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Solution to charge your Model 3 if you don't have any garage?
- Thread starter Oyinko
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- home charger Model 3
James Anders
Member
But isn't this really intended for people who have a charging capability at home? Does Tesla really want to say as a company, if you don't own a home or live in a place where you don't have access to charge, then don't own a Tesla?
Canuck
Well-Known Member
How can you not have access to a charge but access to a Supercharger? On plugshare, there's lots of public EVSE's located by the Superchargers. Yes, you might have to pay for them, and they won't be as fast, but there's many ways to charge other than by way of locals charging at Superchargers. If that happens, we can pretty much say 'goodbye' to long distance travel in our Tesla's since you can't expect Tesla to inspect everyone's home to see if they really don't have access to home charging; and we know people will use anything as an excuse to save a buck, especially if they have a Model 3 and a nearby Supercharger, which is going to be case once the hundreds of thousands of Model 3's start rolling off the assembly lines.
Adrien
Member
Actually they are not there for that reason. People that charge locally like that have been getting emails from Tesla warning to cease the activity. Now, if they can legally do anything about it is another question, but it was definitely meant for travelling long distances.
Tesla won't say it but hopefully common sense will prevail. Tesla surely won't provide supercharging adequate to serve hordes of Tesla 3 cheapskates, apartment dwellers and others who cannot charge at home. Tesla may live to regret ever establishing the current system of unlimited supercharging. They should have foreseen a huge mess when the Model 3 appears. Of course that assumes unlimited supercharging will be available to Model 3 owners. I'm betting that won't happen.
Canuck
Well-Known Member
This is why I don't think we will see "free" Supercharging for the Model 3. I put "free" in quotes since Model S owners have paid upfront for supercharging so it's not really free. When I bought, the 60's had to pay $2,500 to enable SCing. I upgraded to an 85 so it was included in the additional price but I still paid for it, and it has since been built into the price of all S & X vehicles. I doubt I will ever use $2,500 in SC energy but I guess my money also helped to pay for the infrastructure.
In my view, there will be a per-use charge for Supercharging for the Model 3 that will exceed the charging at-home rate. That will solve the issue of locals charging, since there's no incentive. Then those locals who really need charging can use them. Problem solved -- except for Model S & X locals charging who will likely only continue to get "friendly" reminder letters.
James Anders
Member
How? Because you live in an apartment or condo. True, there are people who could charge at home and abuse the Superchargers but allowing the few who don't have access to a charger where they live would be reasonable. As long as they're mindful of etiquette. They could charge at off-peak hours or only when there's ample open spots.
Some people can be jerks even when they're traveling and using the Superchargers "correctly" by leaving their car parked for hours on end, etc.
TaoJones
Beyond Driven
This is completely false. Tesla has committed to DENSITY as well as to DISTANCE for almost 2 years now.
And the letter was a disaster that did more harm than good. Not Tesla's finest hour, and you'll note that mistake has not been repeated since.
Further, senior management as recently as last month has confirmed that the free SC model is sustainable. Prior thereto, Dr. Straubel himself said that the SC business model is fine until 1M cars, and we are nowhere near 1M cars (in the US) nor will we be for a good half-decade yet.
Contrary to rumor and innuendo, there is no significant problem with locals overrunning SCs. Most owners do not use SCs. And that trend will continue. Why? Convenience. Nobody with a garage is going to wait in line to charge when they can wake up with a full charge every morning.
TaoJones
Beyond Driven
Except there is no problem with locals charging. As much as you would like to believe there is. This witch hunt really needs to stop.
While it makes send to offer a base M3 without SCing enabled, it is solely because most owners do not use SCs. That trend will continue, at least in the US, where 2/3 of homes have garages. Garages outnumber gas stations 400:1. 90% of owners don't use SCs - figure easily 2/3 of M3 owners will be likewise. Remember that most people don't leave a 50-mile radius.
There will be no pay per use SC usage or any other hinky exclusionary schemes. It's not just me that disagrees with this ridiculous premise - Tesla senior management disagrees as well and those sentiments have been published as recently as last month.
Since reality doesn't seem to matter despite this horse being beyond dead, I hear there's a 2 for 1 sale for pitchforks and torches at Home Depot. Don't all go at once. You might need to pay each time to use the register.
Canuck
Well-Known Member
Ha! Tesla's logs of locals charging is a witch hunt. That's a good one. And it's me wanting to believe it, not the fact that Elon Musk raised it at the shareholder's meeting, and Tesla sent locals charging at SC's letters after he raised it. Oh, and what about this? -- with barely any Model S's on the road compared to what's coming with the Model 3 (and the X!):
Well, that didn't exist, on a long weekend for travel, right? It's a forged picture. And locals charging there clogging it up never happened. The logs were wrong! Right? It's all a witch hunt. And with the Model 3 coming, don't worry about it, it's all a witch hunt!
