I drove the volt when it first came out in 2011, and lets just say it was pathetic. To be fair, I have a very high standard when it comes to products of any kind, especially since the Volt I drove was $45k back then. Like I said before, I would have paid $200k for a Model S before I paid $10k for a Volt. The sad part is that I'm far from an outlier. The are many others that think like this, that's why the Model S sales numbers are very close to much cheaper EV options.Sooo.... You're saying you DON'T want to buy a Chevy Volt?
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
Chevy Bolt - 200 mile range for $30k base price (after incentive)
- Thread starter FredTMC
- Start date
-
- Tags
- bolt chevy Electric Vehicles review
Have you seen Model 3 concept?
Do you know its battery capacity?
Do you know Model 3's range?
Do you know Model 3's price?
Tesla says it will deliver Model 3 2017. Yet we know nothing about it. In past Tesla's predictions have always been wildly optimistic.
Roadster was supposed to cost $89k. It cost 100-110k. Model S was supposed to cost half of Roadster.
Model X was supposed to be in shop 2013.
Based on previous experience I would say we have to multiply Tesla's price estimate by factor 1.2-1.3 and time by adding 2+ years.
Last edited:
GM says the 2016 Volt will do 0-30 mph in 2.6 seconds. The S85 does it in 2.3, according to MotorTrend. A 2013 P85 is 0-30 in 2.4 seconds, according to Edmonds.com, although another article there measured a 2012 S85 at 2.0 seconds.' I had trouble finding the numbers for an S60 but according to GeekEV on the teslamotors.com forum and YouTube it does 0-30 mph in 2.5 seconds so 0.1 faster than the new Volt.
In any case, the 2016 Volt is fast at launching in EV. By comparison, GM rated the old Volt at 0-30 mph in 3.4 seconds. Of course, acceleration on the Volt falls away faster at higher speeds.
They haven't released the new Volt hybrid perf numbers yet.
Last edited:
Merrill
Merrill
I to drove a Volt in Early 2012 and considering what it is I did not think it was all the bad. It is a hybrid and I wanted a BEV so was not going to work, also lots of road noise from everywhere. I like to see people that drive anything that is not all gas, so hybrids are better than nothing. Lots of my friends get the green thing but either cannot afford what is out there for both hybrids and BEV's or just not into cars period. For lots of people it is just a form of transportation and do not care what they drive, I do not try to explain why cars have been a very important part of my life and why a Tesla is for me such an amazing car.
RobStark
Well-Known Member
GM does not see itself as an agent provocateur to catalyze the electrification of the automobile.
Giving specifics 2.5 years ahead of release allows others to benchmark and make a slightly better specified car at a slightly lower price.
While Tesla gave specifics on Model S and pretty much made Nissan go back to the drawing board on the Infiniti LE they are not that open on Model 3.
As Elon said they will be holding their cards "close to the vest" from now on.
Define launch? If they improved acceleration but not the initial pause then it'll still be a bit annoying.
I don't think anyone outside of GM has had a chance to track test it (or perhaps drive it at all) so we don't know. I think it's reasonable to expect that they measured the new 2.6 result the same way they measured the old 3.4 number. Magazine tests for the old Volt tend to show 0-30 in 3.0-3.2 seconds. GM doesn't have a recent reputation for exaggerating their performance claims.
The few times that I punched the go pedal from a stop I personally didn't notice a significant response pause but I have seen a few people mention that they perceive one.
anticitizen13.7
Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018
NPR's Boston station, WBUR, has a lengthy interview with GM's Stuart Norris, the head designer of the Bolt:
http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2015/01/14/chevy-bolt-electric
One thing I found quite odd is that the Bolt was designed in South Korea, which Mr. Norris says is a country that has little support for EVs in terms of infrastructure of population acceptance. Mr. Norris also said that he himself did not drive an EV.
Other than that, the interview revealed no new information. The NPR reporter asked about batteries and charging times, but Mr. Norris declined to give any specifics.
http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2015/01/14/chevy-bolt-electric
One thing I found quite odd is that the Bolt was designed in South Korea, which Mr. Norris says is a country that has little support for EVs in terms of infrastructure of population acceptance. Mr. Norris also said that he himself did not drive an EV.
