Real cost of charging the Model 3?

[Tezla1]

I recently bought an AWD M3. Prior to me buying the car, I read and heard a lot about how much "cheaper" it is to operate than an ICE car.

I'm trying to understand this & see where things fall for the average person who drives average.

I live in a single family house in SoCal and my Tier 2 rate is .25 cents/kWh, I generally use up my Tier 1 energy (356 kWH, .17/kwh) pretty quickly.

So, at .25 cents / kWH, what am I paying to drive my AWD M3 100 miles?

Is 27 kwh x .25 = $6.75/100 miles accurate?

Luckily, I charge a lot at work, where they have a Tesla charger, so I only charge the car at home about 4-5 times per month. So, I guess I'm paying roughly $40/month. If I charged at home exclusively, I'm guessing my cost would be $160/mo.

Am I calculating things correctly? What are your numbers?

 

[Daniel in SD]

Most people use more than the window sticker on AWD Model 3s. Also the window sticker does not include "vampire drain" so include another ~30kWh per month for that. A time of use plan should be able to get you way below $0.25/kWh though.Electric Vehicle Incentives

 

[redgt]

I recently bought an AWD M3. Prior to me buying the car, I read and heard a lot about how much "cheaper" it is to operate than an ICE car.

I'm trying to understand this & see where things fall for the average person who drives average.

I live in a single family house in SoCal and my Tier 2 rate is .25 cents/kWh, I generally use up my Tier 1 energy (356 kWH, .17/kwh) pretty quickly.

So, at .25 cents / kWH, what am I paying to drive my AWD M3 100 miles?

Is 27 kwh x .25 = $6.75/100 miles accurate?

Luckily, I charge a lot at work, where they have a Tesla charger, so I only charge the car at home about 4-5 times per month. So, I guess I'm paying roughly $40/month. If I charged at home exclusively, I'm guessing my cost would be $160/mo.

Am I calculating things correctly? What are your numbers?

it looks like it. you are averaging 270 watts/mile?

1000/270 = 3.70 miles per kWh

1 kWh = .25 (wow you need solar)

.25/3.7 = 6.7 cents per mile

gallon of gas 3.50/.067 = 52.23 mpge

 

[Dana1]

A different variation on redgt’s calculation...

310 miles/ 75kw = 4.13 miles per kw. $0.25/ 4.13 = $.06 / mile

If you have an ICE car that gets 25 miles per gallon, and gas is $2/gallon that’s $0.08/mile.

If gas is more expensive, or you don’t get 25 mpg, the differential widens. If you estimate maintenance costs on a per mile basis the differential widens. If you factor in your $0.17 time the gap widens.

 

[Daniel in SD]

A different variation on redgt’s calculation...

310 miles/ 75kw = 4.13 miles per kw. $0.25/ 4.13 = $.06 / mile

If you have an ICE car that gets 25 miles per gallon, and gas is $2/gallon that’s $0.08/mile.

If gas is more expensive, or you don’t get 25 mpg, the differential widens. If you estimate maintenance costs on a per mile basis the differential widens. If you factor in your $0.17 time the gap widens.

Your numbers don't include charger losses like the window sticker does. That's where the 270Wh/mi comes from.

 

[ewoodrick]

Living in CA and with gas prices being really low, the numbers aren't that far apart.

In most of the remainder of the country, electricity is half the price. Then wait for gas to go back to $5/g and the difference is much bigger

 

[Glamisduner]

I recently bought an AWD M3. Prior to me buying the car, I read and heard a lot about how much "cheaper" it is to operate than an ICE car.

I'm trying to understand this & see where things fall for the average person who drives average.

I live in a single family house in SoCal and my Tier 2 rate is .25 cents/kWh, I generally use up my Tier 1 energy (356 kWH, .17/kwh) pretty quickly.

So, at .25 cents / kWH, what am I paying to drive my AWD M3 100 miles?

Is 27 kwh x .25 = $6.75/100 miles accurate?

Luckily, I charge a lot at work, where they have a Tesla charger, so I only charge the car at home about 4-5 times per month. So, I guess I'm paying roughly $40/month. If I charged at home exclusively, I'm guessing my cost would be $160/mo.

Am I calculating things correctly? What are your numbers?

Probably, my bill went up like $400 a month charging my volt at tier 3 prices ($.53 per kWh). I have since switched to the EV TOU 5 plan, which means I now charge at .$.08 per kWh. Sure I'm no longer on a NEM1 plan, so I get ripped on solar a bit, but since most of my energy use is car charging it was still worth the change.

Living in CA and with gas prices being really low, the numbers aren't that far apart.

In most of the remainder of the country, electricity is half the price. Then wait for gas to go back to $5/g and the difference is much bigger

What cheap gas? Other states have gas at under $2 a gallon.
Here it's about $3.50 - near $4 for diesel

A different variation on redgt’s calculation...