That really did give me a good laugh.
Citation please. I back-up all my Tesla statements with links. The one above links to this portion of the shareholder's meeting:
"Some customers are "aggressively" using Superchargers for local travel, even though the stations are only intended for long trip usage. Tesla will be sending them reminder notes that "it's cool to do so occasionally," but the company doesn't want this to become a regular habit."
Also, this letter was sent as part of the witch hunt. Right?:
Tesla Letter To Rein In Local Supercharger Use Goes Wrong
Again, citation please. What harm did it do that outweighed the good it did? Also, it went wrong only because Tesla cast too wide of a net, but that's not "more harm than good". If anything, it did a ton of good since it let people know they are being monitored and I bet a lot of those locals charging now think twice before doing so and I also bet many have stopped.
I'm amazed by the insider information you must have to make such categorical statements. So Tesla knows this but they don't advertise it, why? Because if they did, they would get even more Model 3 orders? Yes, that makes sense.
Do you have links to support anything you say, or are you just selling pitchforks?
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What logs? That's a picture of Tejon. It was a long weekend for travel, and as you say very busy. But the supercharger is out in the middle of nowhere, there are no nearby locals! The supercharger was entirely filled by travelers (they've since opened another nearby supercharger to lessen the load).
While Tesla does say long range travel, their placement strategy is another story. As they say "We strategically place Superchargers along well-traveled highways and in congested city centers."
In the SF Bay area they already have 3 superchargers within 20 miles of each other and are planning to open 3 or 4 more. They have 7 superchargers in the LA metro area and are about to open an 8th. That's confusing placement if they are intended only for inter-city travel.
In the SF Bay area they already have 3 superchargers within 20 miles of each other and are planning to open 3 or 4 more. They have 7 superchargers in the LA metro area and are about to open an 8th. That's confusing placement if they are intended only for inter-city travel.
Haxster
Member
This is a year old and they build new superchargers.
He NEVER said it is a problem or that is will be a problem, since it is COOL to do it occasionally.
So if you want to be COOL, you should use it for local charging.
One person's "occasional" is another person's "frequent"
If they don't want it to be a habit, they need to tell you how COOL you are allowed to be and under what circumstances and then for all new cars sold, make that as part of the purchase agreement. As for people who already bought their cars, the best they can do is try and shame people.
Where is the evidence that those people are locals? If a local is at the Tejon SC, then it is because they are traveling. I doubt they are stupid enough to drive all the way there, wait on line there, and drive back home during a busy time much less any time.
What logs?
Do you believe everything a company tells you when they make excuses about their service? "Our logs say it isn't our fault, it is someone else's". Well ok then.
Do those logs show take out any locals who drove from SF to San Diego and needed to stop in a SC near LA (their home) in order to make the trip? Or is that person supposed to drive home and charge up there before continuing their trip otherwise they are "not cool"?
definitely just selling pitchforks, at 2-for-1 they're probably not selling very well since most already know about the congestion
We'll trust Tesla's fabulous team to come up with a great solution
I don't have a quote/source, but I recall reading/hearing somewhere about how if you don't have a reliable method of charging at night (no near outlets, garage, etc.), then an EV vehicle isn't suited for you just yet. And this isn't exclusive to Tesla vehicles; for some reason no one complaining to Nissan about if they don't deserve a Leaf if they don't have access to charge, it's the same concept.
Down the line there'll be any more EV chargers with better battery technology, so you can operate the same way as a ICE; charge up at a public station (pay per use), then park at home and have minimum energy lost overnight.
I think you're generally right, though my guess is that being able to charge at home is probably one of the biggest conveniences of having an electric car.
The Leaf is interesting. I can't see how that would be possible to use like an ICE at all. You only get 100 miles of range in good conditions to begin with and so I think a home charger is mandatory. Tesla is getting closer to not needing one, but I think the convenience has to be a huge benefit. I don't want to think about using charging locations all the time. If shopping areas and offices make the plugs ubiquitous, then that might change a bit more.
Canuck
Well-Known Member
The truth of the matter is that no one here knows what Tesla's plans are, despite categorical statements by some to the contrary. Only time will tell. I would just point out that if Tesla planned "free" Supercharging for the Model 3, like the S & X, it sure is strange that they haven't announced it. I guess the only explanation for that is they don't want more orders. My explanation is that it opens them up to customers using them "aggressively" for local travel, even though the stations are only intended for long trip usage (to borrow Tesla's words from their shareholder meeting). There's a ton of people who will do anything to save a buck and Tesla knows that, like we all do.
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