Model 3 new USB C center console data hub from model Y?

[Durzel]

Hold on folks. I have a theory that it just needs a new console harness. There are two possible part numbers. I'm going to see if my local service center will order both for me......

I know a new console harness sounds like a lot of work. But, by the time you get the USB hub out... it's easily do-able.

Remember, the parts we ordered are for Tesla Model3 cars. There is a way to make it work. Give me time and I'll figure it out.

Assuming this is the harness in question, it does sound like it would be a hell of a lot easier to fabricate a couple of pigtails to connect the old harness and new parts together.

On the basis that Abstract Ocean make pigtails to extend the door puddle lights I'm assuming (and hoping) that the connectors Tesla use, including the old cross shaped 4 pin and new L shaped 4 pin are not bespoke items.

 

[smatthew]

That's basically the harness. But the old version.

I'm worried that they changed the pins because they are transmitting more power. The question is - did the wire gauge in the harness change? If so using a pigtail or changing the connector might not be a good idea.

I doubt the connector is bespoke. Every connector exists on the internet, you just have to identify it....

 

[Durzel]

Well, the spade connectors on the new connector look quite a bit bigger than the old one, so you could be right.

As I understand it the USB-A ports on the earlier Model 3 output 5V and 2A. The newer USB-C ports have been shown to do 9V and 3A.

I guess the question is whether or not the old loom gauge is rated to do that extra voltage & amps, across two ports at the rear and one at the front (I presume the USB-A at the front still does 5V/2A), if - as you say - the newer loom is replaced all the way from the connector back.

 

[Durzel]

Been doing some digging, and thought I'd list my findings..

The old harness is 1067956-02-D - ASY,HARN,CENTER CONSOLE,M3,PREM,DHUB - from parts catalog

The equivalent Model Y harness is 2067956-02-B - ASY,HARN,CENTER CONSOLE,PREM,THUB - from parts catalog

I'm wondering whether these harnesses aren't identical between the cars, as there is a 2067956-00-B - ASY,HARN,CENTER CONSOLE,M3,PREM,NO ECALL as well. I don't know the significance of the "NO ECALL" bit, but the part number looks closer to the Model Y generation part.

Also on the Model Y harness there is one fewer connector at one end of it, close to the L shaped connector that @AxlxA discovered:

...compared to the Model 3 version (again, old harness):

Like the other newer generation parts the parts catalog doesn't reflect this in the images, it only shows the original one.

 

[smatthew]

Yeah I'm just going to call the service center and ask what harness goes with the new usb hub. The computer should tell them.

I was curious what "no ecall" meant. Turns out in Europe there's a standard for an "ecall module". When a severe accident is detected it transmits the vehicles vin, location, and type of accident automatically to the European emergency number. Supposedly it's secure and can't be used nefariously to track anyone.
And European Teslas have a "SOS" button next to their hazard light button to initiate an ecall.

edit: I texted my service rep. We'll see what he says.

 

[MP3Mike]

Yeah I'm just going to call the service center and ask what harness goes with the new usb hub.

The problem then becomes if they upgraded the wires in that harness for more power, where does that harness connect to? And was it upgraded as well? (All the way until you get back to the VC controller.) The VC controller might also turn off the ports if it detects more power draw than your car is supposed to have. (I don't know how close they monitor the power draw.)

 

[smatthew]

Ok this is curious. I'm looking at wiring diagrams. (PS: Anyone have Model Y Diagrams/service docs yet? PM me) Have the version 1 and version 3 (2018 and 2019) versions. VCLeft has one pin for the front USB power, and one pin for the rear USB power. The harness combines those pins prior to the connector where the console harness attaches. And then the console harness splits the wires out again.

I don't see any danger that the VCLeft harness would need to be changed. The USB power wires in the VCLeft harness are 2mm^2 (Approximately 15 gauge). They use the same thickness of wire for the 12V power port which is rated at what, 10 or 12 amps?

 

[oripaamoni]

Ok this is curious. I'm looking at wiring diagrams. (PS: Anyone have Model Y Diagrams/service docs yet? PM me) Have the version 1 and version 3 (2018 and 2019) versions. VCLeft has one pin for the front USB power, and one pin for the rear USB power. The harness combines those pins prior to the connector where the console harness attaches. And then the console harness splits the wires out again.

I don't see any danger that the VCLeft harness would need to be changed. The USB power wires in the VCLeft harness are 2mm^2 (Approximately 15 gauge). They use the same thickness of wire for the 12V power port which is rated at what, 10 or 12 amps?

I am not concerned with the wiring either, but it may be too much current for those small pins. 2x usb-c ports pulling 9v 3a would be 4.5 amp @12v on those incoming pins. Could be easily bench tested with a bench power supply to observe if the pins are getting hot showing resistance. I am super comfortable with pining and making harnesses. Let's see if we can start identifying the connecters and will buy some and do some testing. Anybody have any numbers they can read off those connectors to point us in a direction to start.

 

[smatthew]

I am not concerned with the wiring either, but it may be too much current for those small pins. 2x usb-c ports pulling 9v 3a would be 4.5 amp @12v on those incoming pins. Could be easily bench tested with a bench power supply to observe if the pins are getting hot showing resistance. I am super comfortable with pining and making harnesses. Let's see if we can start identifying the connecters and will buy some and do some testing. Anybody have any numbers they can read off those connectors to point us in a direction to start.

