Rumour: Model 3/Y to lose stalks in 2023 model year

[1k-dummy]

Actually this is a very important point - through out their development it's likely a right handed person in a LHD environment deciding what could be moved to the touch screen.

I'm right handed in a RHD country, using the touch screen with my weak hand while driving FEEL LIKE *sugar*

 

[WllXM]

Actually this is a very important point - through out their development it's likely a right handed person in a LHD environment deciding what could be moved to the touch screen.

I'm right handed in a RHD country, using the touch screen with my weak hand while driving FEEL LIKE *sugar*

Do you reckon there's a higher proportion of lefties in RHD countries?
I drove a LHD Tesla in Europe last year. Actually it was a much greater experience once you get used to it. Rest your right arm or use it to control the screen much more intuitively, while your left elbow can rest against the door card, and you can hold the wheel with your thumb WHILE you can indicate using your other fingers, without changing position!
If there wasn't the issue of getting car park tickets through the wrong window when you're driving alone (and pesky insurance issues), I could have very much seen myself order a LHD S/X now

 

[cdub]

Actually this is a very important point - through out their development it's likely a right handed person in a LHD environment deciding what could be moved to the touch screen.

I'm right handed in a RHD country, using the touch screen with my weak hand while driving FEEL LIKE *sugar*

But you had no problem using a manual stick with you left?

 

[yessuz]

But you had no problem using a manual stick with you left?

since I moved from continent to UK, I struggled with manual... either when changing gears + indicating in the roundabouts... or when yu try to accelerate and your gears instead of 1-2-3 become 1-2-1

 

[WannabeOwner]

before that they reintroduced a round steering wheel to back track a little on the yolk idea, or at least give people the option

Not really sure they are giving people the option, per se. The Wheel is, now, the default and the Yoke the option ...

... so if nothing else I expect that will skew the orders to favour Wheel?

There is clearly a consumer segment that accepts the no-stalks at all design

Having seen Bjorns, video, where he says he very specifically set about trying to learn muscle-memory and to like the indicator-buttons, he didn't manage it (on roundabouts), so I expect I won't either. But for me the MS is a grand tourer, the sorts of journeys I use it on will be predominantly motorway, so I'd live with it. Not sure that I'm also going to accommodate absence of RHD though!

i actually quite like the gear selection being on screen for all the time you use it anyway

for the number of times you actually change gear this interface is probably perfectly fine.

I use it a lot - when maneourvring in car parks. I switch Drive/Reverse without attempting to reach a stop at each direction-change, and I find the way the accelerator is balanced for "reverse thrust" followed by "drive" (in whichever direction is selected) to be perfect, for me.

I am anticipating that having to use screen-swipe won't be anything like as easy to swap directions, whilst still on the move.

 

[1k-dummy]

But you had no problem using a manual stick with you left?

I hjave never driven a manual car.

 

[roadcred]

Even giving up 10% of sales seems pretty stupid just to save a few dollars on some stalks. I do suspect it's more than 10% though.

It will definitely be more than 10% in UK and Europe. It matters little removing the gear stick but it should be replaced with something physical. The biggest loss on that stick is the engagement of autopilot. Losing the indicator stalk is even more stupid than the current situation with wipers. The beam flash will also be lost. Most of us drive several vehicles and changing to my Tesla takes the longest time for me to drive without thinking.
Why make the driving of a car more difficult and definitely more dangerous. To save money? For Tesla es but definitely not for the consumer.
With the opening up of Superchargers all over the EU and soon here, sadly my Model Y will be my last Tesla. My Kia has always been a better car to drive!

 

[GlynG]

What a fantastic opportunity Tesla are handing out to all the other manufacturers of EVs for the UK.

Model 3 and presumably the Y will loose the indicator and wiper stalks - That should cost them dearly in sales, S and X not in RHD another blow, guess its going to be bye bye Tesla.

The changes doesn't affect me at all as I have already stated my next car wont be a Tesla, penny pinching and dishonest practice did Tesla for me, though my car is wonderful. Principles are hard to give up.

 

[Wol747]

you mean 180 degrees? 350 degrees mean that blinker is more or less at the same location/position

More or less doesn't cut it when you're negotiating consecutive mini roundabouts!

 

[rincewind]

It will definitely be more than 10% in UK and Europe. It matters little removing the gear stick but it should be replaced with something physical. The biggest loss on that stick is the engagement of autopilot. Losing the indicator stalk is even more stupid than the current situation with wipers. The beam flash will also be lost. Most of us drive several vehicles and changing to my Tesla takes the longest time for me to drive without thinking.
Why make the driving of a car more difficult and definitely more dangerous. To save money? For Tesla es but definitely not for the consumer.
With the opening up of Superchargers all over the EU and soon here, sadly my Model Y will be my last Tesla. My Kia has always been a better car to drive!

I'm also going to leave the Tesla fold, probably heading in the direction of the BYD Seal, which will be in the UK later this year.

 

[Zilla91]

I'm also going to leave the Tesla fold, probably heading in the direction of the BYD Seal, which will be in the UK later this year.

Since you're intent on going down the Chinese route, have you had a look at the Nio ET5?

Looks very nice on the eye I have to admit. That Bjorn guy has posted a few videos on it recently as well that might be worth a look

 

[WllXM]

I know our cars are already Made in China, but it would be a step for me to switch to something fully designed and made there, rather than retaining the 'Designed in California'... Not fully ready to trust them..

A bit like switching from an iPhone to a Huawei...

