Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

SolarCity (SCTY)

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Blake, thanks for transcription!

CFO also said powerwall is seeing "off the charts" demand, more then anticipated. He also said Solarcity may grow faster if ITC is not extended.

CTO Peter Rive said they already have micro grids set up internationally and are seeing strong demand in general. CTO also noted that California is pay $190 per kW year, potentially more then the $10 per kW month mentioned in Greentech article. 50/50 cut with customer already built into the customers contract right now. Peter also noted the powerwall is a two man lift and there are handles alread imbedded within the powerwall for this lift and installation onto a wall.

CFO said they hired 1300 people in Q1 or 433 new employees/month. So at total at the end of Q1 ~10250 employees.

CEO is very pleased that total installation costs stayed flat as they carried more overhead then installed. COO Tanguy Serra noted they are hiring and developing capacity in a just-in-time process to not get ahead of deployment growth with costs. A whole sophistacated algorithm to hire and grow capacity in balance.

Also, big negotiations on aggregation and capital stream already being conducted for 2016. Big ABS offering on its way soon.

overall, beat on top and bottom. Company record bookings at 237MWs. Contracts grew by 1.2bln well over the $800mln inQ4. Prospects into the future are good.

Potential areas to track: Arizona SRP lawsuit. Right now in discovery process, no court date set yet. However, as soon as the case is settled, Lyndon Rive said they will continue the growth in Arizona.
California rate change will have a positive effect on growing solarcity's market.

He didn't actually say "off the charts" demand, unfortunately, but he implied it. Here is my transcription of what he said in the quarterly call with regards to the power wall:

"As many of you know, we announced new versions of our solar battery systems in all of our business units: commercial and government, microgrids, and residential. We're seeing great growth in commercial and microgrid offerings and the new Tesla batteries are helping to widen the addressable markets where we can offer those systems. On the residential side, our fully installed solar battery system costs are about 1/3rd of what they were a year ago. We expect costs to decline further as manufacturing scales, and over the next 5 to 10 years, these cost reductions will make it feasible to deploy batteries by default with all of our solar power systems. Our solar back-up battery system will sell for $5000 as an add on to a lease or a PPA, which is comparable to other backup generator options. It is important to note that the Tesla price of $3500 doesn't include the inverter, permitting, installation, management software, and electrical equipment to wire the circuits that need to be backed up. All of those things are included in our turn-key service in our solar battery systems. Interestingly, the residential backup generator market is actually larger than solar, with over 3.5% of residential customers having back-up generators. The industry leader in this space had over a billion dollars in revenue last year, and had seen a 12% compound annual growth rate over the past 10 years. Now extending the appeal of SolarCity to the traditional market is interesting, but it's a small part of the strategic interest we have in batteries. Batteries spread throughout the distribution system can lower the costs of maintaining the grid and new market structures designed to take full advantage of this benefit appear likely in several states. Our products, and by that I mean the contracts (?) as well as the management software is grid services ready and as these markets develop, there's a 50/50 revenue share model embedded in the contracts that we have with our customers. Now, we're not in the position to estimate what these revenues could be, but it's interesting to note that in California, its currently estimated to cost $190 per kW per year to meet new peak loads. The other strategic options that batteries make available to us are hedges against bad policy outcomes, with examples being changes in net metering and solar penalties like high fixed (?) charges. As always, Hawaii is a postcard from the future, the high electric rates there make economic now what will be affordable in other markets with further cost reductions. As a result, we will be offering a 0 down lease in Hawaii next year that will give customers the ability to go completely off grid. With that said, I want to reinforce that customers removing themselves from the grid is a bad policy outcome. There's so much value in distributed energy resources, so we're hopeful that utility business models will adapt to embrace solar with batteries rather than penalize adoptions, which in turn will encourage good defections (???)."

The question marks are me second guessing myself over what word he actually said.

EDIT: Foghat is correct, I'm quoting the CTO, Peter Rive, and he's quoting the CFO at a later time in the conference call (I can't seem to find where he said that without re-listening to the whole thing). Oh well, I guess I'll wait for the Seeking Alpha transcript.
 
Last edited:
He didn't actually say "off the charts" demand, unfortunately, but he implied it. Here is my transcription of what he said in the quarterly call with regards to the power wall:

"As many of you know, we announced new versions of our solar battery systems in all of our business units: commercial and government, microgrids, and residential. We're seeing great growth in commercial and microgrid offerings and the new Tesla batteries are helping to widen the addressable markets where we can offer those systems. On the residential side, our fully installed solar battery system costs are about 1/3rd of what they were a year ago. We expect costs to decline further as manufacturing scales, and over the next 5 to 10 years, these cost reductions will make it feasible to deploy batteries by default with all of our solar power systems. Our solar back-up battery system will sell for $5000 as an add on to a lease or a PPA, which is comparable to other backup generator options. It is important to note that the Tesla price of $3500 doesn't include the inverter, permitting, installation, management software, and electrical equipment to wire the circuits that need to be backed up. All of those things are included in our turn-key service in our solar battery systems. Interestingly, the residential backup generator market is actually larger than solar, with over 3.5% of residential customers having back-up generators. The industry leader in this space had over a billion dollars in revenue last year, and had seen a 12% compound annual growth rate over the past 10 years. Now extending the appeal of SolarCity to the traditional market is interesting, but it's a small part of the strategic interest we have in batteries. Batteries spread throughout the distribution system can lower the costs of maintaining the grid and new market structures designed to take full advantage of this benefit appear likely in several states. Our products, and by that I mean the contracts (?) as well as the management software is grid services ready and as these markets develop, there's a 50/50 revenue share model embedded in the contracts that we have with our customers. Now, we're not in the position to estimate what these revenues could be, but it's interesting to note that in California, its currently estimated to cost $190 per kW per year to meet new peak loads. The other strategic options that batteries make available to us are hedges against bad policy outcomes, with examples being changes in net metering and solar penalties like high fixed (?) charges. As always, Hawaii is a postcard from the future, the high electric rates there make economic now what will be affordable in other markets with further cost reductions. As a result, we will be offering a 0 down lease in Hawaii next year that will give customers the ability to go completely off grid. With that said, I want to reinforce that customers removing themselves from the grid is a bad policy outcome. There's so much value in distributed energy resources, so we're hopeful that utility business models will adapt to embrace solar with batteries rather than penalize adoptions, which in turn will encourage good defections (???)."

The question marks are me second guessing myself over what word he actually said.

I think you're quoting the CTO. I'm quoting the CFO Brad Buss(former Tesla board member). Brad Buss during the conference call said "off the charts" for powerwall. He's pretty emphatic. I especially like his line about competitors putting two "bullets to the head" since they won't be prepared with the necessary cost structure post ITC.

as your quoted CFO statement, I think it is very important to note the new revenue model with aggregation asset model with utilities. This could get very interesting for solarcity's bottom line quickly as powerwall deployments rise. Rive said they expect to include powerwall by default in 5-10 years, so it could prove to be a significant area for modeling potential future retained value(essentially NPV) which is not currently part of that forecast on any analyst coverage assessments.
 
I think you're quoting the CTO. I'm quoting the CFO Brad Buss(former Tesla board member). Brad Buss during the conference call said "off the charts" for powerwall. He's pretty emphatic. I especially like his line about competitors putting two "bullets to the head" since they won't be prepared with the necessary cost structure post ITC.

as your quoted CFO statement, I think it is very important to note the new revenue model with aggregation asset model with utilities. This could get very interesting for solarcity's bottom line quickly as powerwall deployments rise. Rive said they expect to include powerwall by default in 5-10 years, so it could prove to be a significant area for modeling potential future retained value(essentially NPV) which is not currently part of that forecast on any analyst coverage assessments.

Yeah, I was quoting the CTO. But I found your quote of the CFO in the seeking alpha transcript on page 5.

"And in the interim I mean neutral demand for the backup generation that we just announce has been off the charges and way beyond our expectations."

I think you misquoted him, as he said, "off the charges"
:tongue:

This is what I am pretty sure he said:

"And in the interim, I mean, the (indiscernable) demand for the backup generation that we just announced has been off the charts and way beyond our expectations."

Anyone can listen for themselves between 33:45 and 34:00 in the webcast.
 
Elon on the conference call:

Pretty much "sold out" through the middle of 2016 within the first week of the offering Powerwall. 38k Powerwall reservations. Could dedicate all gigafactory capacity with overall storage demand trend at the moment.

There it is... Solarcity is booked through mid 2016 already.
 
Last edited:
http://www.utilitydive.com/news/maine-senator-unveils-unprecedented-federal-distributed-energy-bill/394599

Looks like the transformation is going to happen. Federal bill to force utilities to value distributed solar (distributed energy resources DER). Either they debundle costs and benefits, or utilities will be forced to buy DERs through 1978 law...Looks like combative utilities are being counter attacked in the court room and in federal legislature now.Solarcity clearly to benefit big time as a result.
 
http://www.utilitydive.com/news/maine-senator-unveils-unprecedented-federal-distributed-energy-bill/394599

Looks like the transformation is going to happen. Federal bill to force utilities to value distributed solar (distributed energy resources DER). Either they debundle costs and benefits, or utilities will be forced to buy DERs through 1978 law...Looks like combative utilities are being counter attacked in the court room and in federal legislature now.Solarcity clearly to benefit big time as a result.
This link worked for me: Maine senator unveils unprecedented federal distributed energy bill | Utility Dive
 
http://www.utilitydive.com/news/maine-senator-unveils-unprecedented-federal-distributed-energy-bill/394599

Looks like the transformation is going to happen. Federal bill to force utilities to value distributed solar (distributed energy resources DER). Either they debundle costs and benefits, or utilities will be forced to buy DERs through 1978 law...Looks like combative utilities are being counter attacked in the court room and in federal legislature now.Solarcity clearly to benefit big time as a result.

