PG&E Blue vs B&W Bill discrepancies

[dho112]

Is it possible for the two different bills to be “out of sync” either timewise or calculation wise?

My NEM Credit on my blue PG&E bill is over $100 less than what it states on my multipage B&W PG&E detail bill with all the analysis and details… Even though the period of service is shown as being exactly the same…

Is this something others normally see? Differences between the two numbers for cumulative NEM Credit? Is the detailed bill considered the official record? or the blue bill statement?

 

[Redhill_qik]

Is it possible for the two different bills to be “out of sync” either timewise or calculation wise?

My NEM Credit on my blue PG&E bill is over $100 less than what it states on my multipage B&W PG&E detail bill with all the analysis and details… Even though the period of service is shown as being exactly the same…

Is this something others normally see? Differences between the two numbers for cumulative NEM Credit? Is the detailed bill considered the official record? or the blue bill statement?

I can't think of any reason why these be would be different. Please post screenshots of the issues that you are seeing.

 

[YRide]

Weirdly, still don’t get the B&W bill even though PTO was back in June. However, the Blue bill I do get has all kinds of details now…is that the new B&W bill for more recent PTO’s?

 

[Redhill_qik]

Weirdly, still don’t get the B&W bill even though PTO was back in June. However, the Blue bill I do get has all kinds of details now…is that the new B&W bill for more recent PTO’s?

The B&W bill is only for accounts with ESS. Based on your posting history you do have Powerwalls. If you aren't getting the paper version have you looked for it online? Care to post your extended content blue bill info?

 

[YRide]

The B&W bill is only for accounts with ESS. Based on your posting history you do have Powerwalls. If you aren't getting the paper version have you looked for it online? Care to post your extended content blue bill info?

Yep, have 4x ESS (PW's). And yes, looked many times in the "My Accounts & Services" area per everyones instructions.

New Blue Bill content is posted here on this thread, pg2: NEM-PS Annual True-Up Calculation [PG&E example]

Wondering if newer PTO's just don't get B&W bill? Maybe they've migrated people forward? Has anyone with a PTO more recent than July 1st, 2023 received a B&W bill? It seems @holeydonut also lost previously distributed B&W bill, for the new Blue bill with details?

@swedge didn't you have a theory somehow PGE didn't think I had a powerwall?

This new Blue bill basically has everything I want (and it is pretty straightforward to read). However, it's missing one thing...i can't seem to tell what my authorized "export" limit is each month. This is important for me because I have both Grid Charging and Export Everything...and I need to make sure that a I don't over-export during the day with PV, because I will basically dump ~54kWh every night at 4p (reserve is set to 0%)...and my understanding is that PG&E will dissallow kWh exports starting with on-peak, then mid-peak, then off-peak.

The only annoying thing is the break out with SJCE for generation. At least it's all on the same bill, but annoying that there's all these breakouts and add backs. Weirdly, it looks like since I'll have PTO for 9mo by next April (SJCE true up month for all), which is less then the required 10mo...that means I won't pay a single penny to SJCE until April 2025. I would still rather just pay everything in sync with PG&E!

 

[swedge]

@swedge didn't you have a theory somehow PGE didn't think I had a powerwall?

I'm answering in an older thread: NEM-PS Annual True-Up Calculation [PG&E example]

 

[swedge]

Is it possible for the two different bills to be “out of sync” either timewise or calculation wise?

My NEM Credit on my blue PG&E bill is over $100 less than what it states on my multipage B&W PG&E detail bill with all the analysis and details… Even though the period of service is shown as being exactly the same…

Is this something others normally see? Differences between the two numbers for cumulative NEM Credit? Is the detailed bill considered the official record? or the blue bill statement?

This is strange. I have storage (PowerWall) and solar, and my blue bill does not show the NEM credit at all. The only electrical info is the minimum monthly charge of around $11. So there no discrepancy. The B/W bill, however, is a morass of obfuscation, so deciphering it is an exercise in forensic accounting.

If you only recently added a PW, you may be seeing a pre-PW style blue bill. Others, including myself, have seen long delays in storage getting into the billing. Or, maybe PG&E is in the process of eliminating the B/W bill and including the relevant info on the blue. Pure hopeful speculation on my part here.

Care to post your extended content blue bill info?

This is a good suggestion!

 

[Redhill_qik]

This is a good suggestion!

@YRide Did post details of their Blue bill and you replied to that post There is a bunch of information there, but some of the context is missing in how the individual images are assembled together. I think it would be best to take this discussion to that thread.

 

[holeydonut]

I think @YRide and I have the newer version of the blue bill. This entire thing is confusing since it's a completely different set of numbers to reconcile on the new blue bill vs the old blue bill. Like the new bill has a estimated NEM true up dollar figure that I don't recall seeing under the old format. I guess PG&E will also save $15 million a year on not having to mail out the black and white bills any more.

