Autel 50 amp MaxiCharge for Tesla Y

[starise]

I have a 50 amp Autel charger capable of 48 amp charging I originally bought to use with a different EV.
I have electrical wiring experience.
In order to be compliant with code here, and in order to get the full 48 amps, I need a 60 amp breaker and 4 gauge wire. I can also lower my charging expectations and use 6# wire and a 50 amp breaker but that limits me to around 35 amps instead of 48. I would then lower this rate using the Autel app to 35 amps. To me this seemed a waste if I could have full 48 amp charging ability.
My questions are-

Is there a disadvantage to battery life charging at 48 amps .vs charging at the lower 35 amps? Or should I even charge lower for battery health?

I guess the plug type on the Autel is a more 'typical' EV plug and I have read I might need a Tesla adapter to use this charger to charge a 2023 Model Y LR. Can you tell me if Tesla provides this adapter?, or will I need to buy it?, and if so is there a certain type or product of adapter I should look for?
Thanks.

 

[jjrandorin]

Is there a disadvantage to battery life charging at 48 amps .vs charging at the lower 35 amps? Or should I even charge lower for battery health?

No (all level 2 home charging is slow charging to the car). There is no battery health reason to charge lower than the Level 2 maximum rate the car can take. There can be plenty of other reasons though, like not wanting to upgrade home wiring, load calculations not supporting the max charge rate, etc.

No "for battery health!" reason though. Setup whatever is convenient for you and you want to setup, up to the max (60amp circuit, 48amp charging).

 

[jcanoe]

No disadvantage to the Tesla vehicle or battery when charging using Level 2 (240V) at the maximum supported 48 amp rate of the Tesla Model Y versus lower amperage. (Some data exists that charging at 40 amps might be slightly more efficient.) 48 amp charging may require the Tesla vehicle to perform some additional cooling of the charging components, possibly the battery. The Tesla Model Y will automatically cool (or warm) these components as required.

The industry standard Level 1 (120V) / Level 2 (240V) in the US and Canada is the J1772 connector. Tesla vehicles sold in the US and Canada use Tesla's connector. To charge a Tesla vehicle using a J1772 charging connector you simply use the provided Tesla SAE J1772 charging adapter. This adapter is included with every new Tesla vehicle sold in the US, Canada. Additional Tesla J1772 adapters are available from Tesla's online store at Tesla.com for ($50 US). In this way you can keep a spare adapter or have one at home and one in the vehicle at all times.

 

[fiehlsport]

The car comes with the adapter you'll need. The Tesla Wall Connector has the right plug, is less expensive than the Autel unit, and allows you to open the charge door wirelessly with a button on the handle.

No reason to go Autel unless you plan on getting a different non-Tesla EV within the next few years.

#4 Romex and a 60A breaker = Set your unit to 48A
#6 Romex and a 50A breaker = Set your unit to 40A
#6 THHN in conduit and a 60A breaker = Set your unit to 48A

No need to dip below 40A with any of these scenarios.

 

[starise]

Thank you both @

jjrandorin​

and @

jcanoe​

I'm too new here to like posts apparently. This has been very helpful. Now I just need to get the charger wired in before the car comes. Nice to know an adapter is included, however I think i would like that spare that was recomended to keep in the car for on the road chargers using J1772.

 

[jjrandorin]

No reason to go Autel unless you plan on getting a different non-Tesla EV within the next few years.

I read the OP as saying they already had this connector. If one already has a connector from some other brand, might as well use that one unless there is some glaring reason why they cant.

Thank you both @

jjrandorin​

and @

jcanoe​

I'm too new here to like posts apparently. This has been very helpful. Now I just need to get the charger wired in before the car comes. Nice to know an adapter is included, however I think i would like that spare that was recomended to keep in the car for on the road chargers using J1772.

(1) of the J1772 adapters comes with the car, but if you want to leave it on your home connector (charger), you can purchase another one from tesla.

SAE J1772 Charging Adapter

Compatible with most Level 2 public charging stations, the J1772 Adapter supports charging speeds up to 19.2kW. This product comes standard with purchase of any Tesla vehicle. Includes: 1x SAE J1772 Charging Adapter Note: Compatible with all Tesla vehicles. Tesla does not regulate pricing or...

shop.tesla.com

 

[starise]

The car comes with the adapter you'll need. The Tesla Wall Connector has the right plug, is less expensive than the Autel unit, and allows you to open the charge door wirelessly with a button on the handle.

No reason to go Autel unless you plan on getting a different non-Tesla EV within the next few years.

#4 Romex and a 60A breaker = Set your unit to 48A
#6 Romex and a 60A breaker = Set your unit to 40A
#6 THHN in conduit and a 60A breaker = Set your unit to 48A

No need to dip below 40A with any of these scenarios.

Much appreciated. I still haven't decided whether to run the wire as Romex or as THHN in conduit. THHN makes it easier for connections but more work using conduit. Short run at under 30' I picked the Autel up from a guy who demos them, so it's new but I didn't pay a new price for it. I picked it up when I was considering another non Tesla EV. Otherwise I would have simply bought the Tesla setup.

