Superchargers at Service Centers?

Maybe more difficult getting ~400kVA supply to an industrial unit if there's no pre-existing capacity. They still have to deal with the utilities.

I've long thought the same, all the service centers and a lot of the showrooms should have superchargers. If they've already got the real estate, that's a big step forward. I'd think most service centers and sales rooms would be in areas where good grid connections weren't too difficult, they aren't located in the middle of residential areas.

cb17 said:

Based on the Decatur, Ga SC/SpC, the Orange County coming soon dot which looks like it's near the Costa Mesa SC, and the 2nd Las Vegas SpC dot (which actually says it's available now, but I'm sure it's not), I'm going to take a shot in the dark and say that Tesla is going to start putting superchargers in their service centers. And why shouldn't they? It's cheaper, easier, faster, and probably saves money on migraine medication for having to deal with the utilities.

Thoughts?

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Add to the list the two existing supercharger installations at the Highland Park, IL service center and the Chicago Grand Ave service center.

Rocklin, CA service center also has Superchargers under construction.

Highland Park in Chicago has had the Superchargers at the Service Center for quite a while now.

The new Montreal service center has two superchargers (in the process of being hooked up), and three HPWCs in front of the building.

One can get a glimpse of the setup around the 0:10 mark in this video: Tesla Montreal Grand Opening Event - YouTube (look on the right side of the building next to the service driveway)

Adding Superchargers to the service centers makes good sense for Tesla, but not as cross-country driving aids.

Having a Supercharger at the service center simplifies logistics for them when they have a lot of cars in for service that need charging, and allows them to diagnose issues related to Superchargering the car without taking it somewhere else for cases where the log didn't tell them enough about what is wrong.

Between those two aspects, I think it makes sense for Tesla to install them, but I would hope they are a lower priority than the road network (a few might be in places that are helpful for roads, too.)
Walter

Saghost said:

Adding Superchargers to the service centers makes good sense for Tesla, but not as cross-country driving aids.

Having a Supercharger at the service center simplifies logistics for them when they have a lot of cars in for service that need charging, and allows them to diagnose issues related to Superchargering the car without taking it somewhere else for cases where the log didn't tell them enough about what is wrong.

Between those two aspects, I think it makes sense for Tesla to install them, but I would hope they are a lower priority than the road network (a few might be in places that are helpful for roads, too.)
Walter

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+1

IMHO deciding SC locations based on major highways routes and very high traffic areas should be the first priority, Tesla Service Centers being 2nd priority.

miimura said:

Rocklin, CA service center also has Superchargers under construction.

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more capacity for the Tahoe crowd!

Saghost said:

Adding Superchargers to the service centers makes good sense for Tesla, but not as cross-country driving aids.

Having a Supercharger at the service center simplifies logistics for them when they have a lot of cars in for service that need charging, and allows them to diagnose issues related to Superchargering the car without taking it somewhere else for cases where the log didn't tell them enough about what is wrong.

Between those two aspects, I think it makes sense for Tesla to install them, but I would hope they are a lower priority than the road network (a few might be in places that are helpful for roads, too.)
Walter

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A few service centers have superchargers for this purpose already, they just aren't available for public use (usually indoors in the service areas). The Burlingame Service center has a Supercharger cabinet you can see behind a fence next to the row of HPWC's, for example.

As I have said there is the issue of Electrical Capacity even for a single Supercharger Cabinet at a Service Center.

Tesla needs a 350 Amp, 3-phase, 208 Volt breaker for a single 90 kW Supercharger Cabinet, or a 225 Amp, 3-phase, 480 Volt breaker for a 135 kW cabinet. Either of those can be a very significant electrical service upgrade at a Tesla Service Center.

Cottonwood said:

As I have said there is the issue of Electrical Capacity even for a single Supercharger Cabinet at a Service Center.

Tesla needs a 350 Amp, 3-phase, 208 Volt breaker for a single 90 kW Supercharger Cabinet, or a 225 Amp, 3-phase, 480 Volt breaker for a 135 kW cabinet. Either of those can be a very significant electrical service upgrade at a Tesla Service Center.

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The new Montreal center needed a significant electrical upgrade just to run its 15+ HPWCs at 80 amps, so it wasn't much further of a stretch for the upgrade to permit a Supercharger cabinet as well.

(As far as I know, all the HPWCs are currently limited to 40A and the cabinet is not powered, due to long administrative delays before the new 500 kVA transformer is connected.)

Cottonwood said:

Tesla needs a 350 Amp, 3-phase, 208 Volt breaker for a single 90 kW Supercharger Cabinet, or a 225 Amp, 3-phase, 480 Volt breaker for a 135 kW cabinet. Either of those can be a very significant electrical service upgrade at a Tesla Service Center.

