Denied Squeaky Pano Warranty due to installation of dashcam?!

There's another thread similar to yours, where someone got denied something because of a dashcam installation.

Basically it boils down that Tesla has to PROVE (not speculate) that your modification caused the problem to legally deny a warranty claim.

Here you go:

mikeash said:

Under US law they have to demonstrate that the problem was caused by your modification if they want to deny a warranty claim. It is illegal to simply deny a claim on the basis of a modification being done. If they think your mod caused the problem, they need to actually prove it. This will probably be hard given that your problem pre-dates it. In any case, they can't just tell you to get lost like this. Read up on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act and know your rights.

Click to expand...

Also something to note: Warranty doesn't cover squeaks and rattles (at least my warranty on my 2013 Model S). That hasn't stopped Tesla from fixing them under warranty though. I've had probably a dozen fixes for squeaks and rattles and never been charged. Just wish they would actually fix them because they come back a few days-weeks after being "fixed".

steph280 said:

My June delivered 70D has had squeaky pano since day one. Normally stuff like this doesn't bother me much, but it has gotten louder over the weeks so I decided to bring it in to Costa Mesa service center for them to look at. The technician went on test drive with me and confirmed the noise. Then he tried lubricating some parts and found some loose dual lock inside headliner which he reattached. The noise went away and I was on my happy way, only to have the noise return a few days later.

So I made a followup appointment to get it looked at again, only to have the SA email me telling me this may not be covered under warranty due to "modifications" I did to the roof.

The "modification" he referred to was running of the rear dashcam wire through the small headliner area between windshield and pano roof. I did this install myself (done it many times before) and the wire was simply fished through the space. Never was the headliner removed or modified in anyway. How that's a "modification" to the roof is beyond me.

The roof squeak happens only when it's fully closed, so clearly this is a stress somewhere in the structure. To have them pin this on running a wire is unbelievable. It's not like I am trying to get a freebie for nothing. This is a real issue since day one and I'd expect a much better service experience for a company of this caliber.

Off the soap box now...

Click to expand...

I think your service center might need an education about the Magnuson-Moss Act. Direct from the FTC:

Will using 'aftermarket' or recycled parts void my warranty?

No. An 'aftermarket' part is a part made by a company other than the vehicle manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer. A 'recycled' part is a part that was made for and installed in a new vehicle by the manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer, and later removed from the vehicle and made available for resale or reuse. Simply using an aftermarket or recycled part does not void your warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act makes it illegal for companies to void your warranty or deny coverage under the warranty simply because you used an aftermarket or recycled part. The manufacturer or dealer can, however, require consumers to use select parts if those parts are provided to consumers free of charge under the warranty.

Still, if it turns out that the aftermarket or recycled part was itself defective or wasn't installed correctly, and it causes damage to another part that is covered under the warranty, the manufacturer or dealer has the right to deny coverage for that part and charge you for any repairs. The FTC says the manufacturer or dealer must show that the aftermarket or recycled part caused the need for repairs before denying warranty coverage.

While I agree Tesla should fix the issue, I disagree that the language recited below from the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act is applicable. That language refers to aftermarket or recycled part replacements on a vehicle, not modifications done to a vehicle. Good luck.

AmpedRealtor said:

I think your service center might need an education about the Magnuson-Moss Act. Direct from the FTC:

Will using 'aftermarket' or recycled parts void my warranty?

No. An 'aftermarket' part is a part made by a company other than the vehicle manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer. A 'recycled' part is a part that was made for and installed in a new vehicle by the manufacturer or the original equipment manufacturer, and later removed from the vehicle and made available for resale or reuse. Simply using an aftermarket or recycled part does not void your warranty. The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act makes it illegal for companies to void your warranty or deny coverage under the warranty simply because you used an aftermarket or recycled part. The manufacturer or dealer can, however, require consumers to use select parts if those parts are provided to consumers free of charge under the warranty.

Still, if it turns out that the aftermarket or recycled part was itself defective or wasn't installed correctly, and it causes damage to another part that is covered under the warranty, the manufacturer or dealer has the right to deny coverage for that part and charge you for any repairs. The FTC says the manufacturer or dealer must show that the aftermarket or recycled part caused the need for repairs before denying warranty coverage.

Click to expand...

Escalate the issue. And if I can find it I will add a link to a facebook post from a guy who had a pano issue Tesla tried to weasel out of, but eventually they fixed.

