Medicare for all - fixing US healthcare

[nwdiver]

Flu shots

I REALLY don't understand that one... why the EFF are flu shots $20 w/o insurance???? If there's a place we should be putting public $$$ it's letting any Tom, Dick or Jane that wants a vaccine to walk into a CVS and get it $0 down... no questions asked (aside from are you allergic to the flu shot). I want ZERO excuses for the guy getting paid $7.50/hr making my burrito bowl to have his flu shot. Eating at Chipotle is already too adventurous.

 

[eevee-fan]

I REALLY don't understand that one... why the EFF are flu shots $20 w/o insurance???? If there's a place we should be putting public $$$ it's letting any Tom, Dick or Jane that wants a vaccine to walk into a CVS and get it $0 down... no questions asked (aside from are you allergic to the flu shot). I want ZERO excuses for the guy getting paid $7.50/hr making my burrito bowl to have his flu shot. Eating at Chipotle is already too adventurous.

Re: Flu Shot Price
Even worse, just got my quarterly EOB last week... pharmacy billed $50 which I guess is retail price, insurance allowed $40 and paid it, $0 co-pay for me.

Re: Free Flu Shot
Looks like at least LA provides it for free for those without insurance.
LA County Library

 

[RDoc]

So apparently, White House policy is that tests and treatment for corona virus will be billed to the patient if not insured. That will create a pool of about 40 million people, plus any undocumented people who will try to hide from testing and treatment. I suspect a lot of these people also are dependent on their paychecks so don't want to miss a shift.

Sounds to me like we're going to have a bunch of people working in kitchens, hotels, convention centers, home health aides, etc. actively avoiding testing and treatment while simultaneously going to work when they are sick.

President The Donald is going to to be between a rock and hard place. Either the government practices Socialized Medicine and pays for care, or the pandemic proceeds and good, hard working, god fearing Republicans get sick and die. So, either endorse Bernie and Elizabeth's signature policy or have your supporters die, hmmm.....

 

[eevee-fan]

... but Dear Leader says not to worry and party like it's 1999.

 

[EV-Tiger]

you’ll like this then...

View attachment 516591

I liked it when my healthcare costs were lower, which was before Obamacare. Thanks to that disaster, it is much higher. And I’m not interested in getting my healthcare from the DMV.

 

[nwdiver]

I liked it when my healthcare costs were lower, which was before Obamacare. Thanks to that disaster, it is much higher. And I’m not interested in getting my healthcare from the DMV.

Healthcare at the DMV is better than unaffordable healthcare. Even granting your inaccurate statement is true it was STILL unaffordable before Obamacare and not getting any better. Anything is better than the mess we have now or had before. Just throw a dart at a Map. Norway? Sounds good. UK? Sign me up. France? I'd vote for that in a heartbeat. Germany? ok... Pick one.

The US is becoming a 'developed country' in name only. It's pathetic. There's healthcare organizations normally providing free clinics in refugee camps setting up clinics in Tennessee. And there are so many people needing help they have to turn some away.

 

[eevee-fan]

I liked it when my healthcare costs were lower, which was before Obamacare. Thanks to that disaster, it is much higher. And I’m not interested in getting my healthcare from the DMV.

... until you change job or lose your job due to a medical condition then get rejected for new insurance. Oh well, so sad, huh?

 

[nwdiver]

rejected for new insurance.

Fortunately they can't do that any more. They kept the part of the ACA protecting preexisting conditions but eliminated the individual mandate. Now you can wait until you have a chronic illness to pay into insurance so healthy people are incentivized to not pay into insurance which will make things even worse overall. Ain't 'merca grand?

 

[rxlawdude]

Fortunately they can't do that any more. They kept the part of the ACA protecting preexisting conditions but eliminated the individual mandate. Now you can wait until you have a chronic illness to pay into insurance so healthy people are incentivized to not pay into insurance which will make things even worse overall. Ain't 'merca grand?

Except the Administration is in court at this time to gut all provisions of the ACA. Including prohibition against refusing patients with pre-existing conditions.

 

[nwdiver]

Except the Administration is in court at this time to gut all provisions of the ACA. Including prohibition against refusing patients with pre-existing conditions.

Most people support protecting people with pre-existing conditions but are too ignorant to understand the individual mandate makes that possible. It will be interesting to see how this plays out....

My favorite ignorant quip was that the ACA doesn't work because healthy people are subsidizing sick people. Um.... that's literally how ALL insurance works. That's essentially the DEFINITION of insurance....

For any rational thinking person hearing that should be immediate cause to go somewhere else for a solution. That's like taking your car to a mechanic and he says with 100% seriousness 'There's yer problem... this car has 4 wheels'

 

[rxlawdude]

Most people support protecting people with pre-existing conditions but are too ignorant to understand the individual mandate makes that possible. It will be interesting to see how this plays out....

