Is there a reason to get the Tesla wall connector over other level 2 home chargers?

[honor_the_driv]

I'm considering getting a Model Y but prior to that I want to have my home charging solution ready to go. The Tesla wall connector would make sense at least for this first electric vehicle but I wouldn't want to lock myself into Tesla's without having to pay for an adapter down the road.

So my question is, for Tesla owners, is there a reason to prefer the Tesla wall connector over other home level to chargers that have the Tesla adaptor (NACS I think) built-in? For example, does using a non Tesla charger at home have some impact on the warranty for the vehicle, or does using the Tesla wall connector bring some advantages with charging compared to other chargers?

P.s. I know Tessa will be coming out with a different wall connector in October that will have the adapter that most other manufacturers in North America need right now, but my current lease will be up in October so I would ideally have my charging solution ready well before then.

 

[Shea1012]

It does when I checked last in Jan this year. You may want to check the PSEG website for the list of qualifying chargers for the latest.

Thanks. The website is clear as bud but a quick phone call and they explained it was covered. What is frustrating is there is another program with a $250 rebate towards the charger purchase called ChargeUpNJ and they told me it wasn’t approved because the manufacturer has to apply to be part of the program.

 

[zroger73]

Thanks. The website is clear as bud but a quick phone call and they explained it was covered.

According to PGE&G's website, which I linked in my previous reply, NO Tesla charging equipment qualifies. According to them, the equipment must be Energy Star certified. Currently, Tesla has no Energy Star certified charging equipment as also shown in the other link I posted.

 

[howardnj]

I had a NJ licensed Tesla approved electrician install the Tesla Gen 3 Wall charger in my garage prior to the purchase of my Y
I received the PSE&G $1500 rebate as well as off peak charging credit. I have my charger set to begin charging to 90% at midnight and the cabin temperature set at 70* for a 6AM departure every morning. I am not familiar with other cheaper chargers and I stick with Tesla. You get what you par for in this world and often buying cheap results in buying twice.

 

[rogbmw]

I personally don't think one needs any special wall connector. Having owned our Model S for over 11 teams, and just getting into a Y, all I have ever used is a dedicated 50 Amp circuit with a NIMA 14-50 receptacle (dryer plug), and used the Tesla NIMA 14-50 adapter. I have always charged at 25 Amps, and will continue to do so with our new Y.

 

[kimwin]

I personally don't think one needs any special wall connector.

A dedicated 50A with NEMA 14-50 also need a dual 50A GFCI circuit breaker. Quality parts cost nearly the cost of the Tesla Wall Connector.
I did this homework before buying the Tesla Wall Connector. For my home, I could not find a dual 50A GFCI circuit breaker anywhere.
Only found a dual 50A breaker (that fit in my main panel) costing me nearly 80$ at home depot. No other hardware stores carry it.
The Wall Connector solution is just about 150$ more than the NEMA solution if I can get the right parts.

 

[29Rookies]

A dedicated 50A with NEMA 14-50 also need a dual 50A GFCI circuit breaker. Quality parts cost nearly the cost of the Tesla Wall Connector.
I did this homework before buying the Tesla Wall Connector. For my home, I could not find a dual 50A GFCI circuit breaker anywhere.
Only found a dual 50A breaker (that fit in my main panel) costing me nearly 80$ at home depot. No other hardware stores carry it.
The Wall Connector solution is just about 150$ more than the NEMA solution if I can get the right parts.

Exactly! So many do not realize this, but I learned this from this forum when doing research for my own charging needs. My dual 60a breaker for the wall charger was only $20 from home depot and like you, wasnt able to find a gfci for a mobile charger...

 

[BroncoAZ]

I had a ChargePoint L2 charger at my old house from when I owned a Ford Lighting. It worked well, but the charger itself was $700 in September 2022. I had an electrician install a new 60 amp circuit for the Tesla Gen 3 charger I bought off the website when I got the car. He ran 6/2 romex on a 60 amp breaker direct from the 90 amp garage sub panel to the charger. The Tesla charger was $450 plus tax, seems like a better deal than the ChargePoint and works seamlessly with the car and app. For the money I don’t know why someone would buy anything else unless they have another non Tesla EV to feed. The wiring was $1000 for a 60’ run through the attic and down the walls. I had him add another 50 amp circuit to my shop for the welder at the same time, that was $500. My utility is offering $700 towards the install if I let them throttle it down on peak demand times, plus I think there is still 30% at tax time for the EV charger install.

