18" wheel and tire weigh 49 pounds, 20" wheel and tire weigh 52.5 pounds. That's only 3 and a half pound difference. The rotors and calipers are guaranteed lighter than non upgrade, which offsets the weight gain. When I test drove the P I didn't notice any harsh ride, it was smooth. Tesla is using thicker sidewalls than their competitors, an 18" Audi or BMW tire would usually be 40 aspect, whereas Tesla it's 45. If you put PS4S on your 18" wheels you will take just as big of a range hit. I personally think 19" is the right size wheel, but that's just my opinion. But thinking somehow 20" wheels are like boat anchors compared to the 18" wheels doesn't make sense.
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Any Performance owners regret not getting the perf upgrade package?
- Thread starter Nisesen
- Start date
Hmm... so you're saying the +10K over AWD is worth it to gain 1 sec 0-60, but +15K over AWD is not worth it to gain:
- 1 sec quicker 0-60
- higher top end speed to 155
- sport-tuned lowered suspension
- performance summer tires
- brembo BBK
- exclusive software like track mode
- more expensive wheels (like them or not)
- vanity upgrades of spoiler, painted calipers, pedals
It seems dollar for dollar you get most with AWD. It seems the poorest value for the money would be the P3D-...
That said, if your goal is to just have that 1 sec 0-60 and customize the rest as you go forward then more power to ya. It would seem, however, the better deal would be to customize an AWD version. Using words in your description of P3D+ like "dumb", "bling" and "stupid" makes it seem as though you have some conflict about not choosing that version... or maybe frustration that some of it is not available a la carte (which I think it should be).
Yes. That's exactly what I'm saying.
Just because I'm willing to spend $10k on something I want doesn't mean I should spend another $5k on something I don't want. And the PUP not only adds things I don't want - it takes away things that I *do* want.
The mild annoyance is that they packaged good things together with dumb things, and charged too much for it.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
You already get this with the 10k. The extra 5 doesn't change it.
In Germany this might be worthwhile- in the US it won't be for 99% of drivers.
There's 0 evidence this exists.
The 5k gets you a 0.39 inch lower suspension. It's possible this is entirely from the control arm change that corrects the geometry for the 20" wheels (and which anybody gets buying the 20" wheel package they've been selling since before the P existed).
If they were really doing a serious sport tuned suspension you'd likely have seen a more significant drop. Right now nobody has shown actual proof the shocks or springs or sway bars change at all for the 5k upgrade.
You can get these for around 800-1000 bucks, not 5000, on the lighter stock 18s.
Which is smaller than aftermarket kits, makes aftermarket wheel fitment harder, and a BBK in general is useless outside of a non-drag track, and 99% of car owners never go to such a track.
This is, likely, a significant value add. But we can't actually know for sure until we get the details about how it works, where it works, when it works, and a lot more. And how it will compare to what aftermarket folks like MPP are going to offer.
I mean, obviously if you're in the not camp this isn't "worth" it to gain
All of which you can add much cheaper yourself if you really want some or all of em.
Yup- which is why an AWD is what my order is for.
Given the P and AWD acceleration seem to differ mainly down low and 90+% of my drive every day is highway I'd almost never use the extra down-low power the P offers, nor do I plan to non-drag track the car often enough for that or the + items to matter at all.
Except there's aftermarket solutions for every item in the 5k package other than top speed.... there's no aftermarket solution at all for the extra 1 second 0-60 in the base P.
So to those for whom that 1 second matters significantly they literally have no other choice but to upgrade to the P. If they further upgrade to the + depends on if the + content is worth it- as I note there's lots of cases where it's not (and obviously some where it is- maybe more depending on what track mode offers compared to say what MPP is going to offer for disabling nannies)
Went to a friend's delivery of an AWD non-performance. Great car, but I got to drive it and floor it from a stop. Previously I had been regretting spending the money for the P- over the AWD. After that, I have no regrets whatsoever, before even having driven the P. Been in P90DL for 2 years, but turning that in at the end of the month - the effortless power has become part of the Tesla experience for me. Dropping from ~3s to 60 to 4.5 would have been too much for me.
