Supercharging Cost (Switzerland)

[Scrot]

Hello all, I'm mulling over a 2016 Tesla Model S which I am thinking of buying next week. I am not able to get charging at home but I live 10 mins from a supercharger which happens to be free with this car...
Realistically I drive only casually (15,000km a year probably) and was curious what it would save me by having free charging. Currently I drive a quite inefficient (but fun!) Porsche which does around 10 litres per 100km.

 

[RTPEV]

What free charging would save you--as compared to what? The cost of fuel in your Porsche? The cost of Supercharging in a Tesla that did not come with free Supercharging? The cost of charging an EV at home?

Even if I understood what it was you were asking, I wouldn't necessarily be able to help, but I can tell you how to figure it out yourself.

Depending on the specific model you are looking at, I would assume about 200 Wh/km for a 2016 Model S.

A convenient comparison unit is probably cost per 100km. You say your Porsche gets 10 litres per 100km, so you can calculate the fuel costs for that case by multiplying the cost of a litre of fuel by 10.

You will need 20 kWh of energy to go 100 km in the Tesla. Assume about an 85% charging efficiency when charging at an AC charger, so that would mean about 23kWh pulled from your home charger if that's what you're comparing to, so must multiply 23 by the cost per kWh of electrcity.

The efficiency is better at a Supercharger (not having to go through an AC/DC converter), so I might assume maybe 90% efficiency, meaning you'll have to calculate the cost of Supercharging 22kWh worth of electricity. This is where someone from Switzerland will have to step in and give a representative cost of Superchargers in your area. But again, the math is simple: 22 times whatever that per kWh cost is.

Hopefully this gives you the tools you'll need to answer whatever question it is that you're asking.

 

[Scrot]

Thank you for that. Yeah I've done the cost of petrol per year in the Porsche and want to basically plug in the KW/hour cost for supercharging. Looks like Tesla is a bit cagey on it.

I saw an old blog post which said it had raised from 0.48c to 0.60c which seems very steep! That would make 100km (22kw) over 13 CHF whereas the Porsche would be 20 chf (and that was a performance oriented car driven hard!). Assuming that I drove the Tesla the same way I do the Porsche I guess it would reach parity quite quickly....

So 15,000km costs me around 3,000 CHF a year in fuel, so the Tesla would save me roughly that.

Man maths.........lets see how it translates in reality!


(I still think 60 rappen is very expensive if any swiss owners could confirm that would be great!)

 

[RTPEV]

Couple of comments:

The best savings come from home charging, not Supercharging. With Supercharging, you are paying for convenience in addition to electricity. Granted, for those that absolutely cannot charge at home, it may be seen less as a convenience, and more of a necessity, but Supercharging ought not to be seen as the only solution.

In Europe, you also have easy access to competitive DC fastcharger networks, so you should check the prices of those as well (although I suspect they are not all that different).

As for driving the Tesla in a spirited way, you may not experience the same efficiency loss as you do in an ICE vehicle.

 

[archae86]

"As for driving the Tesla in a spirited way, you may not experience the same efficiency loss as you do in an ICE vehicle."

Humm.. I'd say it is different. While the drag count is pretty low, the rise in drag with speed is square-law mostly, just as for any other vehicle. This means that at highway speeds, going faster costs you, a lot. Going faster, like Autobahn fast lane standard speeds, costs you a whole lot compare to driving along a well below 60 mph/100 kph. As the low speed efficiency of the Tesla is very good, this penalty for going fast is proportionately worse in the Tesla.

On the other hand, accelerating briskly from a stop sign, or accelerating and decelerating briskly in making rapid progress in traffic, are penalized much less in the Tesla than an ICE vehicle.

 

[RTPEV]

"As for driving the Tesla in a spirited way, you may not experience the same efficiency loss as you do in an ICE vehicle."