 

[Rocky_H]

I had an electrician install a new 60 amp circuit for the Tesla Gen 3 charger I bought off the website when I got the car. He ran 6/2 romex on a 60 amp breaker

And yet AGAIN we have to break out the exaggerated air quotes for this so-called "electrician" who doesn't know how to read ampacity ratings, and is violating code by using undersized wire for this circuit. That 6 gauge Romex is insufficient for a 60A circuit. Why do we keep seeing this same ignorant mistake being done by people calling themselves electricians?

I would call him on this B.S. and have him either replace it with larger size wire that complies with code, or switch the breaker and the wall connector setting down to a 50A circuit.

 

[BroncoAZ]

And yet AGAIN we have to break out the exaggerated air quotes for this so-called "electrician" who doesn't know how to read ampacity ratings, and is violating code by using undersized wire for this circuit. That 6 gauge Romex is insufficient for a 60A circuit. Why do we keep seeing this same ignorant mistake being done by people calling themselves electricians?

I would call him on this B.S. and have him either replace it with larger size wire that complies with code, or switch the breaker and the wall connector setting down to a 50A circuit.

Thanks for pointing that out. I told him 60 amps and sent him the installation manual from Tesla. He is a licensed electrician who does complete homes and commercial work. From reading some other posts on charger installation it appears the 6/2 and 60 amp breaker is a common mistake or misinterpretation by electricians. It’ll be easier to swap in the 50 amp breaker and derate the charger to 40 amps than to rerun the wire in conduit. I set my home charging in the app to 32 amps to 60% and don’t see a need to ever go beyond that to charge overnight.

 

[zroger73]

I set my home charging in the app to 32 amps to 60% and don’t see a need to ever go beyond that to charge overnight.

It is most efficient to charge as fast as possible to minimize the amount of time the vehicle stays awake.

 

[hmadsen]

I had a ChargePoint L2 charger at my old house from when I owned a Ford Lighting. It worked well, but the charger itself was $700 in September 2022. I had an electrician install a new 60 amp circuit for the Tesla Gen 3 charger I bought off the website when I got the car. He ran 6/2 romex on a 60 amp breaker direct from the 90 amp garage sub panel to the charger. The Tesla charger was $450 plus tax, seems like a better deal than the ChargePoint and works seamlessly with the car and app. For the money I don’t know why someone would buy anything else unless they have another non Tesla EV to feed. The wiring was $1000 for a 60’ run through the attic and down the walls. I had him add another 50 amp circuit to my shop for the welder at the same time, that was $500. My utility is offering $700 towards the install if I let them throttle it down on peak demand times, plus I think there is still 30% at tax time for the EV charger install.

View attachment 1037545

I opted to NOT buy the Tesla charger as it is very rudimentary, it does not support multiple features i wanted to have.

I have solar panels so i need automation to be able to adjust the charge amps, based on solar output. I guess this could be done via for example Home Assistant and just adjust the charge current "from the car", but i also need to be able to switch seamlessly between 1 phase and 3 phase charging, depending on the solar output.

I opted for a charger and controller that will measure how much current i send to the grid, and adjust the charger accordingly.

 

[tga]

It is most efficient to charge as fast as possible to minimize the amount of time the vehicle stays awake.

Bigger is not necessarily better. Resistive (heating) losses increase with the square of current (P=I^2*R). As you increase charge current, there's a point where energy wasted due to heating will outpace energy saved from go to sleep earlier.

 

[Cosmacelf]

And yet AGAIN we have to break out the exaggerated air quotes for this so-called "electrician" who doesn't know how to read ampacity ratings, and is violating code by using undersized wire for this circuit. That 6 gauge Romex is insufficient for a 60A circuit. Why do we keep seeing this same ignorant mistake being done by people calling themselves electricians?

I would call him on this B.S. and have him either replace it with larger size wire that complies with code, or switch the breaker and the wall connector setting down to a 50A circuit.

STOP IT. Massachusetts has an exception to the NEC rule. In most cases (like this one), 6 gauge romex is up to code for 60A.

Honestly, as soon as I read the post you replied to, I was thinking, maybe I should explain that this is legal in MA.

Can we just stop polluting these threads with this same angst over romex? Please?

 

[Cosmacelf]

Thanks for pointing that out. I told him 60 amps and sent him the installation manual from Tesla. He is a licensed electrician who does complete homes and commercial work. From reading some other posts on charger installation it appears the 6/2 and 60 amp breaker is a common mistake or misinterpretation by electricians. It’ll be easier to swap in the 50 amp breaker and derate the charger to 40 amps than to rerun the wire in conduit. I set my home charging in the app to 32 amps to 60% and don’t see a need to ever go beyond that to charge overnight.