Get the name of the service area supervisor from your local service center and contact him or her. I recently picked up my new Model S and had to fight hard to get them to fix several defects in the car. Had to go to the area supervisor or whatever his title was (update: its regional service manager, and for Houston his name is Richard Demarco - very nice guy and he helped me get my car fixed right). Also, on facebook I posted my woes and got a response from another Tesla service person who offered to send me a new part for my car if I needed it. Long story short, I think there is some kind of push in Tesla to get the local service centers to be less cooperative with customers (assume its a money thing). But there are still people in high places in Tesla service who want the customer to be treated fairly and honestly. I'm hoping those people win out and Tesla doesn't end up with a GM-like service reputation, but sadly it seems to be sliding that way. Maybe it can slide back the other way.

Here's the text from the facebook post - if you go to May 23 in the Houston Tesla club maybe you can find it - I don't know how to post a link to this particular facebook post.

Bill Kopitzke

May 22




Please, everyone... I need your help!
As previously posted, I have had recurring problems with the sunroof. Today the service center called me and informed me that the service manager has decided that I am expected to foot the $4000 bill for fixing the sunroof because of negligence on my part...It is my fault that the spring/screw gets dirt on it, and my fault that it has had to be repaired, sometimes more than once because the service center didn't do it correctly the first time.
I mentioned that other people had posted with the same problems, and the caller said that they couldn't think of any others.
Would you please post the difficulties you have had with the roof? A few of you have already posted under Gregory Tragitt's post, but I need as much ammunition as possible. No more Tesla smile frown emoticon

Here's at least a link to the Houston tesla club in facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/HoustonTeslaClub/

I would try this before dealing with Tesla again..............Apply silicone spray to a small piece of sponge and apply it to all rubber/metal interfaces and rubber/glass interfaces. Silicone is inert and will not affect any of the materials. i use it all the time on rubber bushings on my golf cart and rear hatch seals to eliminate squeaks. When rubber gets dry or dirty/dusty it can squeak.

Think that you are being treated fairly. You were told that your repair "may" not be covered. It probably depends on what they are able to determine what is causing the noises. If it is due to your addition of a camera, then you should be expected to pay for any repairs that you are requesting.

On the other hand, if the noises are being caused by a Tesla issue they might fix it anyways, under customer satisfaction guidelines.

If your warranty expressly does not cover squeeks or rattles, again any repairs would be on your dime, unless they deem to cover it for good will.

Best to take it in and see what they say.

Very simple, remove the camera and wire.. If the squeak remains then the camera had/has nothing to with the noise.
Since Tesla is now shipping the Model S with a revised Pano design its obvious the are correcting problems.
Be nice and firm, I am sure they will fix it.


=steph280;1082621]My June delivered 70D has had squeaky pano since day one. Normally stuff like this doesn't bother me much, but it has gotten louder over the weeks so I decided to bring it in to Costa Mesa service center for them to look at. The technician went on test drive with me and confirmed the noise. Then he tried lubricating some parts and found some loose dual lock inside headliner which he reattached. The noise went away and I was on my happy way, only to have the noise return a few days later.

So I made a followup appointment to get it looked at again, only to have the SA email me telling me this may not be covered under warranty due to "modifications" I did to the roof.

The "modification" he referred to was running of the rear dashcam wire through the small headliner area between windshield and pano roof. I did this install myself (done it many times before) and the wire was simply fished through the space. Never was the headliner removed or modified in anyway. How that's a "modification" to the roof is beyond me.

The roof squeak happens only when it's fully closed, so clearly this is a stress somewhere in the structure. To have them pin this on running a wire is unbelievable. It's not like I am trying to get a freebie for nothing. This is a real issue since day one and I'd expect a much better service experience for a company of this caliber.

Off the soap box now...[/QUOTE]

I actually had the same issue after installed blackvue. Tesla actually helped me eliminate the noise, took them 4 tries too.

I haven't had any issues and I installed a blackvue 9k miles ago. If you guys determine the true cause, please share it here. Perhaps you'll help someone else down the road avoid the issue.

steph280 said:

Appreciate all the suggestions.

The issue has been there since day one, so it's definitely not camera install related. But they are saying I never brought it in before the camera install so they are using that as an excuse to deny my warranty. I just find it hard to believe we have to fight to get minor issue like this fixed on a car costing close to $10K. This has definitely put a sour taste in an otherwise pleasant Tesla ownership experience.