310 miles/ 75kw = 4.13 miles per kw. $0.25/ 4.13 = $.06 / mile

If you have an ICE car that gets 25 miles per gallon, and gas is $2/gallon that’s $0.08/mile.

If gas is more expensive, or you don’t get 25 mpg, the differential widens. If you estimate maintenance costs on a per mile basis the differential widens. If you factor in your $0.17 time the gap widens.

You live in a much better state for gas prices

 

[Canuck]

Living in CA and with gas prices being really low, the numbers aren't that far apart.

Yes, just driving over the border 5 minutes from my house the gas goes from $1.40/ltr in BC ($5.30Can/gallon) to $1.79US/gallon Washington State. We have a carbon tax, transit tax, pay for our "free" medical, etc. so regardless of how low the price goes, we get milked -- with the pun intended since dairy is much cheaper down south too.

But then there's this: Under the Residential Conservation Rate, customers pay 8.58 cents per kWh for the first 1,350 kWh they use over an average two-month billing period. Above that amount, customers pay 12.87 cents per kWh for the balance of the electricity used during the billing period. And that's Canadian dollars (about 75cents to 1US$) so it's a lot cheaper up here to drive electric.

Prior to me buying the car, I read and heard a lot about how much "cheaper" it is to operate than an ICE car.

It is with free supercharging and a close supercharger, and every car Tesla made (excluding the old Roadster of course) included that until only recently, so keep that in mind too about what you read here a lot in the past. I think a lot of California people picked up the free electrons, especially with all the superchargers down there. If you're charging free at a supercharger down the street (there's 12 at a mall a few blocks from my office) it can end up being real cheap.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Note that the AWD window sticker is 29kWh/100miles, not 27kWh (or 26kWh) /100miles. So you should adjust your calculations for that.

As mentioned, if you don't charge at work, you've added a fixed monthly load to your home bill of about 30kWh due to vampire/phantom. As also mentioned, phantom/vampire is not included in the window sticker. The window sticker is probably not bad (for you!) for estimation purposes otherwise; it'll be a little higher in "winter" for you.

I'd consider solar if it's possible for you (or you could wait until work charging is no longer free, or when it becomes inconvenient). My opinion is that you should go pretty big on the array - I'd go for an 8kW system if you have room for it on your panel & your roof. Especially since you're routinely blowing through your Tier 1 even before you got the car, the payoff time might not be too bad. TOU isn't as good as it used to be with solar, but if you use AC, the solar may let you use some AC with a TOU plan, without paying a lot for it. Can be complicated to calculate...do it based on projections (not past use), and see whether it makes sense for your situation.

 

[roblab]

Yes, but don't just consider solar, do it because it's the right thing to do. If you don't use it all, just figure you're keeping some Nat gas or Oil out of the system. Then you don't have to spend hours calculating whether or not you should charge or wait for the sun to shine. No need for "complicated calculations" at all.

I should have taken the picture of the back side of my house, with 64 panels facing south by southwest. I pay PG&E about $10 a month for connection and Leck-a-Tricity. But it's not anything I worry about, whether I make a profit or not. For me, it's just right. Like spending extra to have two Teslas.

My wifey was just wondering what the life of the car is, as in Gas Cars only last a couple hundred thousand miles or so (I know, some go over that). Since I use near 25,000 a year just driving around, in the six years I've owned Tesla I've racked up 150,000 miles. If Teslas batteries live 15 years, that's pretty good life span, for a life mileage of near 400,000 miles. If they last more, good on us, matey!

 

[DR61]

Living in CA and with gas prices being really low, the numbers aren't that far apart.

In most of the remainder of the country, electricity is half the price. Then wait for gas to go back to $5/g and the difference is much bigger

Electric and gas prices vary greatly in California. My prices in northern CA are $.15/kWh (at any time of day) and $3.25 regular-$3.80 premium for gas. Our TM3D is costing $.05/mi if powered by local grid, but actually at my house $.03/mi with supplemental solar. A Prius would cost $.065/mi while our Volvo (closer in performance to the Tesla) costs $.15/mi.

 

[Needsdecaf]

I was keeping good logs on my GTI, and I ran a calculation after my first week of commuting.

The last tank before I turned in the GTI was an exceptionally good case. I got 29.1 MPG and paid the lowest for fuel (93 octane) that I had in 6 months at least due to the falling gas prices.

Likewise my first week of commuting was a poor efficiency week for the Tesla, given that it was in the low 40’s in the morning. My average wH/mile was about 310. I’m seeing averages in the 275 range now that it’s warmer.

I forget the actual numbers, but essentially I was nearly half the fuel cost with the Tesla. My fuel cost per mile for the GTI was 8.6 cents per mile. Using data from TeslaFi for only amount of charge added to get those miles, not using some wH/ mile calculation allows me to run the same comparison, as it is my true cost to power the car over that time, including any vampire drain (negligible) and charging losses (approximately 6%). My true cost to drive those 600 odd miles was about 4.4 cents per mile. Not quite half, but close. That’s worse case to best case.

