Are the european and american superchargers different? Why?

[FlasherZ]

Ok, that makes sense -- they didn't do that wiring in the car, they did it in the wall connector. That's how I assumed they would do it. Good, and THANK YOU!

 

[mgboyes]

Nope, it was wiring in the car.

EU spec and US spec are very very different. For example, Tesla don't even sell the UMC here. But, as miimura says, the blue Mennekes stuff they do provide is pretty good quality.

Nope it was neither.

EU/UK Model S cars all have dual chargers in them. Well... the UK ones certainly all do.

You can see this if you connect a single charger car to a 32A single phase source, set a current limit of say 28A, and start charging. The car ramps up from 0 to 14A, then pauses, then ramps from 15-28A. That's because the master charger starts first, checks the supply quality, and then powers up the slave. On the other hand if you set a limit below 16A the car just runs immediately up to that power level, because the master charger can handle it on its own.

If you only pay for single charger then the car limits itself to 16A per phase on three phase sources.

Tesla considered "bridged 3 phase" in the UK to get around this but changed their minds.

Getting 40A into the car single phase using this sort of unconventional wiring is fine, but I am skeptical that they will ever deliver 80A since there's no way to signal 80A pilot on a Type 2 connection, and the cabling/connectors are only rated to 63A for AC.

Also Tesla sell UMCs in all the European markets. They didn't have a UK UMC at the time of UK launch, but do now. It's not bundled with the car but it's an optional accessory.

 

[GSP]

Type 2 uses the same pilot signal as Type 1 J1772. It goes up to 80 Amps.

GSP

 

[DITB]

3 into 1 at the wall connector. This should illustrate (blue is N, then gray, black and brown and the Ls):

Mark, I don't understand this at all: How can you have all three phases connect directly? There is 380V AC between each phase. I am trying to think what did I miss here, but I can understand FlasherZ questioning this - I don't get it either.

- Earth
- 0
- L1
- L2
- L3

Connect either L to 0 and you have 220V (or 230, 240)

Connect either L to another L and you have 380V (or 400V)

Connecting all three Ls together would have the fuse go in a split second (or if no fuse, fry the entire box)

 

[miimura]

@DITB, you missed the key point - This is a single phase EVSE. There is only Earth, Neutral and one Live wire coming to the EVSE from the utility. The combined wires you are seeing are the vehicle side, not the utility side. This is how Tesla distributes the voltage to all three sub-chargers in the car.

 

[FlasherZ]

Mark, I don't understand this at all: How can you have all three phases connect directly? There is 380V AC between each phase. I am trying to think what did I miss here, but I can understand FlasherZ questioning this - I don't get it either.

- Earth
- 0
- L1
- L2
- L3

Connect either L to 0 and you have 220V (or 230, 240)

Connect either L to another L and you have 380V (or 400V)

Connecting all three Ls together would have the fuse go in a split second (or if no fuse, fry the entire box)

Think the other way around. The power supply is single-phase. To use the higher power from the power supply, they connect all three phases in the type 2 connector to the single-phase power supply, that way all the sub-chargers will load balance across the single-phase supply instead of limiting the car to 16A (single charger) or 32A (dual charger). You don't blow a fuse because the only power supplied is a single-phase L-N voltage (230V).

 

[sunnyvale]

Elon Musk did mention for Model 3 that will be unique world wide

 

[StefanSarzio]

Elon Musk did mention for Model 3 that will be unique world wide

Do you have a link to that statement?

 

[markwj]

Nope it was neither.

EU/UK Model S cars all have dual chargers in them. Well... the UK ones certainly all do.

You can see this if you connect a single charger car to a 32A single phase source, set a current limit of say 28A, and start charging. The car ramps up from 0 to 14A, then pauses, then ramps from 15-28A. That's because the master charger starts first, checks the supply quality, and then powers up the slave. On the other hand if you set a limit below 16A the car just runs immediately up to that power level, because the master charger can handle it on its own.

If you only pay for single charger then the car limits itself to 16A per phase on three phase sources.

Tesla considered "bridged 3 phase" in the UK to get around this but changed their minds.

Getting 40A into the car single phase using this sort of unconventional wiring is fine, but I am skeptical that they will ever deliver 80A since there's no way to signal 80A pilot on a Type 2 connection, and the cabling/connectors are only rated to 63A for AC.

For a time, Tesla delivered UK cars with dual chargers, software limited. I suspect that they did that to get around the public charging single phase 32A issue (where a single charger car would be limited to 16A). That wasn't so for the Hong Kong cars (which are EU style connector).

Now, over the past six months things have changed again. Now, the on-board chargers have a 'relay box' (Tesla's wording, not mine) capable of re-wiring the three phase lines at the car side. Cars with a single one of those relay box chargers can charge at single phase public chargers, up to 32A. Owners of the older style single chargers here can now request a free swap to a relay box style charger.

Tesla also seem to have pretty much given up on the idea of 80A single phase for European style connector cars. That promised 80A single phase wall connector is now two years late, and I doubt if they will ever provide it. Personally, I gave up and switched to a Tesla three phase 32A wall connector - and am very happy with the 21kW I get in my dual charger equipped car.