P85D no more required options...

Wow....

I don't think they ever allowed the performance plus without air in the past. I wonder what prompted that switch.

The tech package is a little silly because the amount of p85d's without tech has to be vanishingly small. But no air - that has reliability issues, handling issues. Lots of people prefer no air even when $$$s aren't the consideration.

Now give us the new seats with an 85D and I think the order button might get hit....

I wonder if it's a web site programming error.

My DS wrote yesterday to confirm that the next generation seats are now available to order on the S85D (and changed my config to include gray leather next gen seats). If that's in fact the case, the Design Studio does not yet show it.

David_Cary said:

Wow....

I don't think they ever allowed the performance plus without air in the past. I wonder what prompted that switch.

The tech package is a little silly because the amount of p85d's without tech has to be vanishingly small. But no air - that has reliability issues, handling issues. Lots of people prefer no air even when $$$s aren't the consideration.

Now give us the new seats with an 85D and I think the order button might get hit....

Click to expand...

Funny, if I had to order a new TMS I would definately want air but I'd possibly skip on the tech if that was possible. After the xenon lights and park sensors were made standard I only want the electric tailgate, but I don't think that alone is worth nearly the cost of the tech package. Sadly air suspension for some weird reason requires the tech package.

The tech package has IMHO gotten too big and needs to be split up in smaller parts.

David_Cary said:

The tech package is a little silly because the amount of p85d's without tech has to be vanishingly small. But no air - that has reliability issues, handling issues. Lots of people prefer no air even when $$$s aren't the consideration.

Click to expand...

Air issues? Somehow I've missed any mention of these, maybe since limited to high power?
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yobigd20 said:

I wonder if it's a web site programming error.

Click to expand...

Based on the website verbiage, this is no mistake and it represents a massive price reduction for folks who want a barebones supercar.

It also reveals the price for the next generation seats - $3,500. A bare-bone P85D is now 105,570 instead of 120,170 (must have 21" wheels, air suspension and tech package) just 2 weeks ago. I bet though most buyers will take the next-gen seats, tech package and air suspension. I did, and stuck with 19" based on my propensity to curb rash and all people here mentioning the 19" are more quiet on highway. Nice though Tesla allows all configurations now,

With all these changes, I wonder what has happened to the + features. Does the P85D come with the tuned suspension like the + did? If you order 21's on the P85D do you get staggered wheels but 21's on a P85 don't? Tesla could really use some clarification on what you actually get at the different levels now.

Bighorn said:

Based on the website verbiage, this is no mistake and it represents a massive price reduction for folks who want a barebones supercar.

Click to expand...

It may be that the factory reconfiguration and a workforce that has more experience has allowed Tesla to be more nimble with the production line and allow for more different configurations.

I agree with the above sentiment. I absolutely want the sport tuned + suspension. I absolutely want the staggered 21's. The ordering page does not make it clear what I've ordered at this point, since clearly the p85d is no longer the p85+ replacement it was originally.

How ow can we go about getting an official answer for what we can expect at this point?

This is exactly why I wrote Tesla to tell them they screwed up in not offering a P85D and a P85D+ to parallel the old P85 and P85+.

So much confusion now. So someone could order a P85D with 19" rims, no tech package and coil suspension... so those same people really want/need/pay for the sport/tuned features of the P85+ ?

randompersonx said:

since clearly the p85d is no longer the p85+ replacement it was originally.

Click to expand...

I think it still is the P85+ with D, but they're just now allowing people to de-tune it.

randompersonx said:

How can we go about getting an official answer for what we can expect at this point?

Click to expand...

I think the only answer will be that Tesla realizes this and breaks out the + features into a separate option package.

As I am new here, perhaps others are more familiar with the history. Did the + require air suspension and 21's?

Perhaps then the only way you get the tuned suspension now is if you have those two options?

How noticeable of a difference was the + suspension to the regular p85 with 21's and the air suspension?

I am coming from driving exclusively sporty cars my whole life, and the last thing I want is a floaty suspension. I am expecting something on par with a porsche Panamera.

randompersonx said:

As I am new here, perhaps others are more familiar with the history. Did the + require air suspension and 21's?

