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Tesla's Supercharger Team was recently laid off. We discuss what this means for the company on today's TMC Podcast streaming live at 1PM PDT. You can watch on X or on YouTube where you can participate in the live chat.
Tesla, TSLA & the Investment World: the Perpetual Investors' Roundtable
- Thread starter AudubonB
- Start date
- 420km WLPT is for the 58kWh variant
- 550km WLTP for the 77kWh
- Charge rates up to 120kW
- Augmentented Reality HUD (optional)
- Voice Commands in natural language
- Matrix LED headlamps
- Orders start in April 2020
- Deliveries Summer 2020
- no tow hitch mentioned
- I'm pretty sure he mentioned that the Matrix LED headlaps were for an upgraded trim.
- He did mention OTA updates. Although strangely added that you can also get updates at a dealership. Why would you go to a dealership to do an update that it can do over the air? Makes me wonder if it requires an optional extra.
- Given the lower energy efficiency, 120kW will be equivalent to 100kW for Model 3. Of course, the devil is in the charging curve comparison.
All in all: Decent. Bi-Color option inside and outside. 1st Edition with 4 colors only.
Dan Detweiler
Active Member
My opinion only, but I think once FSD is feature complete it will double in price...at least.
Dan
Sean Wagner
Member
WSJ guy insinuating there's niche demand for EVs, question how VW plans to amp up sales volume.
With plans to making only 30k in the first year, they'll have no trouble moving them all.
What they won't move: the needle.
Also note that their given numbers suggest that they have a production cost of ~$40k, for a vehicle with range stats similar to the SR+, charging slower than the SR+, and probably performance well less than the SR+. They've got a long way to go.
Okay, that clarifies things: Only some software can be updated OTA; others have to be updated at a dealership. Sounds like they have a long way to go in order to vertically integrate all of the system control software, and only have an OTA-updatable infotainment system.
(Normally cars are built as a bunch of "boxes" from third-party suppliers that are designed to function independently from each other... which makes it very hard to do what Tesla has done with integrating everything into a single ecosystem)
(Normally cars are built as a bunch of "boxes" from third-party suppliers that are designed to function independently from each other... which makes it very hard to do what Tesla has done with integrating everything into a single ecosystem)
Pras
Member
And assumably no AP and FSD hardwareWith plans to making only 30k in the first year, they'll have no trouble moving them all.
What they won't move: the needle.
Also note that their given numbers suggest that they have a production cost of ~$40k, for a vehicle with range stats similar to the SR+, charging slower than the SR+, and probably performance well less than the SR+. They've got a long way to go.
With plans to making only 30k in the first year, they'll have no trouble moving them all.
What they won't move: the needle.
Also note that their given numbers suggest that they have a production cost of ~$40k, for a vehicle with range stats similar to the SR+, charging slower than the SR+, and probably performance well less than the SR+. They've got a long way to go.
Yes, but I view it like giving the whole emobile movement some much needed credibility. The won't make money at first, but they will create public awareness. And they'll educate the masses. Something they even explicitly mentioned they want to do.
Reciprocity
Active Member
Very informative, love your posts in general. But I think people are only seeing one side of the equation. Tesla is concerned with 2 kinds of accidents, Tesla drivers fault and no fault. Also concerned with vandalism and theft (sentry mode). When insurance gets involved, who do they pay? Body shop? Tesla for parts? Scrap the car? Salvage the battery? Can Tesla recondition parts? Would they bother? My point is, Tesla will be insurer and the body shop, if you want them to fix it for 20% less than your local body shop. Actually the insurance will choose the cheapest quote. Tesla can prove fault in accidents and earn money on the repairs. Tesla doesn't have to make any money on insurance, just cover the costs of the body shop and parts/labor. My guess is that body shops will be service centers as well and provide even more service coverage.
Tesla is working extremely hard to lower the number of Tesla faulted accidents with the fsd computer, insurance will be cheaper with it then without. Even if you don't own fsd it will act as an active safety feature, a guardian angel. Warning first then taking over, but also always recording. Tesla's black box with all relevant crash related data to assign blame and pay out the smallest claims. The drivers rates will go up if fsd has to intervien. Rates will go down for safe drivers. Feedback can be instantaneous, training the driver how to be more safe. It's an insurance panacea where The insurance will actually train the driver while they drive.
