It's improving over time. Some updates regress and feel worse, and some improve markedly. But over time it's gotten better at least for me.
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Vision Only vs Radar - Observations from a 3 year owner
- Thread starter richa65
- Start date
I have owned one for about 6 months now and have not noticed any improvement (or changes).
JohnB007
Member
I'm still on 2022.3.101.1 (only one week old), and finally had a chance to drive for more than an hour on a narrow 2-way road, 80km/h speed.
Unlike 4-way highways (which works really really well for me), this was a semi disaster. Semis cause PB about 50% of the time, and once, it decided to drop to 40km/h with no cars around me. I did notice we were going up hill and there were tree shades.
In short, it really is as bad as some are claiming here, but only on certain type of roads and it is almost predictable.
I hope the latest update will fix this. Fortunately, 2-lane roads are not very high on my frequent trips but it would be nice if this is fixed.
Still loving all other aspects of the car though, still discovering positive surprises...
Unlike 4-way highways (which works really really well for me), this was a semi disaster. Semis cause PB about 50% of the time, and once, it decided to drop to 40km/h with no cars around me. I did notice we were going up hill and there were tree shades.
In short, it really is as bad as some are claiming here, but only on certain type of roads and it is almost predictable.
I hope the latest update will fix this. Fortunately, 2-lane roads are not very high on my frequent trips but it would be nice if this is fixed.
Still loving all other aspects of the car though, still discovering positive surprises...
Are you sure you're not mixing Autopilot and TACC because it only warns while activating the Autopilot on non divided highways (it states that over limit is limited to +10 km/h). If TACC can only be used on highways, what the heck am I supposed to use as CRUISE CONTROL on rural roads or any other types of roads??? Do you realize the nonsense you've just wrote?
It looks like some users are experiencing noticeable improvements with 2022.4.5.17 (although none is stating what version they had before). Do people here see the same kind of improvements with this new version ?
rxlawdude
Active Member
Yes, Autopilot has the more significant restrictions, but I err on the side of caution and avoid TACC on non-highway (non-divided) roads. Both my cars have radar and I can see why vision only can cause PB by oncoming traffic on any road not perfectly straight.
Dumb cruise as an option would obviate the problem.
JohnB007
Member
I'm still on the original version, 2022.3.101.1, after receiving the car 11 days ago.
I had a chance to visit a friend about 100km away in a country town. Roads are mostly sub 100km/h 2-lane roads divided by a dotted line. Lots of gentle curves and gentle ups and downs - perfect condition for PBs. I drove pretty much the entire trip with AP ("double click").
As expected, I experienced many PBs in both directions. I tried to figure out under what condition this occurs and by the time we are half the way through the travel, it became quite predictable.
When I (or the car) can't see the road far ahead, and when I start to see the roof of the oncoming car lining-up on my lane, the car PBs pretty much 100% of the time.
I thought about why I don't PB in those situations when driven manually. Then I realized I simply trust that the other driver will do the right thing and stay on his lane. I often only visually confirm when the other car is much closer, and in some cases that happens awfully close - may even be too close to avoid collision if that driver happens to be drunk driving on my lane.
So perhaps humans give benefits of doubts to other drivers more so than what the current FSD Betas do towards other drivers? It can't be that difficult to reduce the FSD threshold to reduce PB right now but I suppose Tesla doesn't want FSDs to cause crash and make it on the big media, at least for now.
Some are reporting that the newer firmware are improving PB experiences, so I remain hopeful.
I had a chance to visit a friend about 100km away in a country town. Roads are mostly sub 100km/h 2-lane roads divided by a dotted line. Lots of gentle curves and gentle ups and downs - perfect condition for PBs. I drove pretty much the entire trip with AP ("double click").
As expected, I experienced many PBs in both directions. I tried to figure out under what condition this occurs and by the time we are half the way through the travel, it became quite predictable.
When I (or the car) can't see the road far ahead, and when I start to see the roof of the oncoming car lining-up on my lane, the car PBs pretty much 100% of the time.
I thought about why I don't PB in those situations when driven manually. Then I realized I simply trust that the other driver will do the right thing and stay on his lane. I often only visually confirm when the other car is much closer, and in some cases that happens awfully close - may even be too close to avoid collision if that driver happens to be drunk driving on my lane.
So perhaps humans give benefits of doubts to other drivers more so than what the current FSD Betas do towards other drivers? It can't be that difficult to reduce the FSD threshold to reduce PB right now but I suppose Tesla doesn't want FSDs to cause crash and make it on the big media, at least for now.
Some are reporting that the newer firmware are improving PB experiences, so I remain hopeful.
So we are over a year since the original posted had the issues and we still have the same experiences. 2021 model 3 here. Radar for first 14 months of ownership. Absolutely fell in love with it and I’m a “I like to drive and have control of the car” kinda guy. It got me to convince a couple family members to get the car. Dad got his y with no radar and his autopilot would do things I never experienced
I finally got the vision only update a month or two ago and it is so bad and not even comparable to radar, I cannot even use simple cruise control. Took mother in law on a 2 hour trip to a Concert and 20 minutes already have 4-5 phantom braking incidents that I’m apologizing for. Haven’t had a road trip without countless phantom brakes and random slow downs. Mainly cresting over hills and patches in the road, but also when the sun is low and behind you, casting a shadow in front of the car. Almost un driveable, and I refuse to drive at night now with how bad the auto high beams are and how you need them
I used to be the guy defending Tesla saying they are great despite their quirks but now I legit tell people to just wait until another manufacturers or the public catches up with charging networks to get an ev
Driving my brothers newish Volkswagen with cruise and lane centring for a long stretch with no issues really was the nail in the coffin for me on how bad Tesla really is right now at basic features
Does anyone know if there is a lawsuit or something because this is not the same car I bought and fell in love with ?
