Powerstream SAE charger at 400 & MajMack

Comso · Dec 31, 2014

It doesn't look like this ha been discussed here:

PowerStream goes public with high-speed EV charging | PowerStream eStream

Powerstream (power co for Markham, Vaughan, etc) has introduced some free chargers at their head office at highway 400 near Major Mack. Most sound like they're J1772, but one caught my eye.

From the article, it indicates they put in an ABB dual connector high power DC charger. One end is a CHAdeMO, and the other is an SAE connector.

What is that? SAE what?

I don't live too far from there, so might drop by to check it out, but it occurs to me that this is a good location for those looking to top up north of the city, but can't make it to the Barrie supercharger. ...assuming it can charge a Model S without the mythical CHAdeMO adapter.

Doug_G · Dec 31, 2014

SAE is the mythical Frankenplug. It's a J1772 with extra DC contacts. Even rarer than the plug: EVs that can use it.

PoweredByRain · Dec 31, 2014

Doug_G said:
SAE is the mythical Frankenplug. It's a J1772 with extra DC contacts. Even rarer than the plug: EVs that can use it.

Right now it's basically BMW i3s with the quick charge option, and... um, I think that's it. Are there any Chevy Sparks in Canada? I don't think so. VW e-Golf? Not yet.

IEC 62196 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I must say, though, despite how hideous the CCS connector is, it's less hideous than CHAdeMO. Speaking of which, it does seem like the "forever coming soon" CHAdeMO adapter for the Model S actually is coming soon now. January, supposedly. CHAdeMO Adapter - Page 45

I should add: there is a discussion of the possibility of a CCS adapter for the Model S here: SAE J1772 DC (Combo) Connector Adapter for Model S

At that page you can see just how hideous the connector is. Really - how is it Tesla managed such a small, simple connector to handle up to 120 kW DC as well as AC, when the others are so much bigger and can't even handle as high a power? Before I bought the Tesla I was disappointed that Tesla decided on their own standard, because I hate proliferation of standards, but seeing what the other DC standards look like - what, were they designed by people trying to kill the electric car?

stopcrazypp · Dec 31, 2014

PoweredByRain said:
Right now it's basically BMW i3s with the quick charge option, and... um, I think that's it. Are there any Chevy Sparks in Canada? I don't think so. VW e-Golf? Not yet.

CCS/SAE will be standard on the i3 for the 2015 model. It is standard already for the e-Golf.

PoweredByRain · Dec 31, 2014

stopcrazypp said:
CCS/SAE will be standard on the i3 for the 2015 model. It is standard already for the e-Golf.

That's good to know. But with respect to Canada, check out this URL: VW e-Golf Electric Concept Car | Volkswagen Canada Concept Cars

Note: "concept car"! This is a current VW Canada web page.

This is a bit old, but New e-Golf not bound for Canada | Autonet.ca

VW Canada’s Thomas Tetzlaff says, “At the present time there are no plans to bring it to Canada in the near future. We will closely monitor sales in California to see if there is an appetite for such a vehicle up here before making any further decisions.”

So, unless I'm mistaken, there are at most a couple of hundred i3s in Canada that might have a CCS combo plug. And that's it.

It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out. I can't see CHAdeMO dying, given the existing installed base of Nissan LEAFs. I suspect that the combined CHAdeMO/CCS quick chargers will be the standard, unless Tesla somehow convinces (and wants to convince) another manufacturer to use the Supercharger network.

Doug_G · Dec 31, 2014

Personally I'd far rather see SAE plugs rolled out than Chademo. Both are hideous... but Chademo is hideous-er.

stopcrazypp · Dec 31, 2014

PoweredByRain said:
It will be interesting to see how all of this plays out. I can't see CHAdeMO dying, given the existing installed base of Nissan LEAFs. I suspect that the combined CHAdeMO/CCS quick chargers will be the standard, unless Tesla somehow convinces (and wants to convince) another manufacturer to use the Supercharger network.

I agree, dual standard chargers are the trend even in Europe where CCS is required by law at minimum. There's still not enough volume (both number of EVs and number of chargers are far from a "mature" market) to say which one will be dominant in the future (except maybe in Japan).

SmartElectric · Dec 31, 2014

As per :
PlugShare - EV Charging Station Map - Find a place to charge your car!