People are focused on assessing risk is driving. What about the risks of parking? Name one other car with 360 degree dash cams and satellite tracking. With traditional insurance you get a discount for garaging the car, but how do they know if you do or don't? They don't know. If you have a claim and they question it, they can ask about the garage and fight you on the claim, but no proof to back them up. Tesla can literally change the rate on hours the car is not parked in the garage. They can overlay crime data and ding you there as well. With insurance today, it's about probabilities that you will be parked in a bad neighborhood, with Tesla, it will be about facts not probabilities.
Tesla can sell your insurance in one click. No questions needed, they already know more about you then you do. They can preasses if they even want to insure you before insurance is available. It can pop up right on your screen with an "ok" or "no I want me Mommy" button. E-sign documents show up seconds later I'm the phone app and Bob's your Uncle, your insured.
Lastly, Elon is well known for disrupting things that are better left undisrupted. PayPal, SpaceX, Tesla, tunnels, AI, machine human interfaces. The harder a nut is to crack, the better it is for Elon. He doesn't seem to care to disrupt online dating apps or YouTube or social networks. He wants the most complex businesses, then he turns them upside down and shakes them until all the lint and crap falls out, leaving only the bare minimalistic cleanest first principles solution.
I do wish them well in the long run. I do think they're completely serious about their plans to electrify in a major way. But this makes it very clear to anyone who wasn't already aware: we're talking the long run, not the near-term. The I.D. line isn't going to be an anything-killer any time soon.
Asked whether they're making money with the first edition. Sheepish laugh. "Plan and commitment for us as a management team is to run a profitable operation of the I.D. family". Hedged on whether they'd be able to do that in the first 1-2 years, though.
Asked about autonomy features. Response: pessimistic about the rate and degree of advancement of autonomus technology. But says car is "physically equipped for level 3", and will deploy software as they develop it.
Dodged a question about how many orders they expect, beyond that they plan to sell out their initial variants before the Frankfurt show.
58kWh is their "MR" variant; they also plan a SR and LR variant. But given that 77kWh is only 33% bigger than 58kWh (vs. Tesla's LR battery being about 50% bigger than the SR's), the difference won't be as dramatic.
Dodged a question about how many orders they expect, beyond that they plan to sell out their initial variants before the Frankfurt show.
58kWh is their "MR" variant; they also plan a SR and LR variant. But given that 77kWh is only 33% bigger than 58kWh (vs. Tesla's LR battery being about 50% bigger than the SR's), the difference won't be as dramatic.
Carl Raymond
Active Member
Yeah, it will sell, what they can make. Well done VW - nice dieselgate recovery. But the question on every TSLA investors mind is: will it adversely impact Model 3 sales?
I don’t believe so. The level of EV awareness is still so low that any measure that increases EV awareness and moves electrics into the mainstream will greatly assist Tesla.
For every ID buyer there will be hundreds of new conversations about ICE v EV. Many of those conversations will pave a road to Tesla. Of course, prepare for a FUD storm proclaiming the killers are coming.
30k/yr in the first year of production, which starts at the end of this year. 100k/yr "eventually". Plant at completion, all models combined, years down the line, 300k/yr.
So, no.
Sean Wagner
Member
Thank you for the heads up!
I think 30K is for the special first edition model [that includes the HU display? Nifty with the added augmented reality.]
Important to note much further information will be forthcoming only at the Frankfurt show in September [like power & weight].
What I gathered is that the VW brand - hence not including Seat, Skoda, Audi, etc. - is set to build 100'000 IDs in Europe in the first year of production [different from calendar year], and importantly, 1'000'000 EVs globally in 2025. Gives some perspective on the giant numbers being bandied about lately.
Carl Raymond
Active Member
You saw it in zebra stripes, inside a zebra striped glass box. The shape was slightly more inspiring than a bolt. Still boxy, but longer. I think it has a grille.
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