How often do you use autopilot?

[GeorgeSymonds]

Not that often. In medium, variable speed, traffic I might use TACC (speed only) as judging how much the car in front is braking is frustrating and it can help as a second opinion. Maybe on a long drive (an hour+) on quiet motorways I’ll use it, but I find driving controls are pretty instinctive and you have to concentrate the same even when using it so I don’t feel like I get much benefit.

The real benefit for me will come when it can do level 3 or 4 on motorways. I doubt I’ll ever find the city streets actually beneficial when it’s available here if it’s still level 2.

 

[AndyWarrington]

Almost daily, I find it great when in slow moving traffic more than bombing down the motorway - motorway I feel I have to be wary of it somewhat. Guess that get better over time

 

[Mullermn]

I use it all the time on motorways, frequently on ’boring’ dual carriageways (long stretches without complexities to deal with).

I also use it on cross country A roads, particularly if the conditions are demanding. In that situation I treat it as a ‘co-pilot’ rather than ‘autopilot’, but I have found that it is less draining overall to have the car drive and closely supervise it than to drive myself in (eg) dark and rain. In these circumstances the experience is hugely improved by having a lead vehicle in front as the car gains a lot of guidance about appropriate speeds for bends etc.

I don’t think I have ever experienced phantom braking in thousands of miles. I have had odd moments where the car lets off the pace or gently brakes for no obvious reason but we’re talking a couple of miles an hour type speed changes, certainly nothing safety impacting.

 

[Avalyn]

Never.

 

[MrBadger]

I had the reverse experience last week. I was coming north on the M6 and needed to turn onto the M62 towards Manchester. In case you don't know the junction, there are 4 lanes at that point. First there is a slip road to go towards Liverpool, and then the inside lane peels off to go towards Manchester. At the moment the whole thing is in a terrible state because of the never-ending work to turn it into a (not very) 'smart motorway'. Everything is a bit tight and there's a 50 limit which makes it difficult to pass anything.

The car, as usual, starts moving me leftwards across the lanes, but the inside lane is bumper to bumper trucks and it looks like there's no way in. I am just at the point of taking over when it brakes really hard and requests a lane change into a gap that it has seen opening up behind it! The braking was a bit scary but it knew what it was doing. And it showed chevrons a la FSDb 11.

Or an alternative explanation, it just simply implemented the long standing functionality that (often rapidly) slows the car to the speed of an adjacent slow moving lane to prevent speeding past a lane where someone may suddenly pull out from. It indicates this behaviour by showing chevrons and any alignment with a gap in traffic was purely coincidental.

That functionality has been around for over 3 years and nothing to do with FSD beta.

 

[xreyuk]

I’ve had my model 3 about 3 weeks and have been using it everywhere. Generally, I trust it, but I’ve learned a few situations where I’m not overly happy with its behaviour.

1. On the motorway if it detects a car on your left that you’re passing slightly drift towards you (but staying in its lane) it’s VERY quick to decide to slow itself down, and quite aggressively.

2. Not full autopilot but using the cruise control, in my previous car I’ve used it everywhere to prevent me speeding. However cause it’s traffic aware it has a tendency to identify ‘dangers’ and borderline slam on, on some roads. There are two roads I travel regularly, one where I have no idea why, but it limits itself to 30mph and slams on to slow down (it’s a 50 road). Another 50 road where at a specific section it deems cars parked at a funny angle, far back from the road, to be moving and tries to slam on. I always keep my foot near the fast pedal.

3. It’s very very cautious when cars cross in front, it usually brakes aggressively when a car passes in front, even when it wouldn’t have hit it without slowing down.

In general, on the motorway it’s 99% fine and relaxing to use. On fast dual carriageways and faster roads, I use it but I’m more cautious of it, and keep my foot near the fast pedal.

 

[Tony Hoyle]

Motorways and decently fast A roads.. I'd never use it outside that as I've seen how bad it is at coping with anything slightly unusual. Basically never used TACC... if I have to steer I might as well keep my foot on the accelerator.

 

[Sparkeur]

I don’t think I have ever experienced phantom braking in thousands of miles. I have had odd moments where the car lets off the pace or gently brakes for no obvious reason but we’re talking a couple of miles an hour type speed changes, certainly nothing safety impacting.

The experiences I've had of 'phantom braking' have all been on a motorway and the instances seem to be caused when approaching a bridge in bright sunlight with a strong, clearly defined shadow thrown on the road.
The 'slowing down and speeding up' is a new phenomenon for me - after three years of Tesla driving. It only happens when I am overtaking trucks (not cars or vans) and it's every truck, even those well inside their lane. It certainly causes a problem because it flashes the brake lights on the car to the irritation of those behind. I'd be interested if anyone else has started experiencing this issue since the last couple of updates because to my mind, it renders the product unusable.

