Why is there still a chance to upgrade to Sig??

Dunno the answer to #2, but it is possible *still* to have cancellations. People just not able to pull the trigger on the purchase at this point, maybe folks deciding that they really want the grey or blue or green color that isn't available on Sig but they can get in 3-6 months with the Perf.

The Sig premium is still substantial, especially if you don't particularly want the red color.

People are deferring, I doubt there is anything else going on. It's free to defer, I might to get Sunset Red :biggrin:

*shrug* for some $5000 is a substantial amount of money. For others it is a side bet, I guess.

Silver color -- try it in the design studio for the Sig Performance. I see 4 colors available, one of which is silver. Of the other colors I mentioned, none were silver. ... What I'm getting at is that silver is also available for non-Sig, but that particular shade of red is unique to Sig. So the premium is quite real to folks who want a non-Red color, like Silver. And if they really want a color not in the Sig set then they must get a production vehicle.

pguerra said:

What do you mean substantial? I thought it was only about a $5k difference.
What do you mean if I don't want the red color? I want the silver color...am I not able to get this color for Sig Performance??

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Depends on what you're after. When I open up Model S Design Studio | Tesla Motors in two windows, one with sig and one with regular, and punch in my wanted options, it turns into a $10k premium.

And like Jason, $10k or $5k... it's not nothing.

I suspect the Sig wait list is empty now (if anyone here on TMC is on it and hasn't heard from T, please speak up); there seem to have been deferrals to R or P or worse, cancellations.

Can't explain why for sure but atleast some folks might have deferred for colors or might have just realized that the Sig premium wasn't getting them much and that they could wait it out for a low-enough P?! Or, they realized that they weren't willing to be guinea pigs for identifying early bugs?! Or, lastly, financial troubles (very unlikely, I know)?!

I've be told several times by Jeremy at the LA store that Tesla plans something "special" for Signature owners. I hope it's something worth waiting for. When I got my launch edition Lexus LS600hL, in addition to the special badging and interior bits on the car I also received a very nice set of custom leather travel bags, a second set of custom floor mats, nice matching leather bound owner's manuals and a very nice Lexus jacket. I hope Tesla does something similar. I think this will take the sting out of the $5-$10K "signature penalty".

pguerra said:

1) In early June, Tesla emailed and called and told me "congratulations"... they chose me from the waitlist to upgrade to the Sig version which I would receive in Aug/Sept. Just deposit $35k now.
2) I waited a few days and then declined b/c I wanted to see reviews of the car first - and also it was worrying me that Sig reservation holders were giving up their spots.
3) Now that the Model S is released now, I have read all the reviews published so far now (all rave reviews). So today I asked Tesla if it's not too late to upgrade to Sig still (about 3 wks later after declining the upgrade originally).
4) Surprisingly, Tesla told me today: yes, I can still upgrade to the Signature version ("we've had more deferrals"). Despite rave reviews, you'd think all Sig's would be sold out by now right?

Question:
1) What's going on here? Is Tesla really making 1000 Sigs....or are they making more but not telling us? Or are there not enough Sig reservation holders?
2) If Tesla goes bankrupt, how will this affect the value of a silver Model S Sig Performance? Increase, decrease or have no effect on the vehicle's price?

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First of all, Tesla would likely be acquired before going bankrupt. Toyota already has a substantial investment in Tesla and would likely snap it up, with Daimler waiting in the wings.

As to the value of the Model S Signature Performance, it is pure speculation to think about the vehicles value. Likely it will have a substantial value decades from now regardless. But in the near term the value will fall just like any other car.

As to question #1, who knows? Only about 30 cars have been manufactured, why is it necessary that the Sigs be sold out at this point? 1,000 were reserved, but test drives have barely begun and if just 10% of the reservation holders defer it would likely have wiped out the wait list, especially considering that wait list folks are likely less committed just as you proved to be. The reviews you were holding out for just happened in the last few days. Nothing to say that fence sitters wont sell out the Sig in the next week or the next month as major publications perform long, instrumented reviews.

gg_wants_a_tesla said:

I suspect the Sig wait list is empty now (if anyone here on TMC is on it and hasn't heard from T, please speak up);

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I'm on the waiting list and haven't heard from TMC. I put a deposit down on 9-May-12 (P8766)

I would have deferred (S802) to get blue and save a few bucks (don't want the 21" wheels or audio upgrade), but I was told if I did I would move to the place in line I would have had if I made a P res last November. That would have pushed me out at least six months and I just can't bear to wait. Can I afford it? No, but c'est la vie.

At least 20% deferrals, downgrades, or cancellations from the signature list. But no problem, since plenty of people are eager to move up. My gut says only a very few opted to cancel outright. And among cancellations, some have reported that they're holding out for the Model X.

On the buyout issue, Elon is very serious about staying an independent company, and should that change, I believe Daimler has first refusal rights in the event of a buyout.

araxara said:

I'm on the waiting list and haven't heard from TMC. I put a deposit down on 9-May-12 (P8766)

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Thanks for that, araxara. Might be worth pinging Tesla to get an update on how deep you might be on the wait list?!