Only way we're getting the numbers off the connectors is to buy a new harness or disassemble a new 3 or Y.

Haven't heard back from my service contact. Texting my ranger.

 

[AxlxA]

Only way we're getting the numbers off the connectors is to buy a new harness or disassemble a new 3 or Y.

Haven't heard back from my service contact. Texting my ranger.

At least the connector part is super easy. Just pull the rear vents off and take a pic. Can do it on a test drive vehicle lol. No, don't break anything please! I'm not endorsing harming anything.

 

[smatthew]

At least the connector part is super easy. Just pull the rear vents off and take a pic. Can do it on a test drive vehicle lol. No, don't break anything please! I'm not endorsing harming anything.

oh damn that's a good idea ;-} Think they'd notice if I just took the center console harness home with me?

 

[Navak]

yeah bro thanks for spearheading this and takin' one for the team.

I bet @Navak could fashion up a pigtail...

Sorry for late response. Looking at 12V connector picture of the old hub I`m guessing those contacts can support up 1.5A on each pin. 4 pin connector is split in to 2 pairs (pin 1, 2 - positive and pin 3, 4 - negative ). The new hub has beefier 12V contacts and can output up to 45Watts. If we add 10% loss of DC-to-DC converters it can easy pull around 50W from 12V side. (5A total). Most probably Tesla changed the 12V supply current limit and wires in order to support the new hub.

Short answer: I would not modify the cable until I`m sure the old cable harness and 12V power supply are capable to handle the new load.

 

[smatthew]

The service center got back to me yesterday. They're investigating what harness to order me.

 

[smatthew]

And I just had a light bulb go off. Not a good light bulb.
I was looking at the adapters for ScanMyTesla, and they mention that the big connector at the rear of the center console changed - it's different for 2018 and 2019+ cars.

Fudge.
That means for my 2018 car, I cannot just replace the console harness unless I want to make an adapter.
I could buy a 2018 ScanMyTesla adapter and a 2019 ScanMyTesla adapter and meld the two into a Frankenstein. Except 2019 has 6 additional pins... and I can't find out what two of them do.....
Or I could replace the VCLeft harness... **SHUDDER** It's a 71 step procedure that basically strips the car to the bones. And probably requires a new VCLeft controller.

PS: Just got back from the service center. They confirmed my fears.

So as I see it here are the options
1) Say, "Good try" and return the parts
2) Make it work

For a 2018 car (like mine) the options to make it work include (Listed from most expensive to least expensive):
1) Replace VCLeft, VCLeft Harness, and Console Harness.
2) Replace Console Harness and build a converter. Console harness is probably $75. The converter would cost like $40 and include the ScanMyTesla odb plug
3) Remove the current connectors that go to the USB devices and replace them with the correct connectors. Maybe $10 bucks?

A 2019 Car could use option 2 without the converter. Or Option 3.

#1 would get expensive. Don't think it's actually necessary unless you want a "like factory" car.
#3 is what I'm going to target first. I'd appreciate if anyone has any leads on what kind of power connectors the new USB hub uses. It has 4 2.6mm blades that are approximately 1mm thick

Something else interesting: Tesla designed the car to have a rear AC button. The 2019 harness still had wires for it, but the 2019 VCLeft doesn't connect to those pins anymore.

 

[AxlxA]

@smatthew
#4 Hotwire a 12V cig adapter plug right next to the USB ports, and just buy the wireless charging pads. No solution for rear vent plugs unfortunately.

 

[smatthew]

@smatthew
#4 Hotwire a 12V cig adapter plug right next to the USB ports, and just buy the wireless charging pads. No solution for rear vent plugs unfortunately.

That's the kind of constructive thinking we need here! ;-}

 

[sonicP3D]

#5 Splice/T-Tap out 12V from before cig port and make your own L-plug into the new hubs. (Need to find the mating connector part number and buy from Mouser.) They don't monitor that 12V unless it is a hard short. Should be more than capable to power the hubs, front and rear. Now question is simply how solid your splice/T-Taps and wiring are.

 

[smatthew]

#5 Splice/T-Tap out 12V from before cig port and make your own L-plug into the new hubs. (Need to find the mating connector part number and buy from Mouser.) They don't monitor that 12V unless it is a hard short. Should be more than capable to power the hubs, front and rear. Now question is simply how solid your splice/T-Taps and wiring are.

A possibility, but I don't think that is necessary. The 12V socket and the USB ports both have the same pin size (large) and wire gauge. The front and back USBs are powered through the same connector. Even if the firmware is cranky, you'd have to be charging several high draw USB-C devices at the same time in order to draw enough power to raise it's concerns.

But let's be honest here. The hard part is going to be finding the L connector. Unless someone with a Y (or someone on a test drive) can show us a photo of the connector we don't even know what manufacturer makes it. There are no markings on the connector on the USB hub side.

 

[smatthew]

AC Delco PT548 is awfully close. But not perfect. The spacing of the spades in the Tesla connector is not even.

 

[smatthew]

I think I came up with a workaround.... details tomorrow