Green Car Reports Model X article

So, basically, engineering is hard.

Probably all true, these are issues that have to be overcome on an all electric SUV.

Comments on GCR go deep into the mirror vs camera efficiency question. FWIW, I recall a statement that removing the side mirrors gives a 6% savings of energy expended at highway speed.

Why all the secrecy? Why doesn't Tesla simply outline the difficulties in a letter to MX res holders. I think that would have a positive outcome as it would be well received.

apacheguy said:

Why all the secrecy? Why doesn't Tesla simply outline the difficulties in a letter to MX res holders. I think that would have a positive outcome as it would be well received.

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Wait, what? You're talking about a group of people who parse every single word of a communication, looking for hidden meaning. That behavior won't suddenly stop.

apacheguy said:

Why all the secrecy? Why doesn't Tesla simply outline the difficulties in a letter to MX res holders. I think that would have a positive outcome as it would be well received.

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well....TIT

This Is Tesla.

MikeL said:

Comments on GCR go deep into the mirror vs camera efficiency question. FWIW, I recall a statement that removing the side mirrors gives a 6% savings of energy expended at highway speed.

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6% in my opinion is quite a lot, so worth it.

It also saves money not having to replace wing mirrors every time they get hit. Unless the camera sticks out more, which I doubt. It may also make it safer to drive by giving a wider FOV of the roads to the side and behind.

Tesla is being super secretive about what is coming in the Model X. They have not shown any version except one from a year ago. They have said that it will have tons of great features. They are becoming like Apple. Well, they are stealing so many Apple employees that they are getting some of Apple's ideas too.

All the talk about motor load while towing makes me think they should produce their own trailer platform based on a battery pack--carry your stuff, extend your range. Who wouldn't love an 85kwh trailer?

apacheguy said:

Why all the secrecy? Why doesn't Tesla simply outline the difficulties in a letter to MX res holders. I think that would have a positive outcome as it would be well received.

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1) They want people to buy the Model S.
2) a) Journalism is a horrible industry that cares nothing for truth b) people are particularly attracted to bad news: bad news gets amplified by journalists.
3) Bad news could put off current employees, potential employees, customers and investors.

Martini said:

All the talk about motor load while towing makes me think they should produce their own trailer platform based on a battery pack--carry your stuff, extend your range. Who wouldn't love an 85kwh trailer?

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Now you're talking! Can I have that 85KW strapped under my pop-up camper please?

I've been following the X with the hope that I will be able to tow with it. But that article is making me doubt I will ever see an X tow something like my camper. I tow it now with a Honda Odyssey and the poor Honda is pretty much at it's limit. I was hoping Elon's statements about the X being able to tow would include sizable things like boats and trailers, not just token utility trailers and small Sunfish sized boats.

A battery on the trailer, how long would that battery last?
I know I usually park my trailer in the backyard forgetting everything about it, until i need to use the trailer once every second month. I doubt the battery would like to be unplugged for month...

/Martin

Add electric motors to the trailer as well. :biggrin:

kiefer said:

A battery on the trailer, how long would that battery last?
I know I usually park my trailer in the backyard forgetting everything about it, until i need to use the trailer once every second month. I doubt the battery would like to be unplugged for month...

/Martin

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You would have to keep the trailer plugged in to at least a L1 UMC to keep the battery OK.

I'd think the 60 kwh battery would be a better option, or use the old rev A packs after people upgrade to make the trailers with refurb packs. Could physically be an old 85 software limited to 60 to hide degradation.

dhanson865 said:

You would have to keep the trailer plugged in to at least a L1 UMC to keep the battery OK.

I'd think the 60 kwh battery would be a better option, or use the old rev A packs after people upgrade to make the trailers with refurb packs. Could physically be an old 85 software limited to 60 to hide degradation.

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Heck, I have to plug the trailer into an L1 every now and then just to charge up the 12V battery that is already there. If I had a 60 KWh pack and a motor to help push me along that L1 plug and power usage would be a small price to pay!

I wish, but TESLA would then be in the trailer business, not a far stretch considering all of their delivery times and projections are very similar to to the RV industry. I just wish they would come out with some actual specifications regarding the MX indicating what it will or will not be able to do. With the rear doors it will obviously never be able to carry any type of surfboard or snowboard, I wish they would finalize the spec for it so i can just buy a Model S85D if that is the only EV that will do the job.

The fact that Tesla is supply-constrained on the batteries is probably the biggest reason to forget any notion of trailer batteries by Tesla themselves. It is also questionable if the added weight would be worth it, how safe such a setup would be crash-wise and so on. That said, I'm actually hoping as EVs proliferate, that more and more mobile charging solutions will appear from third parties and that car manufacturers make it easier to support their use with alternative charging ports. Like you would carry on an extra battery for your smartphone and hook it up through USB. Having a backup handy, all charged up, might be useful in some scenarios. Places like service stations could also sell them full charged up for people in a pinch. Mind you, I'm not talking about 85 kWh, of course, but something portable - and, why not, something towable as well.

FOCUSEV said:

I wish, but TESLA would then be in the trailer business, not a far stretch considering all of their delivery times and projections are very similar to to the RV industry. I just wish they would come out with some actual specifications regarding the MX indicating what it will or will not be able to do. With the rear doors it will obviously never be able to carry any type of surfboard or snowboard, I wish they would finalize the spec for it so i can just buy a Model S85D if that is the only EV that will do the job.

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I wish tesla were in the trailer buisiness for one reason. It would reverse the trend of US market vehicles being "unable to tow" per the owners manual even when they have the physical capability to do so if you add a hitch.

If Tesla marketed all their EVs as tow worthy then other companies would have a bullet point in marketing that they either couldn't match or would ask their engineers/accountants to authorize matching.

Think about it, EVs by nature have insane torque and low torque is one of the issues that make ICE vehicles with weak engines poor at towing. EVs by nature also have regenerative braking in addition to the friction brakes meaning they have enough braking power to safely stop a trailer where ICE vehicles have to spend more on beefier discs/pads the EV already has that covered just by making sure the motor(s) exist.

If the Kia Rio 3dr*, Honda Civic*, or Fiat 500L** is considered a good tow car there is no reason you shouldn't aim for that standard with a Prius, Leaf, or Tesla. But Nissan USA and Toyota USA wimp out on it. If Tesla took the lead the US divisions would get back to a less extreme position on towing.

* The best tow cars of 2013 - Telegraph
** What makes a good tow car? - Telegraph