Iceland's Hydrogen Power

tonybelding · Jun 7, 2007

Not progressing as many had hoped. . .

http://www.theworld.org/?q=node/10628

It appears they have one hydrogen fueling station, no cars, and the hydrogen buses they had been using for a while have been retired -- with one placed in a transportation museum. And yet, the report makes no mention of any alternatives -- nothing about battery-electric cars. I Googled for older articles about Iceland and hydrogen, and I found a lot of "hydrogen hype" articles, but again never the briefest mention of BEVs. It's a pretty big blind spot they seem to have over in Iceland.

I have heard an argument saying that Hawaii would be the most perfect place to sell electric cars. Gasoline is quite expensive there, and the usual range limitations of electric cars are no concern at all, since you can't drive off the islands anyhow. I don't think Hawaii has invested as heavily as Iceland in geothermal power, but they are producing some (http://www1.eere.energy.gov/geothermal/hawaii.html), and the potential is obvious.

TEG · Jun 7, 2007

Hawaii has some activity, but it hasn't really caught on:

http://kauaian.net/blog/?p=351
http://www.htdc.org/hcatt/ev-ready.asp

Brent · Aug 24, 2007

I visited (Photo1) the station back in 2003 -- when I was still looking forward to a hydrogen future -- and bought a few items from the convenience store located nearer the gasoline area. The hydrogen area was actually kinda neat to see. I believe the hydrogen was generated on site, with a small "factory" behind, and the pump itself had a futuristic tinge to it.

Physics aside, if Iceland can't make hydrogen happen, I'm not sure it can happen anywhere. The country has access to cheap electricity from its geothermal and hydro plants, and has a small but wealthy population that seems to be focused on finding green solutions to many problems.

Incidentally, the Blanda Power station was among the most unusual I've seen: Photo2

Brando · Dec 31, 2018

@KarenRei Hope you find and have time to read and comment.

Iceland Hydrogen Energy programs started about 60 or 70 years ago. (note: phase 2 1965)

https://www.researchgate.net/public...l_technological_and_commercial_story_of_ECTOS

For understanding the political conditions for implementation of hydrogen energy in
Iceland it is important to take a look at this country’s development of energy utilisation.
The Icelandic Ministry of Industry and Commerce divides this into five distinct phases
(Pétursson and Bjarnarson, 2004):

• First phase – until the 1970s
• Electrification of the country was the main task (mainly by hydroelectric power)
• Harnessing most of the accessible geothermal fields
• Second phase – after 1965
• Development of power intensive industry
• Third phase – after 1973/1974
• Replacement of fossil oil by renewable energy resources
(hydro and geothermal), especially for space heating
• Fourth phase – after 1995
• Further increase in power intensive industry
• Fifth phase – after 2000
• Work towards a sustainable hydrogen economy.

Freyr Sverrisson, a native Icelander, is an independent energy policy consultant in the United States.
Industrial electrical power in Iceland has been developed for the Aluminium Industry. Which is a big part of the
Missing in Action: Iceland's Hydrogen Economy [60-70 years of Iceland Hydrogen economy development]
Missing in Action: Iceland's Hydrogen Economy | Worldwatch Institute

KarenRei · Feb 17, 2019

Hydrogen is basically dead here.

Tölfræði

(hydrogen = vetni).

There used to be a H2 filling station on Miklabraut that I used to drive past every day. It was always empty. A couple years ago it got swapped out for a DC charging station, and it's much busier

We have the second-highest EV adoption rate in the world (albeit 3/4ths of them are PHEVs**). Our city buses are in the process of being swapped out for electric.

** - In the above chart, "rafmagn" (or "raf." for short) means electric, while "tengiltvinn" (or just "tengill" for short) means "plug-in hybrid".

SageBrush · Feb 17, 2019

KarenRei said:
We have the second-highest EV adoption rate in the world (albeit 3/4ths of them are PHEVs**).

About 12% of new cars if I am counting correctly

KarenRei · Feb 17, 2019

SageBrush said:
About 12% of new cars if I am counting correctly

Yep. And without no Tesla presence here

When Tesla gets here, the rate is going to go through the roof.