In retrospect if they had made track mode part of the P+ package when I was ordering, I would have ordered it. Joke's on Tesla for not taking more of my money. I think it makes it evident just how much they are winging this whole thing.
In retrospect if they had made track mode part of the P+ package when I was ordering, I would have ordered it. Joke's on Tesla for not taking more of my money. I think it makes it evident just how much they are winging this whole thing.
So the P3D- is the worst value, and therefore I should pay an extra $5k to get stuff I don't want. And now it's a better value?
Makes sense to me!
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I didn't say what you consider to have value, just which option has more value in general.
I wonder what the take would be like if there were no P at all. Only AWD with the following options:
$10K:
0-60 improvement to 3.5 sec
$5K:
- higher top end speed to 155
- sport-tuned lowered suspension
- performance summer tires
- brembo BBK
- exclusive software like track mode
- more expensive wheels (like them or not)
- vanity upgrades of spoiler, painted calipers, pedals
What if these options could be bought independently ($5K, $10K or both)? I bet AWD buyers would see the $5K as the better value.
Perry
Active Member
I am not that desperate about any product to buy things I don't want for $5000 just to have it earlier. Now if I were to lose the CA tax brake because of it, then maybe. But then I would have to sell all the stuff I got for $5000.
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The P3D- is roughly 50% faster than the AWD from 0-30 and 20% faster from 30-60mph.
Th P3D- upgrade provides a different (and to many, a more enjoyable) day-to-day driving experience than the standard AWD model. It drives (feels) like a different car.
The performance add-on package has a negligible impact on the day-to-day driving experience. It is more about aesthetics. The only “feature” that affects off-track performance (handling) is the PS4S summer tires, and you can add those to the P3D- for $800.
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You replied to my post and used the words "you", "your", and "worth it" a whole bunch or times. Reread it.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
Errr... that is the P option.
The only other thing the 10k gets you is the "option" to also buy the 5k package.
In Germany this might be worthwhile- in the US it won't be for 99% of drivers.
There's 0 evidence this exists.
The 5k gets you a 0.39 inch lower suspension. It's possible this is entirely from the control arm change that corrects the geometry for the 20" wheels (and which anybody gets buying the 20" wheel package they've been selling since before the P existed).
If they were really doing a serious sport tuned suspension you'd likely have seen a more significant drop. Right now nobody has shown actual proof the shocks or springs or sway bars change at all for the 5k upgrade.
You can get these for around 800-1000 bucks, not 5000, on the lighter stock 18s.
Which is smaller than aftermarket kits, makes aftermarket wheel fitment harder, and a BBK in general is useless outside of a non-drag track, and 99% of car owners never go to such a track.
This is, likely, a significant value add. But we can't actually know for sure until we get the details about how it works, where it works, when it works, and a lot more. And how it will compare to what aftermarket folks like MPP are going to offer.
I mean, obviously if you're in the not camp this isn't "worth" it to gain
All of which you can add much cheaper yourself if you really want some or all of em.
Probably not, since most of them are useless in US street driving- while the 0-60 bump IS useful for a decent % of street drivers.
But then again- since the 10k one is literally already available to those AWD owners obviously they didn't think either package was worth the cost.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
I can afford a P100D- but I don't want one... too large, handles well for a giant heavy car but still handles like a giant heavy car, etc...
Likewise folks who can afford the 3 package that forces 20" wheels and other not-much-good-on-the-street items on you might not want those either despite having the money for em.
I don't understand why you need to defend yourself. I'm just simply saying, buy what you can afford and who cares what others think on the internet. lol
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
I'm not defending me- I'm defending the idea 'what you can afford' isn't a reason to buy options you might be able to afford, but don't necessarily want... because some folks don't seem to understand why someone might not want, or see much value in, some of the options.
silentcorp
Member
Jesus, this thread is a bunch of people arguing semantics. Get it together folks!
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