Even figuring that, i’ll Drive the Tesla at least 20,000 miles this year. That saves me almost $850 in fuel / energy costs. That number will widen as gas goes back up and my wH / mile comes down. I just locked my electric rate for the next 12 months, and while it was good, it wasn’t the best I’ve ever gotten. Perhaps next year could be lower? The good news is Texas is a power to chose state and I can lock my rate for up to 3 years if I desire.

 

[ninpb]

Yes, but don't just consider solar, do it because it's the right thing to do. If you don't use it all, just figure you're keeping some Nat gas or Oil out of the system. Then you don't have to spend hours calculating whether or not you should charge or wait for the sun to shine. No need for "complicated calculations" at all.

I should have taken the picture of the back side of my house, with 64 panels facing south by southwest. I pay PG&E about $10 a month for connection and Leck-a-Tricity. But it's not anything I worry about, whether I make a profit or not. For me, it's just right. Like spending extra to have two Teslas.

I'm in nem 1, tier pricing not tou. I still try to only charge at night hoping it helps lessens grid load during peak and decreasing need for firing up power plants.

 

[andy92782]

Charging efficiency is another thing.

A standard NEMA 5-15 outlet (120V/12A = 1440W) adds 4 miles of range per hour. In my home, I charge at 240V/24A = 5760W, or 4x the wattage. Simple math says it should charge 4x faster (16 miles range/hr) but in reality, it's about 22 miles range/hr. So not only is 120V charging slow but it also wastes >20% of the energy. Over time that will add up...

 

[fluxemag]

I drive about 1000 miles per month in Oregon. At $3/gal and 20mpg on my BMW I was spending $150 a month on gas. My Model 3 is averaging about 260Wh/mi for 260kWh per month at $0.04/kWh on Time of Use. This is $10 per month on electricity, maybe $15 per month with vampire drain. No oil changes, belts, hoses, spark plugs etc. is also something to consider. I also got a $10k tax credit/rebate which covers my depreciation for a few years (maybe).

 

[Zythryn]

What are your numbers?

Since you asked...
To drive 100 miles it costs me about $0.40.

Now, I know that isn't helpful, as cost of electricity can vary widely, as can gasoline, although not as much.
In my case, I have solar PV panels. The cost above is based on the total cost of the panels minus the rebates and incentives divided by the total expected lifetime kWh.
This comes out to 1.5 cents/kWh cost which won't change for the next 30-40 years.

Solar wins, especially where electricity is expensive, in most cases. Some areas punish solar panel owners with outrageous connection fees. I don't believe CA is one of those areas though.

 

[Big Dog]

I'd consider solar if it's possible for you (or you could wait until work charging is no longer free, or when it becomes inconvenient). My opinion is that you should go pretty big on the array - I'd go for an 8kW system if you have room for it on your panel & your roof. Especially since you're routinely blowing through your Tier 1 even before you got the car, the payoff time might not be too bad.

Tier 1 for SCE barely keeps the lights on. If the OP is not spending much time in Tier 3, it's unlikely that solar will have any economic payoff, particularly since s/he charges at work. Also, ToU won't benefit either.

 

[AmandaC]

I recently looked at my 6 months of electric bills after June when we got our M3, compared to last year, and determined that I spent $19/mo extra on charging. Plus $31/mo at Superchargers (I’m guessing that was maybe a third of the charging). Previously I was spending $200-250/mo on gas (2006 Subaru Impreza, about 10 L/100 km). So cost is 1/5 to 1/4 of gas for us. Of course, gas is more expensive in Canada and our electricity overnight is about $0.08/kWh (nominally $0.06 but there are some delivery charges that are per kWh). Averaged around 2000 km/mo (1200 miles).

I’m curious what you pay at the supercharger...is it similar to your home rate? Ours is per minute so it adds up in the winter when the charge rates slow down, even with the two tiers.

 

[Dana1]

Your numbers don't include charger losses like the window sticker does. That's where the 270Wh/mi comes from.

The battery is a 75kW battery. Unless you’re running electricity along a 500 foot run I’m going with negligible. ICE per mile also ignores the drops of gasoline dripping on the cement or the gas that made it through the pump meter but is left in the line. If you factor in maintenance cost on a per mile setup the gap continues to widen. When I ran my numbers it was about $0.035 vs $0.14.

I find a per mile comparison is a fairer test unless you have some odd charging setup.

When I ran my numbers it was about $0.035 vs $0.14 charging and maintenance. I use a HPWC about 50 feet from dedicated breaker. I don’t observe any measurable losses but this stuff will vary from person to person.

 

[Big Dog]

ok, Alan, since you Disagreed with my post, you want to at least own it and show what is disagreeable? Perhaps post your math to show the solar payoff? (I have SCE and have run their numbers numerous times, and as a finance guy, they don't pan out unless the OP is a big user of electrons -- pool, spa, big family, et al. But in which case, OP would routinely be in Tier 3...)

btw: SD electron rates are much different than SCE.