Lost Range/Charging issue

Pete90D · Sep 7, 2015

I am aware of some range loss and about balancing batteries, but this seems to be a separate issue.

I have about 1700 miles on my P90D and it is about 3 weeks old. When I first got it, a balanced charge was 273mi and a 90% charge was 246mi.

In the last week I've tried to charge to 100% a couple times and it will never go to 100%. It stops at 99% even if I change the setting in the car, in the app, or in Remote S where I can actually see the number it sets. It stops at 268mi, which is 5 miles less than I was getting. So I can't try to balance to see if that is causing it.

Now, when I charge to 90% I have a similar issue. I am getting 241mi, which is 5mi less than I was getting. It does say 90% when it finishes.

Does anyone have an idea what might be going on here or what I might be able to do to reset something? I'd like to avoid having to go to a service center, but I may have to. I worry more that this is an issue because it is a new battery capacity and something might be off.

Max* · Sep 8, 2015

I know that the 70D 100% charge was supposed to be 240 miles. When my car was new, I was getting 242-243 miles, IIRC. Now after almost 8k miles I get 239. So I really lost 1 mile (my 90% dropped by a mile too, though originally I got as high as 218 miles, and now only 213 miles at 90%) from the EPA rating, but I felt like I lost 4 miles from my peak charging.

I feel like there's something going on in the first 1k miles where the car settles closer to the EPA numbers, though I'm no battery expert, so someone else can chime in.

tomas · Sep 8, 2015

Pete90D said:
I am aware of some range loss and about balancing batteries, but this seems to be a separate issue.

I have about 1700 miles on my P90D and it is about 3 weeks old. When I first got it, a balanced charge was 273mi and a 90% charge was 246mi.

In the last week I've tried to charge to 100% a couple times and it will never go to 100%. It stops at 99% even if I change the setting in the car, in the app, or in Remote S where I can actually see the number it sets. It stops at 268mi, which is 5 miles less than I was getting. So I can't try to balance to see if that is causing it.

Now, when I charge to 90% I have a similar issue. I am getting 241mi, which is 5mi less than I was getting. It does say 90% when it finishes.

Does anyone have an idea what might be going on here or what I might be able to do to reset something? I'd like to avoid having to go to a service center, but I may have to. I worry more that this is an issue because it is a new battery capacity and something might be off.

The 99% for a long long time is normal. I've had many range charges where it took 2 hours to get to 99% and another 2 hours to get to 100%. Most people don't have the patience. It has been conjectured that this is balancing, which is very slow.

Regarding your range "loss", keep in mind that rated range is an ESTIMATE generated by an algorithm. Nobody outside Tesla knows the detail of the algorithm, but it has certainly been tweaked in various firmware updates. It also sometimes "resets" upon firmware update. It is definitely affected by whether you have climate control set in range mode or not. If you had range mode on when you were getting 273 and it is now off, you would lose several miles on an 85, so 4-5 on a 90 sounds plausible. If you have not flipped range mode, I'd still say that a 5 mile loss in the estimate is not something to lose sleep over. It is probably not significant loss of battery capability, but more the algorithm "settling in" to your actual battery readings vs. the factory values it started with. If drops continue, your next step is to calibrate, which means running down to a low number (say, <20%) and range charging several times, which helps the algorithm understand the ends of the spectrum. Remember though, do not range charge unless you are going to drive within a few hours... it is bad for long-term battery health to sit at 100%.

taurusking · Sep 8, 2015

tomas said:
The 99% for a long long time is normal. I've had many range charges where it took 2 hours to get to 99% and another 2 hours to get to 100%. Most people don't have the patience. It has been conjectured that this is balancing, which is very slow.

Regarding your range "loss", keep in mind that rated range is an ESTIMATE generated by an algorithm. Nobody outside Tesla knows the detail of the algorithm, but it has certainly been tweaked in various firmware updates. It also sometimes "resets" upon firmware update. It is definitely affected by whether you have climate control set in range mode or not. If you had range mode on when you were getting 273 and it is now off, you would lose several miles on an 85, so 4-5 on a 90 sounds plausible. If you have not flipped range mode, I'd still say that a 5 mile loss in the estimate is not something to lose sleep over. It is probably not significant loss of battery capability, but more the algorithm "settling in" to your actual battery readings vs. the factory values it started with. If drops continue, your next step is to calibrate, which means running down to a low number (say, <20%) and range charging several times, which helps the algorithm understand the ends of the spectrum. Remember though, do not range charge unless you are going to drive within a few hours... it is bad for long-term battery health to sit at 100%.

+1 on what tomas said....My car does the same thing...takes a long time when it reaches 99% ...Enjoy your car...your car's battery is not going to degrade so fast...

benjiejr · Sep 8, 2015

@Pete90D, I agree with everyone above that this is "normal". It's happened to me too. I've also ready somewhere that part of the rated range calculation involves your driving style so that it is more accurate. This would probably explain why mine is less than others because my style is "fun". lol

hiroshiy · Sep 8, 2015

@Pete90D: how long did you wait at 99%? Do you remember how much current Tesla is sucking while charging at 99%? The latter should be less than 5 amps.

mknox · Sep 8, 2015

tomas said:
The 99% for a long long time is normal. I've had many range charges where it took 2 hours to get to 99% and another 2 hours to get to 100%. Most people don't have the patience. It has been conjectured that this is balancing, which is very slow.

Yep. That freaked me out too. Mine would sit at 99% for literally hours and I'd get concerned and unplug. Members here convinced me to just let it go, and it eventually did complete and stop. Subsequent charges to 100% (not that I do a lot) have finished faster, but there is a big delay at the end.

Rocky_H · Sep 8, 2015

Every new owner it seems freaks out about this, but trust me, you are not the first. It seems all of the cars "lose" something like 3 to 5 miles range in the first several thousand miles driven, and then it levels off. It's very normal. It could be slightly real or maybe algorithm, or who knows, but everybody sees it, and don't worry.

Pete90D · Sep 8, 2015

I realize that a lot of new owners freak out about loss of range, but as I mentioned this is a bit different. I've balanced batteries on several Teslas so I'm aware of the wait and not letting it sit fully charged.

It STOPS at 99%, like shuts off, unlocks the charge cable, no voltage, no amps, it flat out won't charge at all above 99% for the last week.

When it has stopped I have unplugged, plugged back in, dropped the limit to as low as it will go and then set it back to max. I've used Remote S and the API to verify it is set at 100%, unplugged and plugged back in. Nothing... it flat out turns off at 99%. I've also rebooted the display thinking it might just be the display not updating.

So I'm not worried about losing a few miles, I'm worried that the loss of the 5 miles is actually because there is a bug. Since it won't charge to 100% I can't balance the batteries to see if that is why the 90% dropped. So this isn't me freaking out about a few miles, it's a concern about a new battery type having an actual flaw.

P.S. I'm not trying to charge to 100% daily either. This was for another data dump like the range data I shared when I first got it. I'm trying to charge to 100% so I can do another long drive with range mode on and see what I will get at a full charge.

dsm363 · Sep 8, 2015

Ask the service center to dial into your car and see if there is an issue. Likely nothing to worry about and could wait until the next time you bring the car in.

mknox · Sep 8, 2015

Pete90D said:
It STOPS at 99%, like shuts off, unlocks the charge cable, no voltage, no amps, it flat out won't charge at all above 99% for the last week.

Okay, that's different. I'd be asking Service about that one.

hiroshiy · Sep 8, 2015

That seems like a bug to me. Wild guess, but could be related to 90D battery.

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Lost Range/Charging issue

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