 

[WannabeOwner]

Any decent conspiracy theory would claim that updates aren't all the same .. that Tesla scatter slight variations throughout to find which ones perform better

Ah A-B testing ... Mine says Beta so I guess you are on Alpha

To an extent people do not give enough time to get used to AP experience and quirks

For me, that doesn't account for frequent phantom braking for some people and not others.

Anything that requires me to be vigilant "just in case" is much less comfortable for me than driving a car

Understood. My wife doesn't use AP because she feels she "isn't in control".

If I took a 17 year old for their first drive I would be able to anticipate all the daft / unexpected things that they might do - and intervene almost before they happen.

With AI I have no idea what it might be thinking, and what might spook it. I suppose increased use means I am aware of likely things ... but the fact remains that on a stretch of road I'm not familiar with it may follow a worn road marking and into e.g. a concrete bollard. Complacency has been fatal in a number of well documented cases.

But, for me, AP is removing a big chunk of driver-workload - which is a bit of a surprise to me as I've done a lot more miles than average all my adult life, enjoyed driving and never thought of it as taxing. The change of role from steerer to observer is something I'm comfortable with and definitely means I arrive significantly more refreshed (than used to be the case with ICE). Some of that may be quieter cabin ... or just "smug" as proposed by one psychologist I read!

I've always felt that it may be something to do with the settings that we choose.

If there is some contributing factor I'm surprised that Tesla isn't telling people (either "book service" or "Change settings" - or by improving something via OTA). It seems to me that eliminating phantom braking would reduce likelihood of rear-shunt and more people would use AP more ... which in turn would also lead to fewer accidents. All that would look very good on Tesla Stats / be good for PR. Not sure Elon prioritises like that though!

find Autopilot annoying when having to chop and change lanes frequently, it disengages each time and has to be rengaged. Accompanied by the bong noises of course

Solve by paying an unreasonable amount of money for EAP and then getting bong-free lane changes ... with hesitancy uncertainty thrown in for good measure ...

 

[Wattsisname]

I would be very interested to read user experience feedback on Enhanced AP.
Thank you.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I have no idea why, but it limits itself to 30mph and slams on to slow down

Could be GPS Map error - if it does it in the same place every time and the speed limit symbol drops I reckon that would be the reason.

The experiences I've had of 'phantom braking' have all been on a motorway and the instances seem to be caused when approaching a bridge in bright sunlight with a strong, clearly defined shadow thrown on the road.

I've read of that from a number of people. In all the miles I drive that scenario must happen to me, but I can't remember an incident .. .(and that includes French motorways a couple of times a year )

I could understand that being an n issue - but not if it isn't universal. Why would software do something different. Perhaps we need a convoy of Teslae and mix of drivers who claim "always phantom brakes" and "Never does" and see if there is a real difference between cars and drivers. We could swap cars for a double blind trial ...

 

[WllXM]

I would be very interested to read user experience feedback on Enhanced AP.
Thank you.

I wouldn't say £3,5k was good value for simply getting rid of the bongs when changing lanes on the motorway.
And I've found that the suggestion of semi-automated lane changes was poorly timed. Too late for moving onto a faster lane, as the car had already started decelerating to adjust to the car in front, and then, bugging me to move back to the left lane while I still could see several lorries less than 400 yards in front that would have caused me to move again and overtake. Needs improvement. And of course you need constant pressure on the steering wheel to initiate each manoeuvre which greatly defeats the purpose. (I know it's not Tesla's fault for that one...)

Then of course autopark works 5% of the time; and Summon is crippled in Europe as you need to be within bluetooth range, practically standing on the car to be able to use it. Again, I know Tesla is not to blame for this last one, but sadly I don't see any regulation change coming soon to UN/ECE rules to be able to enjoy it like in the States where it can actually prove itself useful once in a while...

Maybe if Elon spent a few quids for lobbying in Brussels..

 

[WannabeOwner]

I would be very interested to read user experience feedback on Enhanced AP.

I had AP on MS when new and upgraded to FSD at some point, so have a before/after view on that. I also had M3 with AP replaced with MY with EAP.

The BONG on AP was annoying for passengers on long trips - e.g. when they were trying to sleep. Even with Joe Mode (reduced volume of BONG). EAP isn't cheap though ... maybe worth 50% on trade in? so like other options could consider just the financing of it during ownership, rather than sticker-price.

I don't have a problem with EAP changing lanes - I basically indicate when I want to change lanes, and I've already established that the lane is clear etc.

I rarely accept a lane change when EAP offers one. For example, having just passed the off-ramp at a junction (in middle lane) it wants to move to nearside lane ... just as we are coming up to the on-ramp where cars will be wanting to merge.

