Question about cQuartz Finest and swirls on my model S

The car shouldn't need to be waxed if cQuartz was applied. The whole point of cQuartz is water repellant and paint protection. Both of which wax does.

The new coatings (CQF, 22ple, Opti-Coat, etc) are all amazingly good in the amount of gloss and durability compared to traditional sealants and carnauba waxes. However, they are only a couple of microns in thickness at most and will not completely prevent swirls. And, they won't hide swirls left in the paint prior to application if the paint correction isn't perfect. I have CQF on my R8.

Were those swirls there after paint correction? If not, the swirls are from washing and or the "waxing" process post-CQF. I've found that swirls are most commonly introduced, particularly in black cars, during the drying stage (with a less than clean towel). I'm completely anal with my R8, and therefore use a blower to dry the car post-wash and try to avoid any drying with a towel. If you need to dry with a towel, I'd recommend blotting the car with a large waffle weave microfiber towel rather than rubbing the towel against the paint.

As stated above, why are you having your detailer wax over a coating? Your finish now takes on the characteristics of a wax when it comes to shedding water and dirt sticking to the surface vs a coating which has much better performance. While coatings have scratch resistance, they are not scratch proof. IMO the issues w swirls is due to your wash guy not using proper techniques.

Did you see any of these marks when the car came back from the detailer? Normally when you have the car coated, waxing it should no longer be necessary. I have 2 layers of Modesta on my car and there's no way I could improve the result by applying anything else over it. Did the detailer see your car when he gave his opinion? I know my detailer would ask to come show the car and would immediately start doing his magic on it. The point of having a coating is to get rid of or prevent scratches and swirls. There's something wrong here. If you are lucky, it is just a result of the wax layer and should be easy to polish out.

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alin3 said:

I've found that swirls are most commonly introduced, particularly in black cars, during the drying stage (with a less than clean towel). I'm completely anal with my R8, and therefore use a blower to dry the car post-wash and try to avoid any drying with a towel. If you need to dry with a towel, I'd recommend blotting the car with a large waffle weave microfiber towel rather than rubbing the towel against the paint.

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Or try the "drying with water" method my detailer taught me. That way one no longer has to touch the larger areas with a microfiber towel.

There are marks? Where? lol

jpet said:

Or try the "drying with water" method my detailer taught me. That way one no longer has to touch the larger areas with a microfiber towel.

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Please elaborate.

If you mean running the hose over the car with no nozzle, so the water sheets off, that sort of frowned upon here in California.

markb1 said:

Please elaborate.

If you mean running the hose over the car with no nozzle, so the water sheets off, that sort of frowned upon here in California.

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That's what I mean. But it only works well with a coating that has strong water-repellent properties like the Modesta BC-05. You still have to wipe dry some areas of course or you can use an 8 hp Master Blaster blower. That blower scared the hell out of me at first. :scared:

A couple things.

Coatings do not need to be waxed or sealed. The notion that this provides extra protection, while logical, is insanely insignificant when talking about something on a submicron level. Secondly, no layer of protection, other than paint protection film (and perhaps Carpro's new self-healing coating), protects against improper washing, especially when doing rinseless or waterless washes. Avoiding swirls is just really hard when it comes to a daily driver.

You have some very mild swirling there, and frankly it could have been there after the correction. The sun is the great equalizer and reveals all. You probably can't even see those things in regular lighting.

As jpet mentioned, use a Metro Master Blaster to dry your car. Works great when you have a coating.

I have a black P85D with CQuartz Finest and the swirls are back after a few washes. I have decided to just live with it and not worry constantly about having a perfect looking car anymore. I found it to not be worth the stress. Definitely understand be frustration though.

sounds like an amateur detailer who screwed up and didn't do a good paint correction first and now he probably sealed in those swirls under the cquartz. that suuucks.

yobigd20 said:

sounds like an amateur detailer who screwed up and didn't do a good paint correction first and now he probably sealed in those swirls under the cquartz. that suuucks.

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That's indeed one of the possibilities. Another option is improper washing technique.
I would go back to the initial detailer so he can have a look at it. He should be able to do something about it.

eyespii said:

My detailer informed me that the "swirls" I'm seeing are not actually swirls in the paint, and are a normal part of the clear coat, and that they're impossible to get rid of.

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this line alone proves that the detailer you went to is a really bad amateur, not a professional. do not go back to him again. he obviously didnt paint correct right. or if he did, then he didn't apply the cquartz thoroughly enough to protect the car (he may have missed spots) thus causing you to get swirls when you did the subsequent washes. but for him to say something like "swirls are part of the clear coat and are impossible to get out" is total BS and he's trying to weasel his way out of something that's too difficult for him to do correctly.

find someone else. i doubt you can get your money back from the first guy.

No detailer can get out 100% of the swirls and scratches. That would be an impossible venture with a lot of risk to the clearcoat. You just have to balance the amount of correction with the safety of doing the correction. For all you know, those remaining swirls could have been much more significant to begin with and they are now substantially better.

Although certainly some detailers are much better and conscientious than others, I don't think you can assume that either one is a hack since you really don't have any real documentation of what the car was like before.

Now, for detailers there is significant disagreement about the value and utility of coatings. Some detailers feel that they are the way to go and others like waxes and sealants. The appropriate LSP for a car is the one that best suits the driver's needs and the experience of the detailer. If you've got a garage queen and hardly ever sees the light of day, waxes are fine. If your car is a DD and is outside a lot, a coating is the way to go. Nevertheless, even coatings can be done improperly and the life of a coating has much to do with how it is handled after the application.

But, I'll say it again. Your swirls are barely noticeable. Chalk it up to a learning experience and next year (or two years from now) if you think your car needs a refresher, stick with one detailer who is rated / certified and make sure you see what is indeed more closely.

That sucks.

But something doesn't make complete sense. How did detailer #1 determine that there was no CQ present on the car? Are you sure that detailer #2 polished the car? "Polish" can mean different things to different people. Some may use it in lay terms to mean "shining up the car" with a wax. Did detailer #2 actually use an abrasive substance to - in the true sense - polish the car? Was an AIO wax used? That would be an abrasive polish with a wax. Simply hand (or machine) waxing shouldn't remove the CQ and clearly washing it a few times isn't going to do that either. I ask because completely stripping by polishing the car could take a while to do.

You didn't mention holograms in the OP. Those are present now too?