One unique thing I learned about the Autel is I could set it up to sell charges to others if they have an RFID. Not something I would normally do, but if I were a landlord and had one installed I could charge people to use it.

I can't seem to find 4/2 wire. All of it is 4/3. I should not need the extra ground if I'm not using a sub panel.

 

[starise]

Is 19.2 kw a limitation of any kind?

 

[davewill]

Much appreciated. I still haven't decided whether to run the wire as Romex or as THHN in conduit. THHN makes it easier for connections but more work using conduit. Short run at under 30' I picked the Autel up from a guy who demos them, so it's new but I didn't pay a new price for it. I picked it up when I was considering another non Tesla EV. Otherwise I would have simply bought the Tesla setup.

One unique thing I learned about the Autel is I could set it up to sell charges to others if they have an RFID. Not something I would normally do, but if I were a landlord and had one installed I could charge people to use it.

I can't seem to find 4/2 wire. All of it is 4/3. I should not need the extra ground if I'm not using a sub panel.

My last install I went with conduit run on the wall rather than opening drywall. Seemed easier to me.

 

[jcanoe]

Much appreciated. I still haven't decided whether to run the wire as Romex or as THHN in conduit. THHN makes it easier for connections but more work using conduit. Short run at under 30' I picked the Autel up from a guy who demos them, so it's new but I didn't pay a new price for it. I picked it up when I was considering another non Tesla EV. Otherwise I would have simply bought the Tesla setup.

One unique thing I learned about the Autel is I could set it up to sell charges to others if they have an RFID. Not something I would normally do, but if I were a landlord and had one installed I could charge people to use it.

I can't seem to find 4/2 wire. All of it is 4/3. I should not need the extra ground if I'm not using a sub panel.

Another wire option; metallic clad (MC). For use in attics, unfinished basements, inside walls (not for use underground or in wet/damp environments.) MC is available in 6/2, 6/3 using THHN. MC eliminates the need for installing conduit. Available in standard pre-cut lengths with MC connectors. There are some how-to videos that demonstrate/explain how to install MC wire. (You must wear heavy duty work gloves.)

 

[fiehlsport]

I can't seem to find 4/2 wire. All of it is 4/3. I should not need the extra ground if I'm not using a sub panel.

4/2 does not exist as far as I've seen.

Is 19.2 kw a limitation of any kind?

19.2Kw is 80 Amps, only a few vehicles use that, though more will in the future. Shouldn't be applicable to any of your equipment now.

 

[starise]

My last install I went with conduit run on the wall rather than opening drywall. Seemed easier to me.

The thought of using plastic conduit crossed my mind.

Another wire option; metallic clad (MC). For use in attics, unfinished basements, inside walls (not for use underground or in wet/damp environments.) MC is available in 6/2, 6/3 using THHN. MC eliminates the need for installing conduit. Available in standard pre-cut lengths with MC connectors. There are some how-to videos that demonstrate/explain how to install MC wire. (You must wear heavy duty work gloves.)

I really like this idea because there is a small attic area above the garage. It gets very hot op there in the summer..

4/2 does not exist as far as I've seen.

Not sure why. Maybe because most who use it are going to a sub panel.

19.2Kw is 80 Amps, only a few vehicles use that, though more will in the future. Shouldn't be applicable to any of your equipment now.

Seems like overkill for the application even. Thanks!

 

[jcanoe]

If you use 6/2 MC (THHN) wire rated for 75C (167F) or 90C (194F) the attic temperature in summer should not be an issue. The attic temperature in summer would probably not exceed ~140F except maybe close to the rafters. You could place a wireless thermometer in the attic during the summer, observe the highest temperature.

 

[starise]

If you use 6/2 MC (THHN) wire rated for 75C (167F) or 90C (194F) the attic temperature in summer should not be an issue. The attic temperature in summer would probably not exceed ~140F except maybe close to the rafters. You could place a wireless thermometer in the attic during the summer, observe the highest temperature.

Thanks for those temperature specs. @jcanoe

I have kicked around several ideas on a 35 amp charge .vs a 48 amp charge or the difference between #6 and #4 wire. Obviously the 35 amp limit is going to be the least expensive of the two. I tend to overbuild things, so I'll probably be looking at #4 wire and 48 amps. I have considered that going to the limit of the charger might be pushing it which could shorten the life of the charger. I really have no proof this could happen, but knowing a little about electronics and heat I made that assumption even though it is within the design limits of the charger. More amperage means a faster charge, so there's that too.

I might be able to pull two #4 THHN and a ground through a conduit in the attic. TBH I would probably prefer THHN over Romex because I think it agrees with the terminals on the charger better.