 

[Durzel]

As a counterpoint - the MG4 is a great car for the money, and in several respects better than my M3P - which was twice the price.

It was designed in London, but I'm not entirely sure why I should care where it was designed so long as it ticks the boxes.

 

[MountainRatMat]

This discussion is fascinating to me. I live in California so I'm sure I have some bias and a different use case.

Question, is there Tesla Supercharger network there worlds ahead of any other charging network like it is here in the states? I can't drive any other EV because long distance travel is abysmal on any other charging network.

Are the distances traveled there much shorter and therefore the need for DC Fast Charging much less?

 

[yessuz]

This discussion is fascinating to me. I live in California so I'm sure I have some bias and a different use case.

Question, is there Tesla Supercharger network there worlds ahead of any other charging network like it is here in the states? I can't drive any other EV because long distance travel is abysmal on any other charging network.

Are the distances traveled there much shorter and therefore the need for DC Fast Charging much less?

In short - yes

In long one: yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

This discussion is fascinating to me. I live in California so I'm sure I have some bias and a different use case.

Question, is there Tesla Supercharger network there worlds ahead of any other charging network like it is here in the states? I can't drive any other EV because long distance travel is abysmal on any other charging network.

Are the distances traveled there much shorter and therefore the need for DC Fast Charging much less?

Not at such, BMW, VW, Merc, I think Ford have clubbed together to create a combined network, but its kind of irrelevant, in Europe, On mainland Europe there are extensive networks of superchargers.

Tesla are increasingly letting any make of car use the superchargers and we have the same plug on pretty much all cars (CCS). Whats potentially worse, at some of the later supercharger locations, other makes of car may be able to charge, whereas early Model S and Model X cars that have not been adapted won't be able to charge.

Either way, the Tesla Supercharger USP is dimminishing over here

I don't think it's any accident that Europe is having a very mixed response to Tesla right now, big discounts on new inventory, nearly 10%, and thats not demo cars or cars with EAP added to make the discount look good, thats straight off the list price.

 

[GlynG]

This discussion is fascinating to me. I live in California so I'm sure I have some bias and a different use case.

Question, is there Tesla Supercharger network there worlds ahead of any other charging network like it is here in the states? I can't drive any other EV because long distance travel is abysmal on any other charging network.

Are the distances traveled there much shorter and therefore the need for DC Fast Charging much less?

Yes we have quite a reasonable Supercharger network though some of them are open for other vehicles. The demand for EV in the UK is very active which has resulted in queues at chargers - Tesla and others. Other networks are OK - well sort of, they are not obvious and some are behind Uncle Toms allotment shed - which you would never know about - and there is a plethora of apps to locate chargers - most Supermarkets and McDonalds have chargers but usually just two.
The UK isn't size wise on the scale of the USA so our long journeys are your short hops. Majority of people work within a few miles of where they live, a journey of 200 plus miles is a journey we would plan around - In the USA you pop over and see your mate for a beer 200 miles away and think nothing of it - or so I'm led to believe.

The USP of Tesla is their charging network but Tesla as a company are penny pinching dishonest shits and they don't exactly push the boat out to tailor the Tesla to the UK - so lots of things don't function too well, and spare parts - a joke - months just for a windscreen, they are so bad in supplying parts that vehicles in an accident can be off the road for many months and that has had the effect of doubling the premium on insurance as hire car costs account for a substantial chunk of the repair bill - that and most garages are terrified of EVs - don't want to touch high voltage - so in the UK we have a big issue - albeit I hope temporary.

 

[WannabeOwner]

is there Tesla Supercharger network there worlds ahead of any other charging network like it is here in the states?

Yes. We have a plethora of different companies providing charging (original government grants were regional, so companies sprung up all over the place with no compatibility of APPs/Cards at that time). A few of them are good - but even the well know brands can take a very unresonable amount of time to repair a charger, and it can thus be unpredictable whether, when you get there, stuff will be working or not. For the rest they are generally slow (plenty of 50kW stuff still exists) and plenty have terrible repair records (looking on sites like PlugShare or Zap-Map for customer feedback on how their charging session was ... or was not!

The other problem is that they are fitting "Only a few stalls". The biggest, most reliable brands, are (best as I know) fitting 6 stalls at a site. Tesla is only fitting that few stalls, on new sites, if there physically isn't room for more - e.g. at a small service centre. New Supercharger sites are predominantly 12 stalls-ish

Tesla basically just works. On a few occasions I've had slow charging from a stall, I've moved to another stall and that was fine. And of course Tesla is plug-in-and-walk-away, whereas the others (in USA too I expect) are plug-in, get the APP open, and try to initiate a charge. I'm exaggerating a bit as some aspire to plug-and-charge, and no doubt work with certain brands ... but then you would be looking for "that brand" of charger ... much like we look for Tesla Superchargers.

Are the distances traveled there much shorter

Yes. Americans think that 200 years is a long time, and Brits think that 200 miles is a long way

 

[WannabeOwner]

months just for a windscreen

My recollection of that fiasco was that Tesla service centre had windscreens and Autoglass didn't and, ultimately, the insurance companies caved and allowed owners to get windscreens fitted at Tesla. Of course that may have been of Tesla's making, rather than Autoglass ... but on the multiple times I've been required, by my insurance, to use Autoglass the experience was diabolical, so I'm not sure Autoglass are without blame

 

[yessuz]

on top of that, in countries like Norway or Netherlands, situation is that you have at least 50kw charger at more or less every petrol station. and in many cases you will have petrol station + large charge hub at the same site (check Bjorn Nyland videos)