My favorite ignorant quip was that the ACA doesn't work because healthy people are subsidizing sick people. Um.... that's literally how ALL insurance works. That's essentially the DEFINITION of insurance....

Yep.

 

[reddy]

I liked it when my healthcare costs were lower, which was before Obamacare. Thanks to that disaster, it is much higher. And I’m not interested in getting my healthcare from the DMV.

Actually healthcare costs nationwide are MUCH higher, but when Obamacare was enacted they leveled off for a few years. The increases resumed as Obamacare was dismantled.

Perhaps you can pick the point on this graph where you feel Obamacare caused healthcare costs to go up.

 

[reddy]

 

[EinSV]

It amazes me how proficient those with money are at not seeing past their own wallet. So entitled. Like Bill Gates' character on The Simpsons, "I didn't get rich writing a lot of checks", doesn't matter that he is stealing Homer's idea and beating him up.

Randy,

I don't think this is (or at least should be) a rich v. poor issue. Paying for health insurance and health care is absurdly expensive and we don't get value for the money, whether rich or poor. Last I checked, the wealthy liked saving money as much as anyone else.

The wealthy, middle class and poor, individuals and corporations (except those in the health care and insurance businesses) would all be better off with a single payer system.

Nobody benefits from the current system except the companies and individuals who directly financially benefit from providing overpriced pharmaceuticals, medical equipment, medical care, insurance, etc. etc.

I do think it would be helpful to have the option to allow people to buy private insurance and services outside the system, and think that might soften some of the opposition. Let private insurance or private care try to compete with a good single payer system -- and if they can more power to them.

 

[nwdiver]

I do think it would be helpful to have the option to allow people to buy private insurance and services outside the system, and think that might soften some of the opposition. Let private insurance or private care try to compete with a good single payer system -- and if they can more power to them.

Yep. We have socialized police but people can still buy additional private security. We have socialized fire departments but the company I worked for had its own private fire brigade. People with private security and fire brigades still fund public police and fire services.

Just like with those services EVERYONE pays in relative to their ability to do so. If you want to purchase additional healthcare, police or fire protection feel free to do so...

 

[EinSV]

Yep. We have socialized police but people can still buy additional private security. We have socialized fire departments but the company I worked for had its own private fire brigade. People with private security and fire brigades still fund public police and fire services.

Just like with those services EVERYONE pays in relative to their ability to do so. If you want to purchase additional healthcare, police or fire protection feel free to do so...

Great analogies -- I hadn't thought of it that way.

 

[brkaus]

Yep. We have socialized police but people can still buy additional private security. We have socialized fire departments but the company I worked for had its own private fire brigade. People with private security and fire brigades still fund public police and fire services.

Just like with those services EVERYONE pays in relative to their ability to do so. If you want to purchase additional healthcare, police or fire protection feel free to do so...

The costs will continue to climb unless it is rationed in some way. It costs a fortune if everyone needs to try the latest and greatest unproven medicine or stay on life support for weeks or months in the late years. Police and fire departments are limited. That's why companies buy their own private security or fire brigade. If the analogy sticks, I would expect it to be similar for healthcare.

 

[nwdiver]

The costs will continue to climb unless it is rationed in some way. It costs a fortune if everyone needs to try the latest and greatest unproven medicine or stay on life support for weeks or months in the late years. Police and fire departments are limited. That's why companies buy their own private security or fire brigade. If the analogy sticks, I would expect it to be similar for healthcare.

Point is that no one 'needs' private security or their own private fire brigade. If we privatized it the cost would rise for EVERYONE. Every other western nation in the world has managed to provide universal healthcare to their citizens AND achieved better results than the disaster in the US. Privatization doesn't decrease 'rationing'... it just increases the cost.

 

[brkaus]

Point is that no one 'needs' private security or their own private fire brigade. If we privatized it the cost would rise for EVERYONE. Every other western nation in the world has managed to provide universal healthcare to their citizens AND achieved better results than the disaster in the US. Privatization doesn't decrease 'rationing'... it just increases the cost.

I thought the point was that we have public fire and police that are funded by the general population. But they not without limit and thus not good enough for everyone. In fact, many organizations hire their own security companies. Banks, jewelry stores, major companies. Even upscale gated communities.

Yet, we expect our healthcare system to be limitless for everyone.

 

[nwdiver]

I thought the point was that we have public fire and police that are funded by the general population. But they not without limit and thus not good enough for everyone. In fact, many organizations hire their own security companies. Banks, jewelry stores, major companies. Even upscale gated communities.

Yet, we expect our healthcare system to be limitless for everyone.

No one is expecting anything to be 'limitless'. Private security and fire has limits too and is backed by public police and fire. Where I worked we had our own fire brigade but still called 911 when there was a fire and expected a response. Pretty sure Banks, jewelry stores, major companies and upscale gated communities still call the police if there's a disturbance.