Other than that, the interview revealed no new information. The NPR reporter asked about batteries and charging times, but Mr. Norris declined to give any specifics.
I'm glad I'm not the only one that has felt the horrible throttle response of the Volt. I posted about this in 2011, and some said it was because of it being the demo model, but I wasn't convinced. Anyway, that was a major dealbreaker after driving the thing.
anticitizen13.7
Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018
Yup. The car industry did a pretty good switcheroo in the U.S. Market.
SUVs in the 1990's were mostly body-on-frame vehicles derived from trucks. They delivered on tall ride height and "tough" image, but weren't so great in ride quality.
So the car makers took car platforms and unibodies, made them hatchbacks, raised them up a bit, and added AWD as an option. A Honda CR-V is basically a wagon version of the Honda Civic. The cars are based on the same platform. They have similar dimension footprint, and you can even see similarities inside (the flat floor in the rear is a giveaway). Honda sells more CR-Vs than Civics today.
This.
Elon went to NAIAS and said that they don't even have a design concept for the Model 3 yet. In fact, they haven't even nailed down a design *direction* yet; he said there was disagreement about how radical to make the car.
So, OK. Tesla has built a long range EV and GM hasn't. But to claim that the Model 3 is somehow farther along the development path than the Bolt is...I mean, it's just wrong. The Bolt is a concept car, but it's a concept car that's pretty close to production ready, at least in terms of overall layout.
How does GM make it go 200 miles? There's no magic there. Make it light, make it slippery, and give it a 60ish kWh battery. Boom. Done.
Is it going to be as much fun to drive as a Tesla? I doubt it. I doubt it will be as fast, either. In fact, maybe it will be an underwhelming piece of crap. Dunno.
But there's no reasonable argument that a car whose *basic design characteristics* are still being debated is closer to production than the Bolt.
Anyhoo. I've said the same thing a whole bunch now, so I'll bow out. But I will leave this prediction, to be validated in 2017--you will be able to buy a Bolt before you can order a Model 3.
Krugerrand
Meow
Well, I will give you this: the Bolt concept weighs a lot more than the Model 3 concept.
Actually, it's quite hard... not magic, but hard. The Bolt as shown isn't slippery. GM says it's based on the Gamma G2SC platform, so it's not light. It doesn't have a skateboard platform, so where are they getting both the flat interior and places to stuff 60 kWh of battery? Therefore, this isn't even close to production ready and especially in terms of overall layout.
The difference with Tesla is that they have already built 200+ mile BEVs. The Model X prototype is credible because its a straight forward derivation of the S. Obviously the Model 3 is still vapor. But the Bolt didn't get less vaporish with this "reveal" and instead, we were shown something that just isn't credible. If Tesla shows a Model 3 that isn't credible, then I and others will question it also. There's skepticism about the Roadster 3.0 upgrade in terms of achieving range too, but at least we're talking about an upgrade to an existing product and the claims, while seeming a bit stretched, can be credible. The Bolt as shown is not.
Vger
Active Member
I find it interesting that GM, on their web site, quotes a fast charge time in the ballpark of a ~100 kW supercharger (40 minutes to 80%), but if you look at the picture of the open charge port, it appears to be a standard J1772 port, without the Combo DC pins. Hmmm, makes me thing this might not be all that polished an engineering job.
But of course the Bolt will probably be a 200 mile car the same way the Model S was a 300 mile car and the Leaf was a 100 mile car. In other words it will go 150-160 miles on a charge in the real world. Still, a big improvement over the status quo.
Krugerrand
Meow
stopcrazypp
Well-Known Member
There's another thread on this. The difference between a crossover and a wagon is the height, although there are some wagons that sell as "sports activity vehicles" (or something similar). And that height impacts aerodynamics.
Given a wagon vs a hatchback, the hatchback tends to sell (much) better in the USA. I'm pretty sure the base Model 3 will not be a crossover, as Tesla has hinted that they would build a separate crossover (likely named Model Y) based on the Model 3 (similar to Model X vs Model S).
Similar threads
