Air Suspension Gallery Pressure all over the place?

[geordi]

I'm still trying to repair my suspension system and it would seem that there is YET ANOTHER problem in my X.

I have replaced the pump which had been destroyed by running too much, and the air spring which had been leaking down and threw a detectable error. THOUGHT I had it all worked out.... Now the gallery pressure will only go above 2 bar when the pump is actively running, and the pump will bring it up to what seems to be 10 bar (takes a long time) but then as soon as the pump stops it will make one fast "fwoosh" noise and the gallery pressure will instantly drop to 2 bar. It seems to leak down further than that while parked but the suspension remains up which is at least an improvement. I suspect something remains wrong but cannot source an issue. There are no detectable leaks and no errors in the computer.

http://www.gatoraudio.com/tesla.mov

Thoughts? Here's a video (if it posts) of what is happening. I don't know why it goes into jack mode on its own when trying to lower the suspension - but it also doesn't come all the way down, the rear stays up. I'm guessing that the valve block is the root cause at this point but have no proof of that.

 

[brainhouston]

I'm guessing that the valve block is the root cause at this point but have no proof of that.

would be my guess too, specifically the solenoid for galley one. Check voltage on this one to make sure its not always open.
i think they all NC (normally closed) solenoids n open to let air in/out
since all springs stay up, those solenoids are closed
schematics are on teslas website, u can make a pigtail n test each solenoid (just for education, i think they all one unit so can't replace single one)

What locaion is woosh sound ? audio is terrible, can't hear much...

 

[geordi]

Sorry - The audio was inside the car and some doorknob outside was running their diesel truck at the same time, wouldn't go away. I can't tell where the noise comes from either b/c you need to be outside the car and it shuts the pump off as soon as I try getting out. VERY annoying for diagnosing!

The valve block is replaced as a unit, so it's all or nothing - I found one on Amazon for Friday delivery for $90, so I did that already. I'm not going to bother messing with the wiring b/c of that.

I also need to sort out the valve retrofit, but then it won't be getting filled with magical nitrogen either b/c I don't have a tanker of that... so that may have to wait.

 

[brainhouston]

Sorry - The audio was inside the car and some doorknob outside was running their diesel truck at the same time, wouldn't go away. I can't tell where the noise comes from either b/c you need to be outside the car and it shuts the pump off as soon as I try getting out. VERY annoying for diagnosing!

Need that buddy system hehe

The valve block is replaced as a unit, so it's all or nothing - I found one on Amazon for Friday delivery for $90, so I did that already. I'm not going to bother messing with the wiring b/c of that.

I also need to sort out the valve retrofit, but then it won't be getting filled with magical nitrogen either b/c I don't have a tanker of that... so that may have to wait.

I run with no N2 for 15k mi already with no issues.
But im in PNW, barely ever below freezing...

 

[geordi]

I'm reasonably sure the nitrogen is just a starting point but the system ends up with air on board fairly quickly. The intake line seems to be through a small drier canister so it shouldn't be bothered, and it isn't like it needs ZERO humidity or it will turn to a pumpkin. The components just won't like it if there is water building up... But that shouldn't bother anything overall unless it is excessively wet.

 

[geordi]

Replaced the valve block today and it is doing exactly the same thing. Pressure will get up to 10 bar while the pump is running, but then the computer decides that it has run too long and shuts it off and the gallery pressure instantly drops down to about three bar and continues falling slowly. I have sprayed everything and cannot find a leak.

Trying to get the fill valve retrofit kit and some tubing right now. Not feeling very confident because the Tesla service guy is asking what the tubing is for, and asking if it is related to the air suspension. After I already identified it as such. Hoo boy.

The computer will only allow the pump to run for about 90 seconds.

 

[geordi]

The service center ended up being a waste of time, they don't have any of their valve kits and it would be more than a week AND $55 to get one. For a tee and a valve. Hmm... No.

Off to Home Depot where I confirm that their 1/4OD tubing is just a shade larger exterior than Tesla's 6mm tubing (they SHOULD be the same but this is what you get buying from China, Elon!) the brass tubing tee wasn't impressive, it doesn't seal on Tesla's tubing properly so I may have to try one of the push-lock plastic ones, but I was able to seal it enough to try pressurizing the tank. I got it up to 120 psi with a small battery compressor and in less than a second (with NO SOUND of leaking at all!) the pressure was down to 20 psi and then zero. AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH.

So tomorrow I'm going to dig back under that mess to try and get the tubing off the reservoir and try directly connecting my replacement (1/4" OD) tubing to the tank, and pressurize THAT. If it doesn't leak, then I can work back and at least have isolated something that works.

Headbanging continues.

 

[geordi]

Ok... Got the air line fittings and 6mm line - which is *just* a shade too small for the tension clips of the Tesla connections. Of course it is. So instead I have a short section of Tesla hose coming out of the tank, and another on the valve block - with nice pretty blue flexible tubing in between, and a length of soft blue tubing to a schrader valve on the same line to enable filling from outside sources.

Filled to 130 psi, no leaks. When I discovered that the tubing didn't lock into the valve block properly, it proved that the air comes from the reservoir VERY nicely.