Perhaps then the only way you get the tuned suspension now is if you have those two options?

How noticeable of a difference was the + suspension to the regular p85 with 21's and the air suspension?

I am coming from driving exclusively sporty cars my whole life, and the last thing I want is a floaty suspension. I am expecting something on par with a porsche Panamera.

Click to expand...

Welcome to the forum. Yes, the P85+ did require the air suspension and 21" staggered rims (245frt/265rear). It also had a tuned suspension and upgraded suspension parts (I forget which ones), but some people have been able to "plus-ify" their P85 into P85+ by added these parts and rims.

The difference between the + and the P85 is very noticeable if you're used to powerful sport sedans. My other car is a 2002 BMW M5, and I found the P85+ to handle in a similar fashion to the M5.

I think most people coming from a different car to the Model S, and particularly the P85+ are totally WOWED and floored by the acceleration and the handling.. but for me, coming from an M5, it was more like "that's real nice!" . Of course, the P85+ totally kills in 0-60 acceleration, but you can tell the top end falls back compared to the M5 which still has plenty of pulling power at higher speeds. But how often am I driving that fast? Almost never. This past week I've been taking my M5 out for a bit just to keep it running and not sit, and still, compared to the P85+, it's still a blast to drive (but no, not nearly as much as the P85+).

I drove a P85 during my first test drive, with 19" all-season tires, and it was "floaty" compared to the M5.. but when I went back for the second test drive in a P85+.. wow, nice and firm and a good feel for the road. Now I didn't drive a MS with coil springs, so I can't compare that to the air suspension. But I'm very happy with the P85+. I feel no compelling need to upgrade to the "D" (as I'll be using the M5 with winter tires for driving in the snow).

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Also, in order to save money on tires, I de-staggared my rims, so I now have 8.5" rims all around and 245/45/21s tires (Hankook Ventus) so I can rotate the tires and not spend $500 per tire replacement. Car still handles pretty much the same as the Pilot Sport OEM tires.

HankLloydRight said:

I drove a P85 during my first test drive, with 19" all-season tires, and it was "floaty" compared to the M5.. but when I went back for the second test drive in a P85+.. wow, nice and firm and a good feel for the road..

Click to expand...

i've had my P85 for almost two years now. unfortunately the + package came out just a few months after I got my P85.

i was happy with my car, until i got a P85+ as a loaner. WOW. like a different car entirely. no squat/dive/lean like in my car. just pure point and shoot. it felt like the car weighed 1,000lbs less than my P85. i know it doesn't, but that's exactly what it felt like.

can't wait for my P85D!!!

I wonder if there's any chance that the P85+ was a more "extreme" tune than the D will be.
Clearly the D will out accelerate it and All wheel drive is theoretically good for handling.
Curious as to whether the 85+ will be superior in any way.

Vitaman said:

I wonder if there's any chance that the P85+ was a more "extreme" tune than the D will be.
Clearly the D will out accelerate it and All wheel drive is theoretically good for handling.
Curious as to whether the 85+ will be superior in any way.

Click to expand...

Look for the P85D+ to be announced in February?

svp6 said:

It also reveals the price for the next generation seats - $3,500. A bare-bone P85D is now 105,570 instead of 120,170

Click to expand...

Maybe not. Consider that w/o "next gen" seats chosen, the ordinary leather does not yield the new -3.5k drop. Just dropping to textile does. My guess is 14.6k for the P's 'D' option (and perhaps P85 trade values) may be impacting their order targets? For instance, you don't get it by dropping leather on an S85.

Not a big fan of air, or 21's. May consider.

Did range on P85D also increase as part of this change? its now 285miles on US-site and 460km on Norwegian-site... I believe it was 275/440 when the D was announced...

Due to 21" not being mandatory?

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bollar said:

Look for the P85D+ to be announced in February?

Click to expand...

I do assume that the + is what is now referred to as this in the design studio!?

specially designed suspension for exceptional power and handling

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Has anyone configured a car now to compare the price? A few days ago I built a P85D and it seemed that it was cheaper when the tech package and air suspension were automatically included. Now that you have to select those options it seems more expensive than before.