Replacement key for "unregistered" Tesla

Tesla can probably do it based on the Car's VIN. Obviously they'd need you to prove ownership to be able to help you out.

Hmm. I bet there is an interesting history with this car. For example, why was there only one key? And why would Tesla not help? They are clearly the only viable option.

And how would a key break just from hitting the ground

nishy1 said:

And how would a key break just from hitting the ground

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It wouldn't have broken from hitting the ground, it would have broken from being run over by another car as it lay in the street after having fallen off the Tesla's roof.

Either way, it really doesn't matter; the OP has a situation where the MyTesla account information is unknown and the only key they had is now destroyed. No need to question how the OP got to this point or assume anything untoward.

If ownership can be proven, then Tesla can order and reprogram keys for the vehicle. However, as I understand it, Tesla will require a proper printed title in the dealership's name (at least they require this in the US); they will not provide a MyTesla transfer until this happens (a bill of sale and title transfer form does not work) - I was told this directly from someone who purchased the car from a non-Tesla dealer. A possible alternative is for the dealer to contact the former owner (if possible) and ask them to provide Tesla with some proof of ownership on their behalf.

(My wife lost our second key for the Model S when it fell into an upside-down umbrella in the corner of our coatroom, we didn't find it back for 2 months. No need to assume having only one key means something bad.)

FlasherZ said:

Either way, it really doesn't matter; the OP has a situation where the MyTesla account information is unknown and the only key they had is now destroyed. No need to question how the OP got to this point or assume anything untoward.

If ownership can be proven, then Tesla can order and reprogram keys for the vehicle. However, as I understand it, Tesla will require a proper printed title in the dealership's name (at least they require this in the US); they will not provide a MyTesla transfer until this happens (a bill of sale and title transfer form does not work) - I was told this directly from someone who purchased the car from a non-Tesla dealer. A possible alternative is for the dealer to contact the former owner (if possible) and ask them to provide Tesla with some proof of ownership on their behalf.

(My wife lost our second key for the Model S when it fell into an upside-down umbrella in the corner of our coatroom, we didn't find it back for 2 months. No need to assume having only one key means something bad.)

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You're right. I agree. Just sensitive to risk of fraud.

Xauxatz said:

The local Tesla dealer in our country has offered no help.

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Tesla do not have dealers - they sell directly to customers. Hence, when you contact a Tesla store it's both a sales centre and a service centre.

I would be surprised if their answer really was "to offer no help". They must have had some other answer than this? Are they not asking for evidence as to who is the legal owner of the car? This is not the first time a Tesla has been sold or traded outside of the Tesla CPO program so it can't be a first instance for them either.

AnOutsider said:

do you have the title? I cant see why tesla wouldnt help if you could prove ownersnip

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Neither can I, but then again there are quite a bit of other things Tesla is refusing to sell to not-original-owners. Given that this is a dealer and we know Tesla has played dirty before trying to avoid cars getting into the dealer circuit (mainly getting second hand brokers to retract standing buy offers during the big resale frenzy leading up to the D), I would not be completely surprised if Tesla played hardball here.

I can attest to how robust the key is. The guy at my car washed put the key on top of the rear tire, instead of putting it on the dash like usual. When I left, as the car rolled forward, the key fell on the ground, and I rolled over it. I didn't realize it until I got away from the car wash, and I got the "key not in vehicle" alert. Once I return, they found my key, and it had, in fact, been run over. It was in the leather case, the leather had a little scuff, and you can see the plastic is slightly distressed. It still works fine to my amazement!

schonelucht said:

Neither can I, but then again there are quite a bit of other things Tesla is refusing to sell to not-original-owners. Given that this is a dealer and we know Tesla has played dirty before trying to avoid cars getting into the dealer circuit (mainly getting second hand brokers to retract standing buy offers during the big resale frenzy leading up to the D), I would not be completely surprised if Tesla played hardball here.

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From what I've seen, once a car is properly transferred and titled to a second buyer, Tesla has not withheld anything. One of our enthusiast group organizers purchased an early Model S from another dealer and has had the same experience as any other buyer. The issue here seems to stem from the dealer being in the middle of a sale. If the dealer were to title the car in its name, I'm sure Tesla would help - just like any other owner.

Just for my curiosity, what have you seen that Tesla has refused to do for second-hand owners? Any links to posts here?

FlasherZ said:

From what I've seen, once a car is properly transferred and titled to a second buyer, Tesla has not withheld anything. One of our enthusiast group organizers purchased an early Model S from another dealer and has had the same experience as any other buyer. The issue here seems to stem from the dealer being in the middle of a sale. If the dealer were to title the car in its name, I'm sure Tesla would help - just like any other owner.

Just for my curiosity, what have you seen that Tesla has refused to do for second-hand owners? Any links to posts here?

