Considering leaving my just-built P85D at the altar for an 85D

danp · Mar 3, 2015

So I was on the fence for ages between the 85D and the P85D, and ended up sticking with the latter. The car just finished production, probably waiting to get on a train.

My big regret is not waiting until I could actually test drive both. I did drive the P85D back to back with regular 85s, and I found there to be a remarkable difference in how the cars felt, with the P85D feeling remarkably better. More composed, planted, precise, light, fun. But, based on feedback on the forums here from initial 85D deliveries, I now suspect I would have found the 85D much closer to the P85D, plus the next gen seats are no longer a factor as they're available for all cars.

The P85D also seems to be more of an energy hog than what Tesla's "official" numbers claim - seemingly in the high 300s to mid 400s with "normal" driving. I don't necessarily need 200+ miles for around the city driving, but the idea of paying 20K more for insane mode but with a significant range penalty isn't sitting well with me now. And winters are harsh where I am, with big impact on range.

Overall, the equation has changed for me, such that I'd rather have the 85D. So, I'm considering walking away from my order, and placing a new one for the 85D.

Does anyone know what happens in such cases? Is it just a matter of losing the deposit? Or am I legally / contractually to go through with the purchase?

And assuming I can transfer the order to avoid losing the deposit, anyone interested in getting their hands on a grey/grey P85D with 19"s, tech, air, pano, obeche matte, black headliner, cold weather, premium interior, high fidelity sound, and rear facing seats? It would be available in 2-3 weeks.

Tourman · Mar 3, 2015

danp said:
So I was on the fence for ages between the 85D and the P85D, and ended up sticking with the latter. The car just finished production, probably waiting to get on a train.

My big regret is not waiting until I could actually test drive both. I did drive the P85D back to back with regular 85s, and I found there to be a remarkable difference in how the cars felt, with the P85D feeling remarkably better. More composed, planted, precise, light, fun. But, based on feedback on the forums here from initial 85D deliveries, I now suspect I would have found the 85D much closer to the P85D, plus the next gen seats are no longer a factor as they're available for all cars.

The P85D also seems to be more of an energy hog than what Tesla's "official" numbers claim - seemingly in the high 300s to mid 400s with "normal" driving. I don't necessarily need 200+ miles for around the city driving, but the idea of paying 20K more for insane mode but with a significant range penalty isn't sitting well with me now. And winters are harsh where I am, with big impact on range.

Overall, the equation has changed for me, such that I'd rather have the 85D. So, I'm considering walking away from my order, and placing a new one for the 85D.

Does anyone know what happens in such cases? Is it just a matter of losing the deposit? Or am I legally / contractually to go through with the purchase?

And assuming I can transfer the order to avoid losing the deposit, anyone interested in getting their hands on a grey/grey P85D with 19"s, tech, air, pano, obeche matte, black headliner, cold weather, premium interior, high fidelity sound, and rear facing seats? It would be available in 2-3 weeks.

I'll trade you my Pearl White 85D, no charge. Fully loaded except rear facing seats and no executive seats. But yeah you would lose your deposit if you just refused delivery. Not sure if they'd let you re-order just like that too.

andrewket · Mar 3, 2015

Talk to your DS. They will more than likely move your deposit to a new 85D order with no penalty. Fwiw, I was able to achieve 315 wH/mile in Florida before the firmware with torque sleep came out. Is there a city driving penalty? You bet. But for highway driving the difference I think will settle at about 5%.

Canuck · Mar 3, 2015

Speak to Tesla about it. I've heard about them transferring deposits from cancelled orders to new orders so you never know. It's worth a try at least.

Tourman · Mar 3, 2015

Canuck said:
Speak to Tesla about it. I've heard about them transferring deposits from cancelled orders to new orders so you never know. It's worth a try at least.

I'm sure in most cases they would, but OP's car already finished production. Unless he already had someone at hand to take over, I can't see Tesla just letting him refuse delivery with no penalty.

yobigd20 · Mar 3, 2015

In the early days with there was a ton of stuff free and included with the P85 it made it a great value, but now ordering the same config is like $20k more, and moreso for P85D. If I were to do it again today, I would just go with the S85D. Ironically though, today's S85D optioned the same as my original early P85 would actually be even more expensive. Go figure.

647chang · Mar 3, 2015

If you cant get out of that p85d without some type of penalty let me know. I might just take your build instead of building mine.

stevezzzz · Mar 3, 2015

To the OP: I think you're overreacting to the reports of lower efficiency in the P85D. I don't dispute that there is as yet some penalty, particularly in city driving, but I've got 5300 miles on my P85D, all during the winter (obviously), with a lifetime average of 328 Wh/mi. I've successfully driven two, 251-mile legs, on a single charge, with better than 20 Rated miles remaining both times.

By all means, switch to the S85D if that's what you want: it's a great package and it's less expensive than the PD. Just thought you should have the benefit of my experience while you decide.

Canuck · Mar 3, 2015

Tourman said:
I'm sure in most cases they would, but OP's car already finished production. Unless he already had someone at hand to take over, I can't see Tesla just letting him refuse delivery with no penalty.