Humm.. I'd say it is different. While the drag count is pretty low, the rise in drag with speed is square-law mostly, just as for any other vehicle. This means that at highway speeds, going faster costs you, a lot. Going faster, like Autobahn fast lane standard speeds, costs you a whole lot compare to driving along a well below 60 mph/100 kph. As the low speed efficiency of the Tesla is very good, this penalty for going fast is proportionately worse in the Tesla.

On the other hand, accelerating briskly from a stop sign, or accelerating and decelerating briskly in making rapid progress in traffic, are penalized much less in the Tesla than an ICE vehicle.

Right. I guess I interpreted "spirited driving" as being more about quick acceleration, rather than just driving fast along long stretches of highway. But what you said is true...the penalty for very high speed driving (even though I've found my Model 3 to be extremely slippery on the highway at the speeds I drive), is more significant in a highly efficient vehicle.

 

[Scrot]

Yeah I meant accelerating is definitely a constant…

But highways in Switzerland are strictly limited to 120kmhr so this will be efficient i guess.

It’s more my trips through to Germany etc where I would routinely have the Porsche 250+
. I accept those days will end but I would still like to do 140/150km/160km hr without severe penalty.

 

[moa999]

Looks like Tesla is a bit cagey on it.

I saw an old blog post which said it had raised from 0.48c to 0.60c which seems very steep!

Rates are published on the In-car map (and I believe in Europe now on the Tesla app for those available to third party cars).

But €0.50-0.60/kWh seems about right. You need to remember there are substantial infrastructure and maintenance costs in high speed equipment, as well as location costs and utility costs from possibly expanding capacity or demand (peak) charges on commercial properties.

You've got to look at things a little differently in an electric vehicle.
Say on a 750km trip with a LR (with say real-world 400km range).
You top-up to 100% night before at say €0.15 (or possibly less if you have solar)
Drive 300km. Top-up at supercharger from 25% to 75% at $0.60. Drive 200km, top-up for free at a Destination Charger at a restaurant you go to. Drive home, arriving with 20%. Top-up again overnight.

So only a minor percentage of any journey might be at the expensive rates.

 

[Scrot]

Okay quick update. Not sure how to post pictures. But I ended up picking it up early.

Was delivered to me half full. I did some trips around town etc. Then I charged to 90% (it indicated 500km but I changed to actual and it was a lot lower!).

Had a good drive through Germany (ahem), stayed overnight, barely made it to the next charger inspite of slow as fuuuuck overnight charger that filled up at 9km hr.....filled up there to around 80%...had a good day around the bodensee. Around 80 km left.

As we speak (22.30pm) charging up again for 80% for the week ahead.

In Germany the town had a charger for 77c a kW and 20c a min. That would have cost nearly 100 euro to fill up!

So obviously you don't buy a car to save money but so far so good. Done a large amount of KM for free....whereas the porsche (especially with the lively driving) would have cost at least a couple hundred....and electricity around the same.

I can't see how many KW exactly used but I estimate (240 kW so far?) (Is it possible to check).

Oh yeah turns out owner had purchased enhanced autopilot, winter pack, premium sound, premium connectivity and its registered as a january 2017 car. (Maybe those features are free?) So it feels very complete. Only downside is the original screen but it's a car I don't need games.

 

[Scrot]

6 charges done now. Loving it. Allows me to really drive how I like without caring at all.

 

[Genie]

^

I can't see how many KW exactly used but I estimate (240 kW so far?) (Is it possible to check


That is shown on the Trips screen

 

[archae86]

I can't see how many KW exactly used but I estimate (240 kW so far?) (Is it possible to check).

If you sign up with TeslaFI, one nifty benefit is extraordinarily detailed information on each "trip". Among other things, the total energy consumed, and the energy consumed per unit distance. It defines "trip" not by your clicking the trip meters in the car, but, so far as I can tell, just from when you park the car.

Two cautions: you do have to go through a procedure that gives TeslaFi access to your car's information. And after a brief trial period, you do have to pay a modest fee. I like it a lot.

For a tiny example, this screenshot shows the primary trip information for my trip downhill to church, and uphill returning home, last Sunday.