Time of use Charging?

chriSharek · May 25, 2015

We recently received the "smart" meters from our power utility so they can tell not only how much energy you are using, but WHEN you're using it.

Can the MS be programmed to come on and charge during the lower rates, for those that have lowered rates during off-peak hours?

Our 4 year old Volt can do that - I don't recall reading anything about whether the MS could. Thanks, cs

mmccord · May 25, 2015

Yes, it supports scheduled charging.

araxara · May 25, 2015

You can set a starting charge time, but you can only set a single time and no ending time. Charging can begin automatically a few hours after the starting time if you happen to plug in after the starting time. It’s not a very flexible scheduler. I have mine now set to 1am which is well within my cheap TOU rate times and which gives enough time for charging to complete by morning (with a HPWC). This also assures that my car has minimal charge loss due to vampire drain. There is also no setting for day of week. If I need to charge immediately when I plug in I either manually start charging or use the Remote S Apple Watch app.

wk057 · May 25, 2015

The scheduling is lacking compared to other EVs (like the Volt, which allows a full schedule with multiple rate tiers), but it gets the job done. Just make sure your rate schedule makes sense and you wont end up with no real savings or even an increase in costs by switching to ToU.

David99 · May 25, 2015

The only thing you can do in the Tesla is set the charge timer. For example if your lowest electricity rate starts at midnight, set the can's charge timer to that time (or maybe a few min later to be on the safe side). Once the time is set the car won't charge during the day and will start again the next night at midnight.

tliving · May 25, 2015

You could get more fancy with VisibleTesla.

Larry Chanin · May 25, 2015

chriSharek said:
We recently received the "smart" meters from our power utility so they can tell not only how much energy you are using, but WHEN you're using it.

Can the MS be programmed to come on and charge during the lower rates, for those that have lowered rates during off-peak hours?

Our 4 year old Volt can do that - I don't recall reading anything about whether the MS could. Thanks, cs

Chris,

Yes, as others have stated the Model S has a simple timer.

However, our utility does not have EV rates. You would merely be making a donation to the utility without any quid pro quo.

Whereas you could go to the expense of adding another meter and going with residential time of use rates, as was mentioned you had better be very careful. If you don't do a good job of shifting load off-peak you could actually end up spending more on your electric bill.

Here is are some excerpts of messages that I received in 2012 from a club member discussing the subject:

We just received a brochure today about FPL's plan to install smart meters for residential customers. The brochure said that the meter would report time of day usage back to FPL and make that information available to customers. So, naturally I got excited and got them on the phone to ask them (again) about "time of use" billing, and reduced rate billing for off-peak usage.

Unfortunately, after spending an hour re-explaining my questions, and being transferred 4 times, the answer is still the same. There is no plan for FPL to offer time of use billing to residential customers (with the new smart meter). If you want time of use billing, you have to purchase a "demand" meter for $608.40 (sounds a lot like their new smart meter). And, still, nobody knows (or is allowed to disclose) what the lower off-peak rate really is. Apparently, their new smart meter isn't smart enough to permit off-peak billing at a lower rate per hour.

Larry,
I just received a call back from FPL on my question regarding discounted rates for time of use billing. The gentleman I talked to was incredibly well informed about the "demand" meter and time of use billing for commercial and residential customers. I was hoping that the off peak savings were about 50%. Not the case. He said that when you add up all the incremental costs to get the cost per kWh, a typical residential customer pays about 12 cents /kWh. By using time of use billing and the demand meter, you can save about 1.5 cents during the off peak hours, which are shifting based on season. That's not much of a savings.

He went on to say that he performed a complete analysis of our usage over the past year and compared it to what our bill would be with time of use billing (assuming 30% usage during off peak hours). We would have saved $5.00 total for the entire year. He showed me a month by month chart with his comparison. As usage goes down, time of use becomes more expensive than what we currently pay. As usage goes up, time of use becomes cheaper than what we currently pay. Pay more in winter and spring, pay less in summer and fall with time of use billing.

Perhaps things have since changed, but I'm guessing not.