I finally got the vision only update a month or two ago and it is so bad and not even comparable to radar, I cannot even use simple cruise control. Took mother in law on a 2 hour trip to a Concert and 20 minutes already have 4-5 phantom braking incidents that I’m apologizing for. Haven’t had a road trip without countless phantom brakes and random slow downs. Mainly cresting over hills and patches in the road, but also when the sun is low and behind you, casting a shadow in front of the car. Almost un driveable, and I refuse to drive at night now with how bad the auto high beams are and how you need them
I used to be the guy defending Tesla saying they are great despite their quirks but now I legit tell people to just wait until another manufacturers or the public catches up with charging networks to get an ev
Driving my brothers newish Volkswagen with cruise and lane centring for a long stretch with no issues really was the nail in the coffin for me on how bad Tesla really is right now at basic features
Does anyone know if there is a lawsuit or something because this is not the same car I bought and fell in love with ?
Yes, there is a lawsuit in the works. The plaintiff is requesting class-action status. If it's granted, you'll be notified by the court for your participation in the class. You can also do a few Google searches and keep an eye on the case if you're afraid you'll be left out.
Very similar experiences. I updated from a radar enabled version to Tesla Vision only, which wasnt part of the release notes... only reason I even noticed the car was now radar only was that min following distance was 2... reading the release notes after update, the "welcome to Vision only" was buried... apparently the SW version skipped over...
Update to today, we had the first real rain on a drive from Gig Harbor Washington to Portland Oregon. The car was constantly throwing up Blue Warnings of limiting speed due to limited visibility dropping speed 10~15 MPH... the visibility was fine and I could see dozens of car lengths in front of me... needless to say I was constantly nannying the speed and getting rapid messages to keep my hands on the wheel... was the worse than last year's snow storm... not enjoying the car at all any more...
IMHO the quality of the puny cameras in my August 2022 M3LR is terrible compared to the 2015 MS, that car could drive for hours on the highway in one camera basic AP with correct distance keeping, the single top mounted lens was about x3 larger. Even my reverse camera PQ is yellowed out and pixelated compared to the old car. Minimum investment, max profit, corporate rules. Between this and the phantom braking (nonexistent for 8 years in my 2015 car) I am never using even basic AP, especially since they eliminated turn signal induced lane changes. Don't get me wrong, I love driving and the stiff road feedback suspension of the M3 with the tiny instant response steering wheel is exactly what this former gokart driver (3.5 decades ago I won 2nd place at regionals in high school) needed. Overall very happy M3 owner, but that price!!!
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I have a 2020 model 3 so it went from radar to vision only with the update. Just wondering if anyone else noticed their car not really maintaining following distance consistently now. It's almost like my car is always either moving closer or further away from the car in front of me while on autopilot. It just constantly does it. I'm am wondering if this is just my car or if it's something they have to do with vision only.
Maybe it's how they calculate depth perception?
I am going to try the camera calibration. See if that fixes it. Maybe it's just my car.
Maybe it's how they calculate depth perception?
I am going to try the camera calibration. See if that fixes it. Maybe it's just my car.
I had similar issues the month or so before they turned off radar, but yes, it has also gotten much worse after it was turned off entirely.
In Apr 21 the car was amazing at keeping designated speed and distance... last few months it has slowly drifted further and further back needing more nannying. Now I all it does is center lane keep while I constantly giggle the steering wheel and control speed while the screen flashes blue telling me to keep my hands on the wheel.
This is not normal behavior, guys. There are many people with near flawless AP on vision only. It's important to make sure the cameras and GPS are working well. Calibrate the cameras, and check your GPS to make sure it's perfectly accurate (zoom in and make sure your car is showing on the road and not off the road, even a little).
I have my follow distance set to 7, as I like more of a cushion since traffic in SoCal goes from 80 to 0 for no reason. My car follows the car ahead well, keeps the distance pretty accurately. It's not instant, meaning if the car ahead accelerates, the Tesla will accelerate to close the gap, but may do so slower than you're used to.
I have my follow distance set to 7, as I like more of a cushion since traffic in SoCal goes from 80 to 0 for no reason. My car follows the car ahead well, keeps the distance pretty accurately. It's not instant, meaning if the car ahead accelerates, the Tesla will accelerate to close the gap, but may do so slower than you're used to.
JohnB007
Member
A agree with Dewg.
Just came back from 3000km long vacation, and AP was near flawless. My wife doesn't drive, and she wants me to keep AP on all the time. I also do almost 300km drive every weekend, and the results are similar.
I am really puzzled why some people's experiences are so much worse. AP was REALLY bad when I first got the car 6 months ago. It's not even comparable now.
If your car is only 6 months old, you only know what Tesla Vision is capable of, and never experienced Radar enable driving.
If you've only ever eaten an orange, hard to compare it to apples.
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