Ports
3 EV Plug (J1772)s, 2 CHAdeMO DCFCs, 2 SAE Combo DCFCs

So this one spot can supply power to BMW i3, Nissan Leaf, Mitsubishi i-MiEV which are the majority of cars (outside of Tesla) available with DCQC in Ontario.

Comso · Dec 31, 2014

Thanks for all the feedback. I hit PowerStream up on Twitter too, and they confirmed the same, although suggested that Chevy Volts could use the CCS connector as well. With the new Volt being introduced in the next few weeks, it will be interesting to see if this becomes more common.

I stopped by PowerStream this afternoon, and took a few pics (attached).

SCY7H3 · Jan 10, 2015

Oh yes, I know this charger at PowerStream. It's not far from me and quite convenient to have. A few weeks back there was an issue where the charge cycle would fail after a few minutes but that's been corrected as of a week or two ago. So it will charge up to 100% now.

Luclyluciano · Jan 10, 2015

Does this charger work on the Model S as is? I live very close to this.

SCY7H3 · Jan 10, 2015

Luclyluciano said:
Does this charger work on the Model S as is? I live very close to this.

soon, Tesla will have the Chademo adapter released:

sandpiper · Jan 18, 2015

SCY7H3 said:
soon, Tesla will have the Chademo adapter released:

View attachment 68849 View attachment 68850

ugh. What a mess. Kudos to Tesla for their very clean, simple adapter.

- - - Updated - - -

Comso said:
Thanks for all the feedback. I hit PowerStream up on Twitter too, and they confirmed the same, although suggested that Chevy Volts could use the CCS connector as well. With the new Volt being introduced in the next few weeks, it will be interesting to see if this becomes more common.

I stopped by PowerStream this afternoon, and took a few pics (attached).

OMG, that adapter is horrible!

Johan · Jan 18, 2015

sandpiper said:
ugh. What a mess. Kudos to Tesla for their very clean, simple adapter.

- - - Updated - - -

OMG, that adapter is horrible!

It's not an adapter. It's the actual plug! I agree it's horrible and it isn't for nothing it has been nicknamed "the Frankenplug".

Luclyluciano · Jan 18, 2015

So does this mean it DOES NOT WORK on a Tesla now?

SmartElectric · Jan 18, 2015

Tesla does not support any other DC charger at this time.

Availability of that adaptor has been suggested as Jan 2015 (soon), at which point the answer changes.

stopcrazypp · Jan 18, 2015

Johan said:
It's not an adapter. It's the actual plug! I agree it's horrible and it isn't for nothing it has been nicknamed "the Frankenplug".

The ironic thing is that the people who started calling it "Frankenplug" are CHAdeMO supporters. If you put CCS and CHAdeMO side-by-side, I don't think "Frankenplug" is justified, esp. considering CCS is designed to allow a compatible socket to the level 2 version.

Design-wise, CCS actually is better to use than the first gen CHAdeMO connector (although 2nd gen has improved).

sandpiper · Jan 19, 2015

stopcrazypp said:
The ironic thing is that the people who started calling it "Frankenplug" are CHAdeMO supporters. If you put CCS and CHAdeMO side-by-side, I don't think "Frankenplug" is justified, esp. considering CCS is designed to allow a compatible socket to the level 2 version.

Design-wise, CCS actually is better to use than the first gen CHAdeMO connector (although 2nd gen has improved).

Is there any doubt why people compare Tesla to Apple? On one side you have this enormous horrible mish-mash of a contraption that does work, but looks like it was produced by an engineer. On the other side you've got something small, clean, attractive and that functions even better. Tesla realizes, as Apple does, that it's not just about functionality - that it's also about the details and elegance of design that make a product attractive to people.

It's also no wonder that people compare Elon to Jobs. You don't get that sort of a "no compromises" product without someone at the helm who will simply not accept less, and who is perfectly willing pitch 6 months of engineering into the garbage if it isn't appealing enough.

PoweredByRain · Jan 19, 2015

sandpiper said:
Is there any doubt why people compare Tesla to Apple? On one side you have this enormous horrible mish-mash of a contraption that does work, but looks like it was produced by an engineer.

Ummm... the Tesla connector was designed by engineers. They just did a better job.

Keenan84 · Jan 19, 2015

PoweredByRain said:
Ummm... the Tesla connector was designed by engineers. They just did a better job.

+1 lol

Powerstream SAE charger at 400 & MajMack

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