Don't think there is anything else with EAP which is worthwhile. AutoPark is poor, summon so slow to not be useable. If I came back to car and found it very tightly parked, or now sat in a puddle, I could use Summon to get it to pull out for me ... but I haven't had a need for that ... yet.

NoA taking a junction is definitely handy ... but only because I seem to be able to totally ignore all the SatNav instructions to "Take the next exit" and would otherwise sail past it on occasions ...

 

[MrBadger]

I would be very interested to read user experience feedback on Enhanced AP.
Thank you.

A good starting place

Poll - 14 day EAP trial!

Moderator comment - threads combined from "Summon appearing in the app despite no FSD or EAP" and "14 day EAP trial!" There are reports on Facebook that some people have just found summon appearing in their app despite not having FSD or EAP Anyone found this?

teslamotorsclub.com

tl;dr - if you are looking for an excuse to buy EAP, don't read it...

 

[Tony Hoyle]

I could understand that being an n issue - but not if it isn't universal. Why would software do something different. Perhaps we need a convoy of Teslae and mix of drivers who claim "always phantom brakes" and "Never does" and see if there is a real difference between cars and drivers. We could swap cars for a double blind trial ...

I've sometimes thought that might be a decent experiment at a meet, provided insurance is OK with it.

I think we often have different perceptions what phantom braking really means and it muddies things. There's a massive difference between 'slows down a bit' and 'slams on the brakes' and it's not *always* clear what's being described.

 

[HonchoNI]

I use it every time I drive, but always ready to quickly take over. Does not work on UK B roads as it can not turn sharp enough or see the side of poorly marked roads. I had a loaner model S with FSD and it is useless in UK.

 

[MrBadger]

So I am seeing lots of answers where it is being used where it is not intended to be used.

It use to be explicitly stated that it was for use only on divided limited access highways, ie Motorways and some dual carriage ways, but I guess the pedestrian and cyclist but pretty much excludes other places here in UK.

Also worth stating that 'City Streets' is a North American FSD beta feature function and even with UK FSD vehicles, it is not a supported driving domain, even for FSD owners, and even less so for standard Autopilot or EAP owners.

 

[Billbrown1982]

Was your incident with the route set in the sat nav? I had no route set, so don’t know why the car decided to try and take the slip road.

Yep on that occasion it totally was and like I said, in your case I don't really know what happened. Its more that it just reminded me of something that happened to me and I could have easily started a thread about how autopilot tried to kill me and veer off the motorway at the last minute.

Which I do think accounts for at least "some" of the negativity towards it.

Only thing I can think of in your case was it thought the main road was closed ahead. So route or no, it expected that you had to come off? Just guessing though.

 

[Mullermn]

I would be very interested to read user experience feedback on Enhanced AP.
Thank you.

Does your car have USS? I wouldn't bother with EAP if you haven't got them, because basically none of the features are present. You do get Navigate on Autopilot, and while I would say I'm happy with it as a feature and it works quite well it's not good enough to be a massive step up from plain TACC/lane following and isn't worth the money on its own.

It makes dumb lane change recommendations sometimes so you have to closely peer review its choices, and the acceleration profiles are overly cautious such that you end up having to override the acceleration if you're in traffic so you don't hold people up.

If the single stack highway logic that we're seeing in Youtube videos replaces NoA in due course then I think this will change and it will be more 'keep an eye on it, but it basically does the right thing' and be much more useful.

 

[Fat Wolfie]

Our other vehicle is a VW Transporter campervan. It has VW’s version of TACC and in my experience it works better than the Tesla implementation. Speeds up when indicating to overtake, very smooth and no phantom braking. All round a more relaxing drive, I don’t have to keep my foot hovering over the accelerator and it just seems a more grown up implementation.

My other car is a Skoda Octavia VRS which has the VW TACC, and have to agree it is more user friendly than the Tesla application.

To be clear, I have never had any issues with the Tesla version, but it is usable under fewer conditions than VWs version.

for example, in 30 mph limits with parked cars and lots of side roads you can set the VW version to 30 and it works fine, keeping you under the limit and not having to concentrate more on the speedo than the road just to avoid potential speed camera fines.

the same road in the Tesla - well, the car basically cr@ps itself thinking your heading to a parked car, going to hit a car turning off and so on. BUT the Tesla version is not designed to be used on such roads, so I have no complaints about its performance, just that I wish it was usable on such roads like the VW version is.

As regards phantom braking etc, I’ve not had this on the Y or previous M3. Both cars were calibrated on motorways from new (Leeds pick up on the M3 straight to motorway to calibrate, and Y from Trafford straight to motorway to calibrate) and I wonder whether if you get frequent phantom braking issues it is worth doing a recalibrate on a motorway?