or both can be the source of incorrect FSD decisions.

 

[JulienW]

Having been on 11.4.2 for what seems like yeeeeeeears now it seems to be ebbing back up again quality. It was decent to start and seemed to get progressively worse. In the last couple of weeks it seems to be better. I had 2 really good in city drives Saturday and 2 Sunday. Today I've had 2 also. Now I have probably jinxed it and will eat crow pie.