 

[jcanoe]

Thanks for those temperature specs. @jcanoe

I have kicked around several ideas on a 35 amp charge .vs a 48 amp charge or the difference between #6 and #4 wire. Obviously the 35 amp limit is going to be the least expensive of the two. I tend to overbuild things, so I'll probably be looking at #4 wire and 48 amps. I have considered that going to the limit of the charger might be pushing it which could shorten the life of the charger. I really have no proof this could happen, but knowing a little about electronics and heat I made that assumption even though it is within the design limits of the charger. More amperage means a faster charge, so there's that too.

I might be able to pull two #4 THHN and a ground through a conduit in the attic. TBH I would probably prefer THHN over Romex because I think it agrees with the terminals on the charger better.

For a 60 amp circuit, you only need #4 wire if you use NM-B (Romex), is rated for up to a 70 amps. If you use THHN in conduit or MC then you can use #6 wire, is rated for up to 75 amps.

 

[davewill]

I have kicked around several ideas on a 35 amp charge .vs a 48 amp charge or the difference between #6 and #4 wire. Obviously the 35 amp limit is going to be the least expensive of the two. I tend to overbuild things, so I'll probably be looking at #4 wire and 48 amps. I have considered that going to the limit of the charger might be pushing it which could shorten the life of the charger.

Just a small correction, 35a charging isn't a choice on the wall connector. The available choices are 32a, 40a, and 48a for 40a, 50a, and 60a circuits respectively. The on-board charger has three different charging circuits, each capable up to 16a, all three working together make the 48a maximum. We have seen a number of these circuits die, leaving a car suddenly limited to 32a or even 16a charging. When charging at 32a and below only two of the circuits are used. One could make the argument that charging at 40a, which would cause each circuit to take 13.3a of the load, might be slightly less stress on them, I suppose.

Edit: Apparently this 35a thing is something from the Autel EVSE. See below. Sorry.

 

[jcanoe]

The Autel 48 amp rated EVSE, app supports 35 amp charging.

 

[starise]

For a 60 amp circuit, you only need #4 wire if you use NM-B (Romex), is rated for up to a 70 amps. If you use THHN in conduit or MC then you can use #6 wire, is rated for up to 75 amps.

Not being disagreeable, but going back to ohm's law I find these rules odd. Aside from the temperature and shielding characteristics of the various wires, to me copper is copper and a said size 'should' carry the same current. Here is something I c/p'd from the web that mirrors your comments.

Can 6 AWG carry 60 amps?

60 amp wire size is either 6 AWG or 4 AWG wire (AWG stands for American Wire Gauge; standard wire sizing is the US) for 220V voltage. An amateur will use a 6 AWG wire size for 60 amp 220V. A professional will always use 4 AWG wire size for 60 amp 220V.

I don't want to throw this off. I understand we are only discussing 48 amps max. HOWEVER to maintain the correct percentage of allowable load by most local codes, we would then need a 60 amp breaker. You are saying I only need A if I use B. I get that different a wire type may be more resiliant to certain conditions. No matter what the wire size is, a loose or bad connection will produce heat at the location because it has the same effect as reducing wire size. Bad contact at maximum amperage will always overheat. Overheating is what I want to avoid even if it's more expensive in the end

What the rule you quoted seems to imply is a wire in conduit is safer, therefore it's ok to make it smaller and not worry about increased heat at higher currents..

Just a small correction, 35a charging isn't a choice on the wall connector. The available choices are 32a, 40a, and 48a for 40a, 50a, and 60a circuits respectively. The on-board charger has three different charging circuits, each capable up to 16a, all three working together make the 48a maximum. We have seen a number of these circuits die, leaving a car suddenly limited to 32a or even 16a charging. When charging at 32a and below only two of the circuits are used. One could make the argument that charging at 40a, which would cause each circuit to take 13.3a of the load, might be slightly less stress on them, I suppose.

Thanks for the correction. I was not aware the internal charging on a Tesla works like this. In the case of my Autel. There is a phone app that connects to it through wifi that lets me adjust incriments in current. The concern for me which might be unfounded is that if I install a 35 amp max setup, someone in the future, or even myself could accidentally set charging to 48 amps causing overheating of the run. Also I wanted to be covered for the future in case the demands are more.
In one post I read, a poster commented Tesla doesn't need a 'smart' charger because the car itself figures it all out, so i seem to have some redundancy in having an adjustable smart charger hooked to a Tesla.

 

[jcanoe]

Cerro Wire Ampacity Charts. (I grew up near a Cerro Wire factory on L.I., NY where ground water contamination occurred. I will probably, literally die on this hill.)

Cerrowire Resources - Ampacity Charts

 

[starise]

Cerro Wire Ampacity Charts. (I grew up near a Cerro Wire factory on L.I., NY where ground water contamination occurred. I will probably, literally die on this hill.)

Cerrowire Resources - Ampacity Charts

I hope not
Back when I was doing lots of wiring, we seldom went over #10. Occasionally we might use #8. I am probably a little foggy on my wire gauges and sizes with their respective ampacities since this has been awhile ago. If it's my house which is made of wood and would burn easily, I want to be extra careful Would much rather be wrong about being right and make the required corrections, than being wrong thinking I'm being right.