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Natural gas vehicles (NGVs, CNG)

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vfx

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2006
14,790
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CA CA
Honda pulls out of CNG

The Auto Channel
Amidst charges that embattled American Honda is systematically suppressing its compressed natural gas (CNG) vehicle program, the company has suddenly fueled that impression by throwing into bankruptcy its wholly-owned CNG refueling company, Fuelmaker....

And it's not pretty...
 
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For four hours... which makes it 3.2 kWh, or 64 Wh/mile. That's about 20% of an EV right there.

Well that huge news to me. 2nd only to range anxiety is charge time on people's list of why not to get an EV. So a NG car has little philling infrastructure and a long "charge" time? Nice to have this bit of info when someone says, "Why an EV? Why not a NG car?"
 
Well that huge news to me. 2nd only to range anxiety is charge time on people's list of why not to get an EV. So a NG car has little philling infrastructure and a long "charge" time? Nice to have this bit of info when someone says, "Why an EV? Why not a NG car?"

Of course I could point out that this is just garage fueling. Presumably an industrial-sized compressor at a proper filling station could do the job a lot faster.
 
Of course I could point out that this is just garage fueling. Presumably an industrial-sized compressor at a proper filling station could do the job a lot faster.
Yes, you could fill CNG as fast has HFCV advocates claim you could fill with compressed H2 (but with a fuel that is much more energy dense by volume). So it's possible to fill in a few minutes.
HyFLEET:CUTE :: Technology :: Hydrogen Refuelling
refuel5.gif


Since the only "efficient" way to make hydrogen is from natural gas, I've often argued why bother. CNG ICE vehicles seem to have all the benefits of HFCVs at a much lower cost and can leverage an existing infrastructure.

map_us_ng_pipelines.gif
 
infrastructure

If you could put a CNG compressor into your home and everybody does then CNG would need near as many filling stations as we need level 3 charging stations for EVs.
Which is less than gas stations, because you could always leave home full.
( Maybe about the ratio of CNG fillup time ( ~5 mins ) to level 3 charge time ( 20 - 40 min )
However, if only a fraction of people chose to put in a home CNG compressor we would still need a great many more CNG filling stations than level 3 charging stations.

I for one, am totally comfortable with a 240 volt outlet in my garage for my EV. I am not as comfortable with a CNG compressor.

If you drive your EV somewhere that only has a 110 volt plug, it is slow but you can still charge and use the car.
If you go somwhere without a CNG filling station you are screwed - thus the bootstrapping problem of putting in CNG infrastructure is huge.
 
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VIDEO: T. Boone Pickens on the New Natural Gas Vehicle Act: Cleantech News and Analysis

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The whole idea behind the NAT GAS Act is to move big rigs and fleet vehicles onto natural gas. Pickens thinks the bill could enable the production of 8 million 18-wheelers powered by natural gas, over several years, which he says could cut out half of the oil imported from OPEC to the U.S. These natural gas vehicles would largely be made by auto-makers — compared to vehicles that are retrofitted to run on natural gas — and if signed into law, the Act could essentially spur an entire new industry around natural gas vehicle manufacturing.
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Official: CNG Powered Civic To Be Rolled-Out Nationwide | The Truth About Cars

GM, Chrysler and Honda to Offer Natural Gas Cars - Business News - Energy Digital

natural gas cars are far cheaper to produce than lithium-ion powered electric vehicles. For example, the Honda Civic GX CNG will run on compressed natural gas and cost just $25,490 compared to the all-electric Chevy Volt, which will cost $41,000, or the $32,000 Nissan Leaf (both considered the most affordable of commercial electric cars). The Civic GX CNG is due for release next year in all 50 U.S. states.

lease-a-honda-civic-cng-car_0.jpeg
 
In California, with hybrid Prius & Civic soon to be disallowed from the carpool lanes, it has caused interest to increase in pure EVs, but also I gather the NGVs since they too get the white stickers which aren't expiring anytime soon. To some it is just a minor perk, but to others who cherish lone carpool access, their new car shopping list will be limited to cars that qualify for the EV/NGV stickers.
On the other hand, when Plug-in Prius gets carpool access next year I imagine it will take some sales away from Civic NGV. They have about a 6 month window of opportunity in California right now.