Do I have the record for range loss?

Have you filled out the plug in america survey ?

Tesla Model S Survey by Plug In America

You could compare your numbers to the other 60s in the survey.

Well, our CPO S85 with 70000 km on it charges to 97%+ compared to new, so no, not seeing the degradation you are.

But, we can only get 250 km of highway driving out of it (at left lane, no one passes me speed) in the winter compared to 350 km in the summer, so if that is what you would also call range reduction, we've got you beat up here in Canada in terms of range loss. Not a complaint, love the car, it's an amazing winter car, and we never compromise on heating it or lowering our speed on the highway, so the range I quoted is for a "left lane driver".

We deliberately bought the 85 kWh battery as I have driven another electric car for 2.5 years prior to our Tesla purchase, and so was very aware of the effect of cold weather on range.

So, as you can see, things aren't as bad as they seem. :wink:

Im not far behind you with my 2014 S60. I am at 167 at 90%. My wife's 2013 S60 is holding strong at 183. Definitely a little concerned about my pack.

Have you tried doing a couple of range charges to see if it helps? I've noticed that when my 90% range starts dropping and then I do a road trip that requires a range charge, after the road trip I will get back a few miles.

Do you realize that your display range is not a measure of your battery capacity? It's calculated on a somewhat flawed algorithm that varies based on many factors including driving habits, and in no way can you use it to determine battery degradation. So turn it off range and onto battery percentage and drive the car and don't worry about it.

eye.surgeon said:

Do you realize that your display range is not a measure of your battery capacity? It's calculated on a somewhat flawed algorithm that varies based on many factors including driving habits, and in no way can you use it to determine battery degradation. So turn it off range and onto battery percentage and drive the car and don't worry about it.

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If it's displaying rated range, then shouldn't the number be based on a fixed Wh/mile assumption and not driving habits/weather/whatever? The only real software magic that should be happening is in the actual calculation of pack capacity and state of charge... which is where things get all wonky because SoC and pack capacity are basically an educated guess/very complex averaging game.

Edit: To be clear, I'm not suggesting that Tesla has provided owners with any accurate means of measuring pack degradation.

pgiralt said:

Have you tried doing a couple of range charges to see if it helps? I've noticed that when my 90% range starts dropping and then I do a road trip that requires a range charge, after the road trip I will get back a few miles.

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I've found that driving it down to 10-20% SoC then doing a 100% charge can sometimes help. Just don't leave the car at 100% for long; plan to drive at least 5-10% off within a few hours of hitting the 100%. The 100% can take over an hour extra at the end. Even after the 100%, it can take up to a few days for all the internal balancing to finish with the small internal bleed resistors.

Good Luck!

eye.surgeon said:

Do you realize that your display range is not a measure of your battery capacity? It's calculated on a somewhat flawed algorithm that varies based on many factors including driving habits, and in no way can you use it to determine battery degradation. So turn it off range and onto battery percentage and drive the car and don't worry about it.

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Estimated range is based on driving habits, average power consumption, etc. Rated range is not.

Cottonwood said:

I've found that driving it down to 10-20% SoC then doing a 100% charge can sometimes help. Just don't leave the car at 100% for long; plan to drive at least 5-10% off within a few hours of hitting the 100%. The 100% can take over an hour extra at the end. Even after the 100%, it can take up to a few days for all the internal balancing to finish with the small internal bleed resistors.

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Yes, sometimes. But after seeing range loss of ~7 miles after last summer, and having done several road trips over winter where I have done precisely this, I have yet to regain any of those miles. Usually charge to 80%. Never leave the car at 100% for more than 1 hour.

Don't take no for an answer. You've lost 10% range in a year and that seems steep. I would ask them to see if you have a failed module. Apparently, based on anecdotal evidence, the car cannot self diagnose or report in the logs whether it has a failed module. If I remember correctly, diagnosing an issue like that may require an escalation to engineering.

A failed module would show up on the diag screens. Ask @lola if you can borrow a CAN logger.

You are close to wear mine is at 163. Carlos stated to charge it only to 50 percent. Since doing that it jumped back up to 169. I have 35k miles on it and have used Supercharger more than any owner I know. Last year I hit a supercharge 70 times.

Model S packs only top balance and the estimator is only accurate if you drive the pack down below 20 miles of range and then range charge, and giving it time to top balance. You might have to repeat several times to get the algorithm to recalculate properly. However, note that this does not actually change the amount of degradation, it just helps the computer figure out the right state of charge which is a difficult thing to do. Arguably, this procedure incurs a slightly higher degradation and so if you aren't bothered by your cars current calculations, you probably don't want to do this.

You're not necessarily seeing actual degredation, so don't jump to that conclusion. But if it bothers you:

Suggestion: Charge your car to 100%. Plan it so that it reaches 100% a few hours prior to your departure and has a little bit of time to sit there at 100%.

When I did this, I gained back 2 miles. That was a few weeks ago, and those 2 miles have stayed on.

Ideally, do this when it's cold (which is a relative term for Houston) to minimize wear on the pack.

After you try this experiment, come back and tell us how it went. If you don't see an increase the first day, try it one more day.

I bet you will see an increase.

Footnote: Personally I have not found that running the car to a lower state of charge (~7% in my case) helped things. In fact, it lowered my estimate by a few miles.

I drove my P85 down to 4 miles yesterday and charged back up to 90%. I gained 2 miles, went from 225 to 227.

my wife drivers our first MS 60. she drives 90 miles each day. The car has 66k miles we got it May 2013. the 90% charges to 173 but it dropped down by 4 miles between 59k and thr 66k currently. Once a month I full charge the car and do try to time it to within 1 hour of when she leaves for work. I believe we have an A pack as we were a very early 60 vin 9031. My P85 has 44k miles and 90% is 233 and 100% 255. Bought that one used but it is the same vintage as the 60 delivered May 2013 vin 9696. all that said I think the OP has reason to be concerned

Notacarguy said:

Ok, update. I told Tesla that if they say my battery loss is normal then I wanted to know what was abnormal so that once I hit that number we would both know something was wrong. A day after I sent the email they informed that they detected a problem with my battery remotely. Shortly after I got a replacement battery and now it charges to 183 at 90%. which gives me almost another day of commuting when you think about it.

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That's good to know and I'm glad it worked out for you. As you mention that this gives you "another day of commuting", I guess that means you don't charge daily. What are your charging habits?