Supercharger price hikes: what's your opinion?

[bisoned]

Human Nature. Free = abuse Maybe not you in particular but for far to many it is a word they can't pass up, no matter the personal cost and consequences of lost time and productivity...

You have free, unlimited Supercharging for your current Tesla vehicle as well as any new Model S or Model X purchased before January 31, 2018


ok.... so here's what I copied from Tesla regarding supercharging. Where is it implied that you cannot abuse it? It says "free, unlimited".

Moreover, I believe some of their fuel savings calculations include an assumption of supercharger usage.

Just because you think it's abuse, and it might not be something you take advantage of, does not mean it's abuse. Unless the definition of free and unlimited has changed since I last checked.

 

[Naekuh]

Tesla can charge whatever they want, but don't false advertise the price of your vehicle lower because of 'gas savings' when there actually aren't any.

This i completely agree...

It would be like ford calculating the discount in using regular gas over the premium it takes on european cars, and marking down the price...

lol...

Wont be long before they tax it .....

This would be up to the fed/state.
You cant charge tax unless the fed/state charges it.

This is why when you buy out of state, there is no sales tax.
Well not unless you live in California, because we have something stupid called Use Tax which is used to fund stupid things like voting to see if we can get an extra roll of toilet paper inside the bathrooms.
Well sarcasm on the last part, but California is really a terrible place to live outside the weather.

 

[boonedocks]

You have free, unlimited Supercharging for your current Tesla vehicle as well as any new Model S or Model X purchased before January 31, 2018


ok.... so here's what I copied from Tesla regarding supercharging. Where is it implied that you cannot abuse it? It says "free, unlimited".

Moreover, I believe some of their fuel savings calculations include an assumption of supercharger usage.

Just because you think it's abuse, and it might not be something you take advantage of, does not mean it's abuse. Unless the definition of free and unlimited has changed since I last checked.

I think most of took it as "free supercharging while traveling" as quoted by Elon here:
”that superchargers are meant for free, long-distance travel”
https://www.teslarati.com/why-tesla-superchargers-only-long-distance-travel/

I know Elon has a problem with saying things that are wildly interpreted, even by himself LOL, but I do believe the "spirit" of what he meant when saying "free super charging for life" was definitely not free unlimited fueling for life with no self charging involved.

You most certainly can take it and use it all you like since it was a poor choice of words. I firmly believe if everyone used it for travel purposes it would still be free for every car, past, present, and future. \i/

 

[ucmndd]

Tesla can charge whatever they want, but don't false advertise the price of your vehicle lower because of 'gas savings' when there actually aren't any.

Or simply restate it to indicate that "home charging" is substantially cheaper than gasoline. If you're doing 90%+ of your charging at home, like almost all EV owners are, the savings are significant.

Superchargers are about convenience. I see no reason why they need to be cheaper than gasoline.

 

[intelligator]

Is there data available through the charge port to report what percentage of charging is done at SC vs "home charging"? Could it be used to limit the rate and duration of charge to drive more charging at home? I don't know if it's happening; I've not used an SC yet and have four months left to do so. It hardly seems fair for drivers to wait for a free bay when the cars ahead are getting free charge because its free and not out of necessity (road trip).

 

[PWlakewood]

Supercharging was never meant to be used on a daily basis hence the reason why they spread them out like they did. We have about 4 in Wa State and they are located at spots that you would want to charge before driving any farther ie over the mountain pass.

 

[cpa]

Well not unless you live in California, because we have something stupid called Use Tax

Every state has a use tax to complement its sales tax. It is just that most states are not as aggressive as California in assessing and collecting it from ordinary citizens who buy $232.00 of merchandise ex-tax from out-of-state. However, from personal experience, I can tell you that if a company purchased a pricey piece of equipment from out-of-state, the taxing authorities would sniff it out and send a bill for the use tax.

It makes more sense for a state with 40 million residents to pursue use taxes against those who are buying taxable merchandise ex-tax than a state like Wyoming with < 600,000 residents.

 

[gavine]

For those who have free supercharging, higher charging rates should presumably raise the resale value of your cars, especially now that free supercharging will no longer be offered at all.

 

[brkaus]

Moreover, I believe some of their fuel savings calculations include an assumption of supercharger usage.

10% - if I recall correctly.

 

[bisoned]

For those who have free supercharging, higher charging rates should presumably raise the resale value of your cars, especially now that free supercharging will no longer be offered at all.

and will keep some away...... my vote is to increase the cost, but that is because I have free supercharging

 

[Tic-tac-toe]

Most model S/X owners are wealthy enough to own their own home and therefore charge at home. I have lifetime free supercharging from when I bought my Model S over a year ago. So far I have used a supercharger 10 times total.