 

[YRide]

I think @YRide and I have the newer version of the blue bill. This entire thing is confusing since it's a completely different set of numbers to reconcile on the new blue bill vs the old blue bill. Like the new bill has an estimated NEM true up dollar figure that I don't recall seeing under the old format. I guess PG&E will also save $15 million a year on not having to mail out the black and white bills any more.

I actually think the new blue bill (aka BB2 for short ) is pretty easy to read and has all the info needed for NEM2, with the exception of not informing you what your max monthly export limit is.

 

[dho112]

Apologies that it took me so LONG to post the content of my two bills (blue and B&W) I get easily distracted and sometimes don't make it back to the site as often as I should Here is the first page of the B&W bill and the relevant page of the standard blue bill for the month of October (haven't gotten November yet). Weirdly again, the bills are off in their reporting range by 1 day for this month (Other months it matches up billing dates), but I don't think that would cause the NEM credit to vary by $100...

Amazing how much production changes for seasons! Last month my amount credited to my NEM balance was only $37 In May it was close to $250!

 

[Redhill_qik]

Here is the first page of the B&W bill and the relevant page of the standard blue bill for the month of October (haven't gotten November yet). Weirdly again, the bills are off in their reporting range by 1 day for this month (Other months it matches up billing dates), but I don't think that would cause the NEM credit to vary by $100...

The screenshot from the Blue bill is the generation component from your CCA (Ava Energy was East Bay Community Energy) and that has a NEM balance/credit of $706.09. The screenshot from the B&W bill is for the transmission/distribution component (not sure how it looks for all PG&E) with a NEM Cumulative Energy Credit of $809.44 . So there isn't a discrepancy as the items are two different things and you effective have NEM credits of $1,515.34.

 

[dho112]

The screenshot from the Blue bill is the generation component from your CCA (Ava Energy was East Bay Community Energy) and that has a NEM balance/credit of $706.09. The screenshot from the B&W bill is for the transmission/distribution component (not sure how it looks for all PG&E) with a NEM Cumulative Energy Credit of $809.44 . So there isn't a discrepancy as the items are two different things and you effective have NEM credits of $1,515.34.

Ah! That makes sense now! Too funny! So I guess it was a moderate coincidence that the two numbers were always very close to one another all of last year from month to month, but never actually EXACTLY the same... I was always assuming that the reason they were always "almost the same" was because of some fee or charge that was not being reflected on one side or the other... I guess the reason they are so far apart now is because of the switchover from EBCA to AVA? and a difference in how the new CCA calculates?

 

[YRide]

Ah! That makes sense now! Too funny! So I guess it was a moderate coincidence that the two numbers were always very close to one another all of last year from month to month, but never actually EXACTLY the same... I was always assuming that the reason they were always "almost the same" was because of some fee or charge that was not being reflected on one side or the other... I guess the reason they are so far apart now is because of the switchover from EBCA to AVA? and a difference in how the new CCA calculates?

Curios, @dho112 when did you get your PTO? Was it recent? Or a while ago…as you seem to be getting B&W bill.

Also, on your Blue bill…is it the newer blue bill format (BB2) like @holeydonut and I? Does it have all the cumulative NEM graphs and such? Or is it the same blue bill that has always been issued?

 

[Redhill_qik]

Ah! That makes sense now! Too funny! So I guess it was a moderate coincidence that the two numbers were always very close to one another all of last year from month to month, but never actually EXACTLY the same... I was always assuming that the reason they were always "almost the same" was because of some fee or charge that was not being reflected on one side or the other...

The unbundled distribution/transmission rates (PG&E) and the generation rates (PG&E or CCA) on average are fairly similar. Below is the EV2 rates for PG&E

During Peak and Part-Peak, the distribution/transmission rates are higher than generation, and during Off-Peak the lower than generation. Your mix of imports and exports happen to net out to something that is close to the same. For myself on E-TOU-C, the PG&E distribution net was -$722.09 and SVCE/CCA generation net was -$618.11 which is also close. BTW, both of us are "paying" extra for 100% solar, which increases our generation credits.

I guess the reason they are so far apart now is because of the switchover from EBCA to AVA? and a difference in how the new CCA calculates?

According to the Ava Energy Branding FAQ "Your rates and pricing will not change as a result of this brand evolution." So, no difference to you.

I am quite surprised that a CCA changed their name and then changed it something that is not easily identifiable as region specific. According to the FAQ "Ava" is a mashup/acronym/portmanteau of "Alameda County and the Valley". After skimming their website I think the name change is likely due to expanding their coverage region out to Tracy and Stockton which no one would consider "East Bay".