He's not refusing delivery with no penalty and just walking away. He's transferring the deposit to another new build. Again, it can't hurt to ask.

sundoc · Mar 3, 2015

I did something quite similar. Cancelled by already built (and enroute to me) P85+ for the P85D. No penalty and my deposit was rolled over.

Granted the difference is that I was getting into something more expensive, but I doubt you'll have a problem if you decide to switch. As mentioned by others, contact Tesla.

As for efficiency... Can't really comment since it's been crazy cold up here and I often drive it like I stole it

andrewket · Mar 3, 2015

stevezzzz said:
To the OP: I think you're overreacting to the reports of lower efficiency in the P85D. I don't dispute that there is as yet some penalty, particularly in city driving, but I've got 5300 miles on my P85D, all during the winter (obviously), with a lifetime average of 328 Wh/mi. I've successfully driven two, 251-mile legs, on a single charge, with better than 20 Rated miles remaining both times.

By all means, switch to the S85D if that's what you want: it's a great package and it's less expensive than the PD. Just thought you should have the benefit of my experience while you decide.

328 in the winter? Wow. Ok. I'm embarrassed to share my lifetime average now. ?!+|># insane mode.

DDotJ · Mar 3, 2015

andrewket said:
328 in the winter? Wow. Ok. I'm embarrassed to share my lifetime average now. ?!+|># insane mode.

I have a lifetime average of about 360 Wh/mile with 6,800 miles on the odometer. And I have an S85...
Must be the fact that I live in the hills? Winter is definitely not an issue here in SoCal. Or I might have a lead foot. Yikes!

fadkar · Mar 4, 2015

The S85D is definitely a balance of fun and efficiency. The P85D is just insanely awesome. You don't just get that car because it's good for the environment. You get that car because you're willing to buy a vehicle that'll get your heart racing every time you take it out for a ride

. If you can afford it (which I assume is why you ordered one in the first place), I say keep it and enjoy! Unless you're dying to get the lowest energy consumption.

David_Cary · Mar 4, 2015

I'm interested to hear more about the canceling order question - who at Tesla do you contact? I have a Pearl White 85 (tech, leather) in production - I've already emailed and it is too late to add the Next Gen seats (no surprise) but if I could get them without losing my deposit, I probably would. I realize that I would probably be waiting 2 months more...

danp · Mar 4, 2015

@stevezzz from this thread and others, it sounds like many with the P85D could only dream of low 300 whms. Obviously there are many factors, but I suspect it's really hard to drive this thing without punching it every opportunity. In any case, I appreciate the perspective, and yes I may be overreacting.

I'm going to see what Tesla says, and maybe pay a visit to the local store today for a quick back to back test drive of both, assuming they now have an 85D to test drive.

BTW I wasn't expecting to get the $2500 deposit back at all - I'd feel far less guilty if they keep it.

andrewket · Mar 4, 2015

danp said:
@stevezzz from this thread and others, it sounds like many with the P85D could only dream of low 300 whms. Obviously there are many factors, but I suspect it's really hard to drive this thing without punching it every opportunity. In any case, I appreciate the perspective, and yes I may be overreacting.

I'm going to see what Tesla says, and maybe pay a visit to the local store today for a quick back to back test drive of both, assuming they now have an 85D to test drive.

BTW I wasn't expecting to get the $2500 deposit back at all - I'd feel far less guilty if they keep it.

Don't feel guilty. They'll sell your P85D in a day or two.

sickfox · Mar 4, 2015

DanP - Hope you don't mind. Can you share your config? Color of car/interior, carbon fiber, etc?

stevezzzz · Mar 4, 2015

andrewket said:
328 in the winter? Wow. Ok. I'm embarrassed to share my lifetime average now. ?!+|># insane mode.

Unlike you, I have only hit triple digits once. :wink:

My point is that it's possible to get decent efficiency and range in the P85D, when you absolutely, positively have to have it. The fact that I'm averaging 328 has a lot to do with my generally conservative driving style, I'm sure; that, and two longish road trips where range was a factor and I had to baby it to get to the next charging station.

wycolo · Mar 4, 2015

That 328 has to be kicked upward a bit due to 5k+ altitude. At 7500 ft elevation there is only 50% of the air @sea level (the only metric I've seen) so maybe some here can come up with an adjustment factor. But I do admit to being half-gassed, usually. :smile:
--

danp · Mar 4, 2015

Well, went and test drove that 85D, and also talked at length with my sales advisor.

1) As I suspected, the 85D is great - it handles better and feels more planted than a 85. Acceleration lags slightly off the line, but at any speed it seems to accelerate almost as fast as the P85s did. If I drove this thing before I finalized my order, I would have stuck with the 85D.

2) It's just as east to hog the watts with an 85D as it is with a P85D. The average on the demo car was in the 700s, obviously due to spirited test drives. I managed to keep it a little above 300 on the highway, but had to really be gentle.

3) They can't transfer an existing order to someone else, and I'd lose my $5K deposit (I originally ordered when they were still 5K, and had it transferred).

The net is, I'm sticking with the P85D. Should have it in 2 weeks or so.

Considering leaving my just-built P85D at the altar for an 85D

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