Turn the car on.... And the gallery pressure is STILL showing 2.5 bar???? Measure using the routine and it says the gallery pressure is 5.5 (still not accurate but better)... BUT the damn thing now says that the pump isn't developing pressure when energized. Where is the pressure sensor?

As an added bonus, when I when I try to depressurize the entire system after it has given the error about the pump not developing pressure - it just ignores me.

 

[oldsport]

how about removing the whole air suspension system and use stronger springs...

 

[geordi]

Progress update - The low / variable gallery pressure must be getting reported from the valve block. I had gotten a replacement valve block from Amazon - cracked. Brilliant chinesium trash. Ordered a replacement, and the numpties at Amazon decided for some reason to ship the thing not to the address they had JUST sent to... But to a completely different state! Yes it was another of my addresses, but jeez.

Dealing with a service center for a different car (MCU upgrade) so I asked them about the valve block - $125 where the Chinesium one was $90... Yeah, I'll have one of those then. That difference isn't enough to deal with the trash. Got it installed.... And the line to the reservoir is leaking down STILL but I can't find any bubbles. That was when I installed that blue 6mm hose which fit the Tesla fittings but doesn't hold in the locking device (blew out of the valve block and hosed me off with the reservoir air.... BUT the cheap blue hose ALSO burst in the mid-point twice so clearly it isn't "working load 140 psi" as they claimed. 1/4 (6.35mm) tubing from Home Depot and the amazon push fittings to the rescue, and it FINALLY seems to be holding air properly with the Tesla tubing at each end (reservoir and valve block) and the replaced tubing in between.

The compressor still runs when I wake the car up, but only for about 2 seconds now - I've only heard it once though. HOPEFULLY that's the end of this, take it on a long drive yesterday and the power usage seemed good on the highway - 340-375 wh/mi in the hills of NJ/NY/CT around and above NYC at ~75mph. Previously I was about 100-150 wh/mi higher for the same conditions so I think this is happy and normal again.

And then yesterday afternoon it starts making a screech sound from the right front wheel.... B/c now I need to replace the wheel bearing AGAIN?

*bangs head on wall repeatedly*

Yeah, another $275 to the service center b/c clearly that chinesium bearing is trash and only lasted 30k miles. blarg. Probably going to have to do the rest soon too now.

 

[brainhouston]

Yeah, another $275 to the service center b/c clearly that chinesium bearing is trash and only lasted 30k miles. blarg. Probably going to have to do the rest soon too now.

i bought used oem hub on eBay for $40
didn't feel like paying tesla ~280 n don't trust chinesium...

 

[geordi]

Pulled the wheel off and found what I had first suspected - a damnned ROCK had gotten up behind the rotor and was jammed / singing on the stupid shield behind that. Wheel bearing seems to be fine, will hold onto the new genuine bearing for a future need.

Shield has now been removed, that will permanently prevent THAT from happening ever again. What a racket that made!
www.gatoraudio.com/tesla2.mov

 

[Trotto]

Ok... Got the air line fittings and 6mm line - which is *just* a shade too small for the tension clips of the Tesla connections. Of course it is. So instead I have a short section of Tesla hose coming out of the tank, and another on the valve block - with nice pretty blue flexible tubing in between, and a length of soft blue tubing to a schrader valve on the same line to enable filling from outside sources.

Filled to 130 psi, no leaks. When I discovered that the tubing didn't lock into the valve block properly, it proved that the air comes from the reservoir VERY nicely.

Turn the car on.... And the gallery pressure is STILL showing 2.5 bar???? Measure using the routine and it says the gallery pressure is 5.5 (still not accurate but better)... BUT the damn thing now says that the pump isn't developing pressure when energized. Where is the pressure sensor?

As an added bonus, when I when I try to depressurize the entire system after it has given the error about the pump not developing pressure - it just ignores me.

I've got an issue with the "woooosh" pressure outlet too. Compressor running hot just to let the air out.

But please follow me on this theory: - Since the air suspension system ideally is a closed loop system, the compressor moves the pressurized air between the reservoir tank and air strut - thus the tank pressure will vary depending on the ride hight.
I did the following measurement on the res.tank between folllowing ride heights:

Very high - tank pressure 2.5 bar
High - tank pressure 5 bar
Normal - tank pressure 8 bar

I did not try low setting, but I would guess the tank pressure then would be around 10-11 bar.
It seems logical that tank pressure is low when strut pressure is high?

What ride height did you have when measuring the tank pressure?

 

[geordi]

I don't know where the idea of this system being "sealed" or "closed loop" ever came from, but it isn't. To minimize the pump cycling, the tank is pressurized only as needed, probably more often while connected to power. Then that is drawn down to replenish the suspension as you drive.

The compressor doesn't seem to have a way to pull from the suspension and push into the tank. The instructions for charging the tank with nitrogen are just because you don't want moisture into the system if you can avoid it and that's a fair bit of volume at 200 psi. But the make-up air that is drawn through the (very small and not really capable) drier can, is going to slowly introduce moisture anyway over time.

The tank pressure does not seem to vary (nor should it) with ride height.