Larry

David99 · May 25, 2015

Even if you don't have a lower off-peak rate, it makes sense to charge at off peak times. It helps even out grid load and it helps keeping your battery at a lower state of charge by starting to charge later.

RyanT · May 25, 2015

I had a Volt, now a Tesla on tou. One nice thing about the Tesla is it remembers your setting per charge staion. At home I have mine set to start charging at midnight and don't have to adjust it when I go to charge on other 14-50s.

chriSharek · May 26, 2015

Thanks everyone. This is great info.

Larry, I'll find a link or information about FPL's TOU rates. It was VERY recently introduced. I'll find and forward when I can. cs

EriCal · May 28, 2015

Visible Tesla is VERY helpful. Our power company (SCE) also provides a site that allows for monitoring usage etc. We use both and, as a result of careful planning of our usage, have an electric bill that is LESS than it was before the Tesla!!

Eric 1014 S 85. (Her's) All the goodies except pano.

Cyclone · May 28, 2015

wk057 said:
The scheduling is lacking compared to other EVs (like the Volt, which allows a full schedule with multiple rate tiers), but it gets the job done. Just make sure your rate schedule makes sense and you wont end up with no real savings or even an increase in costs by switching to ToU.

Sounds like you've seen Duke Energy NC's rate schedules!

For others who are interested...
This is my current rate schedule = http://www.duke-energy.com/pdfs/NCScheduleRE.pdf
This is the ToU schedule I would be subject to = http://www.duke-energy.com/pdfs/NCScheduleRT.pdf

So, in my case, I'll stick with my regular plan!

GSP · May 28, 2015

TOU rates may not be a good deal for everyone, but it is a big world out there (yes, it even extends past certain states in the USA!).

My utility offers a seperate meter with TOU for EV charging only. They will supply the meter, but you have to install the meter base (only $50-100). This is a great deal, and over 90% of my charging is off-peak at <$0.04/kWh (depends on utility fuel cost adjustment).

Even without TOU rates, "charge based on departure time" is a great feature that I use every day to leave with a warm battery on winter mornings. It also would be useful when charging to 100% to minimize the time spent there. I hope Tesla can get around to adding this in the next year or so. They do have lots of high priority work to expand their company, but did I mention this is a GREAT feature, and easy to program?

GSP

chriSharek · May 28, 2015

GSP said:
TOU rates may not be a good deal for everyone, but it is a big world out there (yes, it even extends past certain states in the USA!).

My utility offers a seperate meter with TOU for EV charging only. They will supply the meter, but you have to install the meter base (only $50-100). This is a great deal, and over 90% of my charging is off-peak at <$0.04/kWh (depends on utility fuel cost adjustment).

Even without TOU rates, "charge based on departure time" is a great feature that I use every day to leave with a warm battery on winter mornings. It also would be useful when charging to 100% to minimize the time spent there. I hope Tesla can get around to adding this in the next year or so. They do have lots of high priority work to expand their company, but did I mention this is a GREAT feature, and easy to program?

GSP

Great points - and the sooner the power companies get on board with it, the better for us (saves us $), and the better for them (reduces their peak demands).

Cyclone, Duke will be the LAST one to get on board! Sorry!

3mp_kwh · May 28, 2015

GSP said:
TOU rates may not be a good deal for everyone, but it is a big world out there (yes, it even extends past certain states in the USA!).

When saddled with demand charges, they aren't. If Cyclone peaked at 50kw, it looks like he'd have an extra $388 on his bill?

On-peak Demand charges will spur Powerwall sales. Just not where rates are ~$.10/kwh.

Cyclone · May 28, 2015

Meanwhile, my pre-Tesla monthly electric bill in an all-electric 3k sq ft. multi-story house is $80-$130, with December being $180 because I'm the Griswold in the neighborhood.

chriSharek · May 28, 2015

Cyclone said:
. . . with December being $180 because I'm the Griswold in the neighborhood.

LOL!

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Time of use Charging?

chriSharek

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mmccord

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araxara

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wk057

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David99

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tliving

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Larry Chanin

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David99

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RyanT

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chriSharek

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EriCal

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Cyclone

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GSP

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3mp_kwh

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Cyclone

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