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I completely agree with FlasherZ. In all likelihood, the dealer doesn't want to get the car titled in their name or are waiting for the paperwork to finish, while they now have a car with no key. Likely Tesla is willing to help with proof of paperwork, but it will take time. Meanwhile, the car has to be towed everywhere on the dealer's lot since they don't have a key.

As for FlasherZ's question, the Ludicrous upgrade for P85Ds can only (currently) be ordered by the original owner of a P85D.

FlasherZ said:

From what I've seen, once a car is properly transferred and titled to a second buyer, Tesla has not withheld anything. One of our enthusiast group organizers purchased an early Model S from another dealer and has had the same experience as any other buyer. The issue here seems to stem from the dealer being in the middle of a sale. If the dealer were to title the car in its name, I'm sure Tesla would help - just like any other owner.

Just for my curiosity, what have you seen that Tesla has refused to do for second-hand owners? Any links to posts here?

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Tesla has refused to sell parts to owners of cars with salvage titles. Also, the member in Newfoundland could not get a small body part, only sold to Tesla authorized body shops.

I hope they will change this policy to allow part sales to anyone, owner or not.

GSP

FlasherZ said:

From what I've seen, once a car is properly transferred and titled to a second buyer, Tesla has not withheld anything.

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I believe some of the extended warranty options are only available to the first owner.

Xauxatz said:

The key was forgotten on the roof after starting the car. The mechanic drove off and the key was lost. It was later recovered - but broken...
What can we do?

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Given the answers, it seems that it might be worth a shot to try to have the broken key repaired. Maybe a shop that fixes electronic items, like cell phones, can help?

GSP said:

Tesla has refused to sell parts to owners of cars with salvage titles. Also, the member in Newfoundland could not get a small body part, only sold to Tesla authorized body shops.

I hope they will change this policy to allow part sales to anyone, owner or not.

GSP

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Sorry, I was referring to a car that hadn't been declared a total loss. Once re-certified by Tesla, aside from warranty, the car gets the same attention as any other car.

The question still stands: for a car in the same condition, what parts will Tesla sell to a first owner that it won't sell to a second owner who purchased via private party sale? The Ludicrous upgrade above is a good example, although that's time bound as well.

Iirc, I overheard a conversation in service center where customer had lost a fob. With the remaining fob, he could purchase a new one and have it reprogrammed. But if he lost the sole remaining fob, he would have to get 2 new fobs and a security module which would be a lot more expensive, because there is no way to know what the fob's signal/handshake was. Can anybody verify this?

CatB said:

Iirc, I overheard a conversation in service center where customer had lost a fob. With the remaining fob, he could purchase a new one and have it reprogrammed. But if he lost the sole remaining fob, he would have to get 2 new fobs and a security module which would be a lot more expensive, because there is no way to know what the fob's signal/handshake was. Can anybody verify this?

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I cannot verify, but I have a hard time believing that Tesla cannot reprogram the security module if they had physical access to it. I could understand that maybe (and I don't even know if this is how they do it) they could clone one key to a second without the car, but absent a source to clone from, they would have to reprogram the car. That said, Tesla likely would reprogram both anyways to guarantee against some nefarious person fixing a "lost" key and leaving with the car. Either way, I still doubt that a replacement security module is needed, but wouldn't be surprised if Tesla needs physical access to change its programming.

Cyclone said:

I cannot verify, but I have a hard time believing that Tesla cannot reprogram the security module if they had physical access to it. I could understand that maybe (and I don't even know if this is how they do it) they could clone one key to a second without the car, but absent a source to clone from, they would have to reprogram the car. That said, Tesla likely would reprogram both anyways to guarantee against some nefarious person fixing a "lost" key and leaving with the car. Either way, I still doubt that a replacement security module is needed, but wouldn't be surprised if Tesla needs physical access to change its programming.

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Such a setup is actually pretty common in the industry and is for the protection of the owner. The idea is that the module has a private key randomly-generated at device creation that is stored in a secure PROM (one write permitted, then is read only) and not recorded. The module is paired with keys at creation, and access to the vehicle + 1 key allows you to pair more keys. The loss of both keys is a severe event, as the module will not allow a new key to be programmed without at least one key present. This essentially forces you into proving ownership of the vehicle with the manufacturer to receive the new security module/keys.

This helps eliminate the "inside job" case, where a nefarious employee is able to create a key for any vehicle using only the VIN and physical access to the vehicle (home address often on file with the manufacturer/dealer).

I have no idea if Tesla operates as above, but it certainly wouldn't be unheard of. Either way, I highly doubt they've implemented a system that allows them to create keys for a vehicle they don't even have physical access to, so OP doesn't have much choice other than going through Tesla.