Rocky is wrong in this instance. In MA, 6 gauge Romex is allowed for 60A circuits as long as some conditions are met.

 

[zroger73]

According to PGE&G's website, which I linked in my previous reply, NO Tesla charging equipment qualifies. According to them, the equipment must be Energy Star certified. Currently, Tesla has no Energy Star certified charging equipment as also shown in the other link I posted.

View attachment 1035429View attachment 1035430

In the past week, the Wall Connector has returned to the Energy Star website. The certification date is now 9/18/2023 - previously, i twas March 2023.

Product Finder — ENERGY STAR Certified Electric Vehicle Chargers (AC-Output)

Compare ENERGY STAR Certified Electric Vehicle Chargers (AC-Output), find rebates, and learn more.

www.energystar.gov

And, the Mobile Connector has been added with a certification date of 3/26/2024.

Product Finder — ENERGY STAR Certified Electric Vehicle Chargers (AC-Output)

Compare ENERGY STAR Certified Electric Vehicle Chargers (AC-Output), find rebates, and learn more.

www.energystar.gov

 

[Rocky_H]

STOP IT. Massachusetts has an exception to the NEC rule. In most cases (like this one), 6 gauge romex is up to code for 60A.

As to the "STOP IT", I've been on this forum for a decade. Why haven't I ever seen you bring this up before? I've never heard of any state overriding the national electric code on this. And if you're going to say something this outlandish, I would really like a reference.

 

[jjrandorin]

@Cosmacelf / @Rocky_H

You are both well known, knowledgeable, active members of TMC.

@Cosmacelf , that response was a bit harsh. You both have forgotten more about this topic than I have ever learned (much of what I know on this topic has been from reading various things the two of you have commented on), but one of the things that has been shared by many is how 6gauge romex, in general terms is good for up to 55 amps, not 60.

Im probably over generalizing here, and I have zero knowledge of MA rules so I am certainly not refuting what you are saying, just saying I understand why in general the expectation is that for a 60amp circuit an electrician wouldnt be installing 6 gauge romex.

Like I said, I trust your knowledge on this so if MA is different, thats good information, but it was a bit harsh to deliver it that way.

@Rocky_H thanks for what appears to me to be an attempt to re direct / de escalate to get to the root of that part of the discussion.

Thanks in advance, both of you esteemed members, for remaining civil.

=======================

(I know I appear to be laying this on a bit thick, lol, but I really do have a lot of respect for the knowledge you both have here, and am hoping you both have a civil discussion on this topic).

 

[boulder.dude]

It is most efficient to charge as fast as possible to minimize the amount of time the vehicle stays awake.

Based on my HPWC cable the car being noticeably warm (body temperature) at 48A, I suspect it isn’t as simple as you say. I don’t need to resistive heat my garage! When I dial it down to 40A it is much less noticeable (there are other posts on this site suggesting this is the efficient sweet spot).

 

[Vines]

@Cosmacelf / @Rocky_H

You are both well known, knowledgeable, active members of TMC.

@Cosmacelf , that response was a bit harsh. You both have forgotten more about this topic than I have ever learned (much of what I know on this topic has been from reading various things the two of you have commented on), but one of the things that has been shared by many is how 6gauge romex, in general terms is good for up to 55 amps, not 60.

Im probably over generalizing here, and I have zero knowledge of MA rules so I am certainly not refuting what you are saying, just saying I understand why in general the expectation is that for a 60amp circuit an electrician wouldnt be installing 6 gauge romex.

Like I said, I trust your knowledge on this so if MA is different, thats good information, but it was a bit harsh to deliver it that way.

@Rocky_H thanks for what appears to me to be an attempt to re direct / de escalate to get to the root of that part of the discussion.

Thanks in advance, both of you esteemed members, for remaining civil.

=======================

(I know I appear to be laying this on a bit thick, lol, but I really do have a lot of respect for the knowledge you both have here, and am hoping you both have a civil discussion on this topic).

I am not an MA electrician, but my understanding is that MA does not have a blanket restriction to use NM cable at 60C ampacity ratings. They are allowed to understand if NM is embedded in insulation for a good portion of its length, then it is rated at 60C and 55A. If there is no insulation to retain the heat, then the 75C ampacity may be used, resulting in 65A rating for the #6-3 romex.

 

[Rocky_H]

Can you give a link to a document of the Mass. code then that shows this? I would really like to learn if this is the case.