As far as price, Tesla should charge whatever the market will bear. Subsidizing the price of superchargers by cannibalizing other business units' cash flow is not a viable long term strategy. Price signals need to be accurate to optimize the supply/demand curves and make the most economic good for the most people.

You realize that many homes in cities with some of the most expensive real estate in the country likes NYC, SanFrancisco, etc don’t have garages and home charging.

So you think Tesla should only sell to people who live in subdivisions?

 

[dark cloud]

Here is a relevant article:

B.C.’s rollout of charging stations for electric cars has cost about $2.5 million more than projected | The Star

 

[Zooomer]

Or simply restate it to indicate that "home charging" is substantially cheaper than gasoline. If you're doing 90%+ of your charging at home, like almost all EV owners are, the savings are significant.

That's not true. I live in MI and electric is .18/KWH, Gas is $2/gal.
My P100d uses around 600w per mile depending on how I driving giving me 167 miles out of $18 worth of electric.
$18 buys 9 gallons of gas. If a car gets 18.5 miles per gallon, it's break even.


Since I have to pay for my electric post tax and gas is business deductible (for me) My Tesla costs significantly more than my Escalade per mile to drive. In depreciation, in fuel. I realize this is unique to me and the Tesla is a better car BUT my point is just to say, quit advertising the fuel savings when there aren't any. Used to be said supercharging was free/low cost but currently you pay a huge premium to SC. In NY it literally costs 2-3x as much to drive a P100d than most premium sedans on a per mile basis (using superchargers).

 

[Mediocrates]

I can well believe that someone would pay $500 a month for gas. What surprised me was the claim that gas costs 20% to 40% more when purchased at places other than Costco.

It's not, at least not in California. I've lived around gas-providing Costcos for 15 years (and often used them in that span of time). You're looking at more like 10 cents per gallon compared to "generic" gas and maybe 20 cents per gallon compared to the most expensive "brand name" gas (Shell, Chevron, etc.).

 

[gavine]

My P100d uses around 600w per mile

Wow. That's terrible efficiency. I didn't realize the P100D was so inefficient. My Model X 90D is around 350wH/mile. Is your regen set on low?

 

[boonedocks]

That's not true. I live in MI and electric is .18/KWH, Gas is $2/gal.
My P100d uses around 600w per mile depending on how I driving giving me 167 miles out of $18 worth of electric.
$18 buys 9 gallons of gas. If a car gets 18.5 miles per gallon, it's break even.


Since I have to pay for my electric post tax and gas is business deductible (for me) My Tesla costs significantly more than my Escalade per mile to drive. In depreciation, in fuel. I realize this is unique to me and the Tesla is a better car BUT my point is just to say, quit advertising the fuel savings when there aren't any. Used to be said supercharging was free/low cost but currently you pay a huge premium to SC. In NY it literally costs 2-3x as much to drive a P100d than most premium sedans on a per mile basis (using superchargers).

Zoomer, I honestly can't think of any car made that would give you 18.5 mpg that would give you the performance you are used to if you indeed are using 600w a mile in your P100D. I agree with your math IF the two were on equal playing fields. If you are using 600w a mile you are driving that thing like a "bat out of hell". I used to get about 27mpg in my BMW AH7 but if I drove it like I drive my S100D (using ~300W a mile) I only got in the 15mpg range.

 

[dark cloud]

That's not true. I live in MI and electric is .18/KWH, Gas is $2/gal.
My P100d uses around 600w per mile depending on how I driving giving me 167 miles out of $18 worth of electric.
$18 buys 9 gallons of gas. If a car gets 18.5 miles per gallon, it's break even.

.

How is gas that cheap? That is $0.52 per litre in Canadian units. I looked back in time and that was the price in Vancouver in 1995. By the year 2000 it went up to 0.699 and it has gone up at least 10% per year every year since.

And I agree with @boonedocks, if you are driving around that "inefficiently" (you must have really good neck muscles) but you need to compare a Lamborghini or maybe a Bugatti.

Maybe your utility should be burning gasoline to turn some turbine generators instead of coal.

 

[dark cloud]

It's not, at least not in California. I've lived around gas-providing Costcos for 15 years (and often used them in that span of time). You're looking at more like 10 cents per gallon compared to "generic" gas and maybe 20 cents per gallon compared to the most expensive "brand name" gas (Shell, Chevron, etc.).

Yes, 20 cents per gallon discount on a $2.50 gallon is worthwhile doing, but it is still less than 10%.

 

[G3pilot]

I do most of my charging at home. Only use Superchargers for trips, and it’s still less expensive then buying gas, at least in my state. So, I guess you could say I’m okay with it.

 

[gavine]

you are driving that thing like a "bat out of hell"

Well, his screen name is Zooomer so.....