I wouldn't get too upset over the availabilities of Signature series automobiles that might be available.

I'm sure a lot of Sig reservation holders have had a number of either personal, financial, or practical reasons to cancel or defer at this point.

The stock is up (although slightly down this AM). The majority of the reviews are overwhelmingly positive. Personal reviews from drivers are positive.

$40k is a big chunk of change. The economy is not as healthy for some. People might want other or fewer options. Some people might just be playing it safe. Others may have purchased a new car out of necessity.

My thought is that the availability has more to do with that than any fear that Tesla may go under or that the car is an under performer.

Sent from my Nexus S 4G using Tapatalk 2

I can't speak for anyone else, but I dropped from Sig to GP at the last minute because I LOVED the look of the Pearl White Performance and hated the idea of paying $5,000 just for a signature badge and early delivery. I'm sure there are lots of reasons for Sig spots to become available.

DrComputer said:

I've be told several times by Jeremy at the LA store that Tesla plans something "special" for Signature owners.

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I used to believe that, given the pricing. But over half of all sigs have already locked in, so the "surprise" is clearly not an inducement to buy. Plus they have even shipped some sigs, and none of the owners have reported any special surprises.

Along those lines, other reasons for Sig buyers to drop out include information that Tesla is still not giving us. Will there be a "sig surprise"? What are the details on the warranty, especially the battery portion? Is there an extended warranty available? Will we ever be able to DC fast charge anywhere--if so, when and where? When will HPC adapters and aero wheels be available? What's the range effect of aero wheels, active suspension, spoiler, etc? How much does the 3G service cost, and are you locked in to a contract? Some people--in fact, I would think most people--don't like paying $100k for a car without details like that; and given that they are already shipping the cars, they must know most of the answers. I'm trying to wait as long as I can for info, but I may cancel my order entirely if they don't give us any information on fast charging (Superchargers and/or CHAdeMO adapters). I don't need another EV; I just want one that allows me to sell my gas car. An EV without the fast charging they have promised for years does not provide that.

ChadS said:

I used to believe that, given the pricing. But over half of all sigs have already locked in, so the "surprise" is clearly not an inducement to buy. Plus they have even shipped some sigs, and none of the owners have reported any special surprises.

Along those lines, other reasons for Sig buyers to drop out include information that Tesla is still not giving us. Will there be a "sig surprise"? What are the details on the warranty, especially the battery portion? Is there an extended warranty available? Will we ever be able to DC fast charge anywhere--if so, when and where? When will HPC adapters and aero wheels be available? What's the range effect of aero wheels, active suspension, spoiler, etc? How much does the 3G service cost, and are you locked in to a contract? Some people--in fact, I would think most people--don't like paying $100k for a car without details like that; and given that they are already shipping the cars, they must know most of the answers. I'm trying to wait as long as I can for info, but I may cancel my order entirely if they don't give us any information on fast charging (Superchargers and/or CHAdeMO adapters). I don't need another EV; I just want one that allows me to sell my gas car. An EV without the fast charging they have promised for years does not provide that.

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I think you're right, Chad. I know that I've thought more than once, "By the time my Model X is delivered, there should be more apps/superchargers/questions answered/etc'. I appreciate the Model S buyers sorting all this out.

Tesla said that they will come forward with information on their planned network of superchargers in July. July starts in just a few days.

ChadS said:

I used to believe that, given the pricing. .... Plus they have even shipped some sigs, and none of the owners have reported any special surprises.....

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Tesla has had a history of owners just receiving packages in the mail form Tesla so discounting a surprise on it's timeliness might be premature.

Dutch Solar said:

Tesla said that they will come forward with information on their planned network of superchargers in July. July starts in just a few days.

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You're right, Elon said that on the investor call. But I talked to GeorgeB about it on Sunday, and he doesn't think the announcement will come until after July, after all Sig buyers have locked in. He said the announcement is waiting on Elon to pull the trigger (I got the impression George wanted to say something sooner; but I'm just guessing because George did not say that--he's a good team player and a straight shooter, I'm happy he's there). The announcement may be more exciting coming later with more details; but a complete lack of information now makes it really hard to make buying decisions.

Not only have they had my $40k deposit for a long time because I was expecting fast charging, the whole reason I bought the Roadster when their future looked very uncertain was to enable them to get to where they could offer a fast-charging car. But now they're asking me to buy a second $100k car without knowing if I will ever be able to fast charge it, despite the fact that I live in an area with a lot of CHAdeMO chargers. Given that the very simple and inexpensive "text on charge interruption" feature they said they were working on for the Roadster in April 2010 has still not been delivered, I'm not inclined towards just trusting them to do something as expensive and difficult as a Supercharger network in a timely fashion without some general locations and an approximate schedule.

The lack of information is really annoying to those of us being asked to lock in, and I'm positive it is contributing to the sig defections. It's too bad, because Tesla is doing so many other things so well.