Click to expand...

You got one hell of a deal huh? Sorry to hear about your situation, as instructed above be firm that you want it resolved.

RMG007 said:

While I agree Tesla should fix the issue, I disagree that the language recited below from the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act is applicable. That language refers to aftermarket or recycled part replacements on a vehicle, not modifications done to a vehicle. Good luck.

Click to expand...

Others on TMC have been citing this act with regards to aftermarket add-ons. Tesla has denied warranty coverage to at least one other person who installed a dash cam, and this act was promoted as a way to get Tesla to prove that the add-on was at fault. I researched the Act and the part I quoted is the only portion of the Act that would seem to apply. If there is another portion that addresses add-ons, that would be great to know, otherwise if it is solely for replacement parts, then the Act would not seem to offer owners any protection against Tesla denying a warranty claim over an add-on.

Maybe these types of situations may be beneficial to others, on how to treat issues that arise. For instance, if you note an issue with your car and you plan to do anything that might impact your warranty, perhaps the best course of action is to notify Tesla of the issue beforehand.

I'm not sure Tesla is doing anything you shouldn't expect from a manufacturer here. Perhaps people who have invested could shed some light on how they would expect Tesla to act. Should their policy be to replace everything under warranty regardless of the extenuating circumstances? I'm not a shareholder, so I can't answer this question.

JohnSnowNW said:

I'm not sure Tesla is doing anything you shouldn't expect from a manufacturer here. Perhaps people who have invested could shed some light on how they would expect Tesla to act. Should their policy be to replace everything under warranty regardless of the extenuating circumstances? I'm not a shareholder, so I can't answer this question.

Click to expand...

IMHO, there should not be squeaks and rattles on a $70k+ car after a few months. We give Tesla a little leeway here since they are a new company, etc. but fixing the issues is part of them improving the car, and is is expected, even if not spelled out explicitly in the warranty.

They should fix all manufacturing defects (yes I consider squeaks in a new car a defect) as long as the customer modification did not cause the issue. In the case that is nearly 100% certain (fishing a wire will not cause the sunroof to squeak).

Having said that, I personally never had any issue with Tesla Service fixing anything I pointed out. Maybe it's a San Diego Service center thing, but they always seems to bend over backwards and do everything possible to make me happy make the car right. They are but far the best service center I've ever dealt with. Granted I've only owned Ford, Chevy, Dodge, Acura and Inifinti cars before, so maybe Mercedes and BMW dealers are as good, though I doubt it based on what I've heard from my friends and family who those makes.

liuping said:

IMHO, there should not be squeaks and rattles on a $70k+ car after a few months. We give Tesla a little leeway here since they are a new company, etc. but fixing the issues is part of them improving the car, and is is expected, even if not spelled out explicitly in the warranty.

They should fix all manufacturing defects (yes I consider squeaks in a new car a defect) as long as the customer modification did not cause the issue. In the case that is nearly 100% certain (fishing a wire will not cause the sunroof to squeak).

Having said that, I personally never had any issue with Tesla Service fixing anything I pointed out. Maybe it's a San Diego Service center thing, but they always seems to bend over backwards and do everything possible to make me happy make the car right. They are but far the best service center I've ever dealt with. Granted I've only owned Ford, Chevy, Dodge, Acura and Inifinti cars before, so maybe Mercedes and BMW dealers are as good, though I doubt it based on what I've heard from my friends and family who those makes.

Click to expand...

Right, but what I'm saying is that Tesla wasn't notified of the issue pre-camera installation. So, the 100% certainty is only in the mind of the owner, not Tesla...since they have no reference. As you've said, Tesla does seem to have pretty decent service...so one would assume the issue is either specific to this service center, or the service center feels confident in their determination of the cause.

I'm not saying it's one way or the other, but I am saying that a business is under no obligation to take someone at their word simply because they purchased one of their products. Again, I'm not implying that the OP is lying, just speaking from an objective perspective.

It seems like the service centers in California are not very friendly, I've read so many complaints about them. The one here in Arizona is an absolute pleasure to work with.

AmpedRealtor said:

It seems like the service centers in California are not very friendly, I've read so many complaints about them. The one here in Arizona is an absolute pleasure to work with.

Click to expand...

Agreed - they have been great for me also. Just need one in Tucson.