Our government plans to outlaw all ICE sales (unless the owner can prove a "necessity" case for their particular usage) by 2030. And thereafter, the plan is to steadily increase the minimum emissions standards for vehicles already on the road when it comes to renewals, to steadily push existing ICE vehicles off the roads.

Our incentives are Norway-like. No VAT or pollution fees on EVs (up to a certain limit), which amounts to ~40% or so of the purchase price on a typical comparative car like a BMW 3-series.

SageBrush · Feb 17, 2019

KarenRei said:
Our incentives are Norway-like. No VAT or pollution fees on EVs (up to a certain limit), which amounts to ~40% or so of the purchase price on a typical comparative car like a BMW 3-series.

Does that mean that a 40k EV costs the same as a 24k ICE ?
If so I don't understand why plug-in sales are only 12% since electricity is presumably much cheaper than petrol.

Addendum:
Petrol is about 1.6 Euro a liter so about 12 Euro cents a km for a small, fuel 'efficient' ICE
Electric about 15 Euro cents a kWh so about 2.5 Euro cents a km

KarenRei · Feb 17, 2019

SageBrush said:
Does that mean that a 40k EV costs the same as a 24k ICE ?
If so I don't understand why plug-in sales are only 12% since electricity is presumably much cheaper than petrol.

Well, until a year ago we didn't even have DC chargers outside the capitol region. Our highest power is 50kW, and we're roughly tied with Australia for 2nd/3rd lowest population density in the world (only Mongolia is lower) - driving distances are long. And while our speed limits are very low (90kph / 56mph), we also have long winters, mountainous terrain, and powerful storms.

By global standards, 12% is a great figure. It's only going to keep growing. The high charging powers, long ranges, and high efficiencies of the Model 3 will do wonders here, and the fact that you can get it in AWD will be extremely popular.

SageBrush · Feb 17, 2019

KarenRei said:
Well, until a year ago we didn't even have DC chargers outside the capitol region. Our highest power is 50kW, and we're roughly tied with Australia for 2nd/3rd lowest population density in the world (only Mongolia is lower) - driving distances are long. And while our speed limits are very low (90kph / 56mph), we also have long winters, mountainous terrain, and powerful storms.

By global standards, 12% is a great figure. It's only going to keep growing. The high charging powers, long ranges, and high efficiencies of the Model 3 will do wonders here, and the fact that you can get it in AWD will be extremely popular.

Fair enough, although I was admittedly thinking of the Reykjavik population. Do most people in the city have access to convenient L2 charging ?

KarenRei · Feb 17, 2019

SageBrush said:
Fair enough, although I was admittedly thinking of the Reykjavik population. Do most people in the city have access to convenient L2 charging ?

No, city charging needs a lot of improvement (most people live in apartments and have no L2 access). Our city government is obsessed with trying to force people out of cars, so while they ostensibly support electric cars (and are making good progress on bus electrification), that falls second to trying to make cars so inconvenient that they'll be forced not to use them.

Brando · Feb 17, 2019

KarenRei said:
No, city charging needs a lot of improvement (most people live in apartments and have no L2 access). Our city government is obsessed with trying to force people out of cars, so while they ostensibly support electric cars (and are making good progress on bus electrification), that falls second to trying to make cars so inconvenient that they'll be forced not to use them.

rent & share - save a lot
Come to US to any metro area and see how car culture destroys city life.

SageBrush · Feb 17, 2019

KarenRei said:
No, city charging needs a lot of improvement (most people live in apartments and have no L2 access). Our city government is obsessed with trying to force people out of cars, so while they ostensibly support electric cars (and are making good progress on bus electrification), that falls second to trying to make cars so inconvenient that they'll be forced not to use them.

The law of unintended consequences strikes again.

KarenRei · Feb 17, 2019

SageBrush said:
The law of unintended consequences strikes again.

It's a law of being forced to choose between liberals who dream of banning cars and conservatives who want to redirect government assets to their families :Þ We've had a few minor parties who've sought to do neither but they've never really gained traction. The mainstream liberal parties all fall into the first category, the conservatives in the latter, and the various populist and moderate parties to one or the other - rarely ever neither.

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Iceland's Hydrogen Power

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