Somehow this news doesn't surprise me; Obama has actually been dangerously conservative and unwilling to take risks, in my opinion. In the long run, it's a larger risk to be behind the trends, but he's never appeared to understand that. Oh well, I guess it's still better than "I'm sorry, I can't remember what I said my opinion was last week" Romney.
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More anti-ev gibberish
- Thread starter qwk
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Somehow this news doesn't surprise me; Obama has actually been dangerously conservative and unwilling to take risks, in my opinion. In the long run, it's a larger risk to be behind the trends, but he's never appeared to understand that. Oh well, I guess it's still better than "I'm sorry, I can't remember what I said my opinion was last week" Romney.
going further off topic....
In my region (the Finger Lakes), some sort of economic line got crossed recently. Electric heating is now price-competitive with gas heating, and the contractors I know say that people are now, quite often, ripping out gas heating to install electric heating. I wonder if this is cutting down on the direct winter gas demand. What do you think, Robert? Have you seen a trend towards removal of gas heating?
Of course, anyone reliant on heating oil or propane deliveries, common in the rural areas, has a *really* strong incentive to stop using them, as those prices are going through the roof; they're switching to either electric or wood pellet stoves. I would hope you've seen a trend towards removal of propane and heating oil systems!
I myself just ripped out a gas dryer and installed an electric dryer. It was sort of an accident. The gas line got cut during my other electrical work, and it turns out to be Wardflex and embedded in the insulation for 8 feet, so impossible to patch and replacing it involves ripping the wall open for 8 feet. After looking at the relative prices of gas and electricity I realized it would now cost only $20/year more to run an electric dryer, so I had the electricians put in an outlet and got an electric dryer (I wanted a nicer dryer anyway).
In my region (the Finger Lakes), some sort of economic line got crossed recently. Electric heating is now price-competitive with gas heating, and the contractors I know say that people are now, quite often, ripping out gas heating to install electric heating. I wonder if this is cutting down on the direct winter gas demand. What do you think, Robert? Have you seen a trend towards removal of gas heating?
Of course, anyone reliant on heating oil or propane deliveries, common in the rural areas, has a *really* strong incentive to stop using them, as those prices are going through the roof; they're switching to either electric or wood pellet stoves. I would hope you've seen a trend towards removal of propane and heating oil systems!
I myself just ripped out a gas dryer and installed an electric dryer. It was sort of an accident. The gas line got cut during my other electrical work, and it turns out to be Wardflex and embedded in the insulation for 8 feet, so impossible to patch and replacing it involves ripping the wall open for 8 feet. After looking at the relative prices of gas and electricity I realized it would now cost only $20/year more to run an electric dryer, so I had the electricians put in an outlet and got an electric dryer (I wanted a nicer dryer anyway).
PV4EV
Member
Each to their own, but I think you'll find there are quite a few forum members of some standing who own Volts and Leafs ..
Yes and of course I mean no disrespect to them, but I highly doubt they are buying the cars for how they look
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
By electric heating - do you mean electric heating using heat-pumps or electrical resistance heating? What are electricity/gas prices for you?
Here in California - gas is around $0.80-1.00/therm, electricity varies between $0.14-$0.28 / kWh.
1 therm is equivalent to 29.3 kWh of electricity - best gas furnaces are around 95% efficient, but let's say they're 100% - so 1 therm of gas will cost you $1, but electrical resistance heating will cost you $4-$8.
A good heat pump will have a COP between 3-4 depending on outside temperature - so best case a heat pump will match the price of gas, worst case it's still nearly 3x more expensive.
So I have to assume that you pay around $0.10 / kWh for electricity, gas is no more than $1.50 / therm, and that heat pumps are being installed in place of gas furnaces for it to be significantly cheaper to heat with electricity rather than gas.
I might say the same thing about the Model S and would definitely say it about the Model X. Thankfully we are all different.
For me, this is what the next Tesla should have been Furtive-eGT... sorry, horribly OT.
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The title is very misleading.
Copy pasted from the article:
60% of those drivers who do not want to change to an electric vehicle claim the lack of suitable models on offer today as being the key factor
If your choice today is the Nissan Leaf, or the Nissan Leaf, I can see how most people would feel there is a lack of choices.
Copy pasted from the article:
60% of those drivers who do not want to change to an electric vehicle claim the lack of suitable models on offer today as being the key factor
If your choice today is the Nissan Leaf, or the Nissan Leaf, I can see how most people would feel there is a lack of choices.
Indeed, the more car models that come the better, just so everyone can have their own taste in electric vehicle.
JRP3
Hyperactive Member
More on topic I'd say he's done what he could in the face of a hostile opposition and a public that seems to want spending cuts above all else.
I get complements on how good my Volt looks quite frequently. Most people don't realize it is electric, they just like how it looks. I have never had this happen in my other cars, including the Corvettes!
I am not a fan of the Leaf styling, but it looks better in real life than in photos.
GSP
Petersen ranting again....
'my favorite toymaker Tesla Motors (TSLA) hopes to ramp its production to 20,000 EVs a year if it can find that many mathematically challenged buyers. The electric drive systems in those EVs will cost at least $800 million, but they'll only save eight million gallons of gas per year.'
Stop-Start Realities And EV Fantasies - Seeking Alpha
Is he getting worried Tesla will make it?
$40,000 per drive system eh? pretty mathematically challenged on his own I see
'my favorite toymaker Tesla Motors (TSLA) hopes to ramp its production to 20,000 EVs a year if it can find that many mathematically challenged buyers. The electric drive systems in those EVs will cost at least $800 million, but they'll only save eight million gallons of gas per year.'
Stop-Start Realities And EV Fantasies - Seeking Alpha
Is he getting worried Tesla will make it?
$40,000 per drive system eh? pretty mathematically challenged on his own I see
DuncanWatson
Member
15,000 miles avg per year
20,000 EVs
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300,000,000 gallons of gas saved.
He really is math challenged when he claims only 8 million.
sp4rk
Banned
Actually I think you got yours wrong?
(Not defending him!)
He said gallons ... the quotient you have supplied is miles. Not gallons?
Divide by what mpg?
30mpg is 10,000,000 gallons.
But then, we're all mathematically challenged. Right.
(Not defending him!)
He said gallons ... the quotient you have supplied is miles. Not gallons?
Divide by what mpg?
30mpg is 10,000,000 gallons.
But then, we're all mathematically challenged. Right.
Yep; if he assumes 37.5 mpg, you get 8 million gallons. The big error he makes is that he fails to subtract the cost of the ICE drivetrain to find the incremental cost of the EV drivetrain, which is the relevant point of comparison.
Again, I'm not even going to read the article -- don't feed the animals.
Again, I'm not even going to read the article -- don't feed the animals.
sp4rk
Banned
It wasn't worth reading.
B'sides, what is a dodgy lawyer "hiding" in Switzerland doing criticising my math capabilities.
I can do that myself surely?
B'sides, what is a dodgy lawyer "hiding" in Switzerland doing criticising my math capabilities.
I can do that myself surely?
Citizen-T
Active Member
I've been taking note of the timing of his articles lately. Seems they come within 24 hours of Tesla hitting an all-time high or on days where Tesla is up huge (like today). I should plot his articles on a chart of TSLA and see if there is a pattern or I'm just imagining it.
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