The stupidest statement since I bought my Model S

silverp85+ said:

The price is high on that car is because you paid for the electricity in advance.:scared:

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the price of the car is high and you do pay for electricity via superchargers in advance J/S

Well, that statement is not *that* far off the mark. First, part of the car's price goes to pay for Supercharging, which agrees with that statement. But also:

Part of the reason the price of the car is high is because you're paying for a lot of the "fuel" when you buy the car. By that I mean that the pack itself is what enables the drastically cheaper-per-mile fuel source (electricity), so if you consider that you're paying in advance for the right to have a low fuel cost per mile over the life of the car, it makes sense.

silverp85+ said:

$2500 supercharger fee does not bring the price up that high. that's a fee needed to continue building the network. it's like saying the a7 is high in price because it comes with free gas... makes no sense.

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1) Supercharging is now standard so there is no additional fee
2) Nobody's saying it's the sole reason the price is high, but the battery pack is by far the primary cost contributor for the Model S, and you can think of a battery pack as paying for a chunk of your fuel costs up front.

By the way, which A7 comes with free gas? Sounds like a sweet deal.

silverp85+ said:

$2500 supercharger fee does not bring the price up that high. that's a fee needed to continue building the network. it's like saying the a7 is high in price because it comes with free gas... makes no sense.

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You're right of course. It's a silly thing to say particular if it's comprehended as it's intended to be. The car is not high priced because you pay for the electricity in advance. The car is high priced because it's a premium sedan.

silverp85+ said:

$2500 supercharger fee does not bring the price up that high. that's a fee needed to continue building the network. it's like saying the a7 is high in price because it comes with free gas... makes no sense.

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Supercharger fee ($2500)/ $85,000 = Tank of gas / $68,300

So a tank of gas is $2,008? Damn that is high.

silverp85+ said:

actually the battery pack has dropped drastically since release of model s. The average cost is now $145 per kwh on battery packs as per chevy stating that price is inline with what elon musk had stated in the past.

it may be a big cost but not the $35-$50k it used to be

Chevy Bolt Battery Cells = $145/kWh, New Chevy Volt With Autonomous Driving | CleanTechnica

.

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I'm not sure what this has to do with what I said.

Todd Burch said:

1) Supercharging is now standard so there is no additional fee

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The last thing I remember reading about it was that Tesla was internally allocating around $500 per vehicle for supercharger electricity costs. That comes out of their margin on the vehicle.

silverp85+ said:

you said this

"2) Nobody's saying it's the sole reason the price is high, but the battery pack is by far the primary cost contributor for the Model S"

it's not "by far" any longer because the battery pack has dropped in price by 50% or more.
it's the most expensive but not "by far" any longer

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No, it still is by far. The cost of a Model S battery pack has not dropped 50%--not a chance. But even if it had, it would still be, by far, the largest cost contributor to the Model S. Suppose the pack were only $10,000. (It's actually still far more than this). Can you name another component of the car that costs even remotely this much?

And be careful not to mix the cell cost per kWh with the pack cost per kWh.

I have heard that before, too. But I rationalized it thinking about the whole Supercharger Network that Tesla has had to build on its own. That gave me the "peace of mind" to buy the car.

We all know the additional $2500 supercharger fee that was available for S60 is built in the price of the other models! But I agree, this is not the main reason of the high price.

silverp85+ said:

the aluminum body?

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Calling the entire aluminum body a component is a bit of a stretch, but aluminum is fairly cheap at $0.69 a pound. If the body were 1000 pounds of aluminum, that's $690 of aluminum material. Cutting/machining/stamping rolls of aluminum is pretty cheap, as is welding. I bet the actual cost of the aluminum body is well south of $5,000.

And yet it costs $12,000 to have the rear quarter repaired.

Yes - as quoted by Avio Coachworks in early 2015. Fortunately, not for mine, but it was one of two pieces of advice given - e.g., to not do that. The other piece of advice was to not encounter any high curbs forward as the horizontal support that runs the width of the car, when damaged, results in a $7,000 repair bill.

That's somewhat daunting for an aluminum body that costs less than $5,000, eh? Except it's not close to $5,000 given that to be fair, at some point you've got to amortize R&D, plant and equipment costs into that - not just labor. I can't go out, buy a billet of aluminum, estimate 100 hours, and say the cost of my spiffy new resulting widget is the sum of those costs, right?

Anyway, the takeaway is well-taken, which is that we as owners are going to take it the shorts to have these cars repaired unless and until there are a whole lot more aluminum-certified body shops. Ford F-150 owners are finding this out as well. Seems when you take the best-selling truck ever made and re-skin it, costs quintuple. Go figure. I was disappointed that they didn't make the new ones out of magnesium and make the, what are those things called... oh yes, the "gas tanks" much thinner, so that upon impact at least passers-by would be treated to a very bright Roman Candle display.

Might want to keep an eye upon yer comprehensive and collision deductibles, folks.

So I bought a 120K vehicle that, for me, competes quite well with others. I'm not into the plush luxury and like the austere environment. So for me, this car is equivalent to an S class 550, A-8, 750i. And for the haters, yes, I know they are "nicer". Just not for me. It's paid for and now I only pay 4.50USD for 250mi, rather than something between 40 and 60USD for the same range, depending upon gas prices. If I used superchargers a lot, which I don't, the cost would be even less, averaged out. AND!!! I get to fill up in my garage!

20MPG x 18 gal x either 4.75 or 3.20 per gal (hi-lo in NoCA last two years) x 350 range x 71% to get to 250 range. Roughly.

For me... such a deal! And I think the MS handles much, much better than those competitors. Which meets my needs.

I think I got a bargain in the long run.

CHG-ON said:

So I bought a 120K vehicle that, for me, competes quite well with others. I'm not into the plush luxury and like the austere environment. So for me, this car is equivalent to an S class 550, A-8, 750i. And for the haters, yes, I know they are "nicer". Just not for me. It's paid for and now I only pay 4.50USD for 250mi, rather than something between 40 and 60USD for the same range, depending upon gas prices. If I used superchargers a lot, which I don't, the cost would be even less, averaged out. AND!!! I get to fill up in my garage!

20MPG x 18 gal x either 4.75 or 3.20 per gal (hi-lo in NoCA last two years) x 350 range x 71% to get to 250 range. Roughly.

For me... such a deal! And I think the MS handles much, much better than those competitors. Which meets my needs.

I think I got a bargain in the long run.

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Indeed!