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Could they have a battery-backed Supercharger that would support one or two Supercharges every other hour? The average charge is still something like 40kWh, from what I remember of the last Supercharger Dashboard (haven't seen one in a while though). The Supercharger could theoretically combine 240V@80A with some other feed from one or two on-site batteries to create 90-135kW total. Then the batteries could recharge at 80A in 1-4 hours.

I'd imagine while technically possible, this might be more complex and less reliable (i.e. showing up expecting a Supercharge to find the battery storage nearly depleted and only getting 80A) than they want to make any of their Superchargers.

jvonbokel said:

Could they have a battery-backed Supercharger that would support one or two Supercharges every other hour? The average charge is still something like 40kWh, from what I remember of the last Supercharger Dashboard (haven't seen one in a while though). The Supercharger could theoretically combine 240V@80A with some other feed from one or two on-site batteries to create 90-135kW total. Then the batteries could recharge at 80A in 1-4 hours.

I'd imagine while technically possible, this might be more complex and less reliable (i.e. showing up expecting a Supercharge to find the battery storage nearly depleted and only getting 80A) than they want to make any of their Superchargers.

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This is an idea that has been discussed before, but is very relevant to this discussion.

Tesla appears to be designing energy storage for the purposes of reducing peak electrical demand for Supercharge Sites with the goal of reducing electricity demand charges. A smaller version of such a design for a single or pair of Supercharger Cabinets could help greatly with installation of Superchargers at locations with limited electrical service capacity as well as reduce electricity demand charges.

tom66 said:

Maybe more difficult getting ~400kVA supply to an industrial unit if there's no pre-existing capacity. They still have to deal with the utilities.

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This idea is very unlikely. What many consumers don't know is that high voltage electricity is around our lives 24/7 we are just not accustomed to seeing it within your every day lives. Any local strip mall, College, Hospital,Supermarket, Restaurant,gym, auto Body shop/Maintenance repair facility or commercial zoning district at the minimum have access to 360 volts. Most of these locations at the terminal outlet have 400 Volts as to not restrict the capacity for business operation.Many of the location for sales and service locations already have 400 volts Supply coming into the building. The only obstacle to just throwing 20 superchargers on the outside which would make all of us happy :tongue: is adding capacity of transformers as well as a distribution electrical load center. So just remember when you that high power Electricity is everywhere you just have to look for it. For example a restaurant that i have worked at our 8 ton Trane unit was 3 phase 360 Volts. and a breaker panel with a max load of 600 amps, So i should i call tesla tomorrow and request one supercharger :biggrin:

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Cottonwood said:

This is an idea that has been discussed before, but is very relevant to this discussion.

Tesla appears to be designing energy storage for the purposes of reducing peak electrical demand for Supercharge Sites with the goal of reducing electricity demand charges. A smaller version of such a design for a single or pair of Supercharger Cabinets could help greatly with installation of Superchargers at locations with limited electrical service capacity as well as reduce electricity demand charges.

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You would be correct in that assertion if you take a look here, Straubel talks about the energy storage system installed at Tejon ranch , reducing peak loads, They have also added Energy Storage to the hawthorn location Because Hawthorne is simply Awesome with their expansion!!!

Saghost said:

Adding Superchargers to the service centers makes good sense for Tesla, but not as cross-country driving aids.

Having a Supercharger at the service center simplifies logistics for them when they have a lot of cars in for service that need charging, and allows them to diagnose issues related to Superchargering the car without taking it somewhere else for cases where the log didn't tell them enough about what is wrong.

Between those two aspects, I think it makes sense for Tesla to install them, but I would hope they are a lower priority than the road network (a few might be in places that are helpful for roads, too.)
Walter

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Hi Walter,

I completely agree. A single Supercharger cabinet would support service operations. However, as you state this shouldn't be a priority item and shouldn't be considered a true Supercharger Station placed there to expand the Supercharger network for traveling Tesla owners. Like HPWCs at service centers it may occasionally help out a traveling owner, but it shouldn't be put in the same category as a true Supercharger Station sited to provide all the necessary amenities.

Cottonwood said:

As I have said there is the issue of Electrical Capacity even for a single Supercharger Cabinet at a Service Center.

Tesla needs a 350 Amp, 3-phase, 208 Volt breaker for a single 90 kW Supercharger Cabinet, or a 225 Amp, 3-phase, 480 Volt breaker for a 135 kW cabinet. Either of those can be a very significant electrical service upgrade at a Tesla Service Center.

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The load of a single Supercharger cabinet is not inconsequential, but in the industrial neighborhoods that many service centers occupy its not a big deal. For example, the service panel in electric room of the Tampa service Center already has the necessary capacity to support a single Supercharger.

I'm not suggesting that every service center should or will pursue the installation of a Supercharger cabinet, but for some it wouldn't be a big problem.

Larry