This couldn't come at a better time. I like how this sets out principles for states to work through. This leaves open possibilities for DER aggregators to provide rational intermediation between DER owners and lessors and the utilities. I don't think any of us want to be trading 3 kW of storage capacity in real time, but sign me up with an aggregator who can trade on my behalf and I'll be happy.
 
Really abnormally low noise level in here. This company is a rock star and in the end their SP will dwarf TM. Well, that's what I speculate. :confused: Don't tell anyone though!

I agree completely ... unless you include Tesla Energy.... That being said I am 100 percent overweight in SCTY right now.

There seems to be very solid resistance at 62 and some weak support at 61.50. The last few days it has stayed in that channel or at least got back in it by close every day. I would love to hear what the TA looks like on SCTY. I think if we can hold above 62 things could get pretty exciting pretty quick but I am getting a little worried about falling back down.

I would hate to see 48 again without making any moves .. but sure don't want to clear this margin I have held so long right before we break to new ATH's. With no 2016 guidance last ER I dont expect it untill Q4 although I guess Q3 makes just as much sense so who knows.

It will get really interesting if they factory construction finishes on time/early and SCTY can get production up without too many hiccups.
 
I agree completely ... unless you include Tesla Energy.... That being said I am 100 percent overweight in SCTY right now.

There seems to be very solid resistance at 62 and some weak support at 61.50. The last few days it has stayed in that channel or at least got back in it by close every day. I would love to hear what the TA looks like on SCTY. I think if we can hold above 62 things could get pretty exciting pretty quick but I am getting a little worried about falling back down.

I would hate to see 48 again without making any moves .. but sure don't want to clear this margin I have held so long right before we break to new ATH's. With no 2016 guidance last ER I dont expect it untill Q4 although I guess Q3 makes just as much sense so who knows.

It will get really interesting if they factory construction finishes on time/early and SCTY can get production up without too many hiccups.

62 appears to be a tough nut. But its been done before. I don't know enough to do a proper TA. I also would enjoy seeing TA.

I observe Lyndon and Peter's conviction and it's like "THE FORCE" is very strong with those two. They are relentless in the company's growth. The team they have around them is rock solid. I'm also very pleased with their strategic acquisitions of Silevo and Zep Solar. Not to mention cousin Elon Musk being Chairman of the board. :wink:
 
Have the Rive's (or Elon) ever mentioned a 'blind faith' future market cap estimate for SCTY?

I've been thinking about that. They've got a 1 million customer goal for mid-2018. This corresponds to a certain level of retained value, which as a measure of enterprise value seems like it could lead to a sensible long-term price target. I don't have the details handy, but I do intend to post this soon.

Update... I found an earlier post that works through these assumptions to arrive at a $240 long-term price target for end of 2018. A 4-bagger in 3.5 years would be quite nice.

SolarCity (SCTY) - Page 118
 
Last edited:
One thing to contemplate regarding SolarCity's long-term growth rate is that in a few years SolarCity intends to include storage, specifically Tesla's Powerwall and Powerpack products, with every installation. This is important because it links the growth rate of Tesla Energy with the maximum growth rate for SolarCity. So if Tesla Energy grows at only 50% per year long term, then SolarCity cannot sustainably grow any faster.

Now is this a limit on SolarCity, which has been growing about 90% per year, or does it suggest that Tesla will rise to the challenge of going it Power lines fast enough to keep up with SolarCity?

Seriously, I think SolarCity needs to take an equity stake in a Tesla Gigafactory. They need to lock in this supply to fuel their continued growth.
 
I've been thinking about that. They've got a 1 million customer goal for mid-2018. This corresponds to a certain level of retained value, which as a measure of enterprise value seems like it could lead to a sensible long-term price target. I don't have the details handy, but I do intend to post this soon.

The one million customer goal is so aggravating to me. Management has alluded to how at some point it will start looking ridiculous as a goal and I think we are there. I will be very disappointed if they do not exceed their goal significantly and I think they should have updated it by now to match managements actual goals. Maybe they will announce an updated goal when they announce 2016 guidance. That would really force a lot of shorts to cover.

SolarCity CEO Lyndon Rive Defends His Companys Long-Term Business Strategy : Greentech Media Here is a really good podcast that I highly recommend for anyone Invested or thinking of investing in SCTY. It is the closest I have heard to the grand plan. If you want to skip to the future market cap estimate spot go to 7:30 . If you want to start at the beginning of Lyndon go to about 2:30 . The full part that includes Lyndon is about 30 or 40 minutes.

They currently have 218k customers and a net retained value of 2.7 billion. If my math is right that comes out to 12,385 dollars per customer. So if they hit their current goal of 1 million customers by mid 2018 then in q2 2018 they would have a net retained value of ~12.3 billion

That is oversimplified and does not account for the new factory in cost or returns after its operating. It is also low. If They continue their pace of nearly doubling every year they should hit 1 million customers closer to mid year 2017 then mid year 2018. Hitting either goal should reward current shareholders nicely.

I think the biggest risk is the factory and getting it up and running and producing (cheap) great quality panels. I think the risk is someone mitigated since New York picked up the tab for the factory and machines that go in it. They still have to make it work well though.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.