KNDI Investment discussion

kevin99 · Sep 23, 2013

As a speculative play, I think KNDI is attractive. It is the most relevant stock with the theme of "EV in China", which I speculate will have a wide ride in the next 3-6 months.

I've been building up the position and it is doing very well. It is sort of validating my approach how to start small on a speculative stock and go big until proven right. The same approach I employed with TSLA. It is never a big bet and then wait for one year to see if you lose it all or get 10X return.

In fact my KNDI position is doing too well that I am guilty not to devote enough time to take better advantage of it.

In my test account with OptionHouse, I have seed money of $5000, which I grow to $50,000 by TSLA within 2 months. Then I put the money to KNDI and the account value is $85,000 now.

Since it is a small account, buying call is all I did.

In my main account, I did a lot of combination by selling OTM put, Selling In the money put, and buying calls as well. All of them did very well for Sep. August was not so good but it is a small loss. Again go big until proven right.

[Mod Note: This thread carved out of Short-Term-TSLA-Price-Movements]

Convert2013 · Sep 23, 2013

kevin99 said:
As a speculative play, I think KNDI is attractive. It is the most relevant stock with the theme of "EV in China", which I speculate will have a wide ride in the next 3-6 months.

I've been building up the position and it is doing very well. It is sort of validating my approach how to start small on a speculative stock and go big until proven right. The same approach I employed with TSLA. It is never a big bet and then wait for one year to see if you lose it all or get 10X return.

In fact my KNDI position is doing too well that I am guilty not to devote enough time to take better advantage of it.

In my test account with OptionHouse, I have seed money of $5000, which I grow to $50,000 by TSLA within 2 months. Then I put the money to KNDI and the account value is $85,000 now.

View attachment 31238

Since it is a small account, buying call is all I did.

In my main account, I did a lot of combination by selling OTM put, Selling In the money put, and buying calls as well. All of them did very well for Sep. August was not so good but it is a small loss. Again go big until proven right.

KNDI is a good buy. Smart thinking.

gene · Sep 23, 2013

kevin99 said:
As a speculative play, I think KNDI is attractive. It is the most relevant stock with the theme of "EV in China", which I speculate will have a wide ride in the next 3-6 months.

I've been building up the position and it is doing very well. It is sort of validating my approach how to start small on a speculative stock and go big until proven right. The same approach I employed with TSLA. It is never a big bet and then wait for one year to see if you lose it all or get 10X return.

In fact my KNDI position is doing too well that I am guilty not to devote enough time to take better advantage of it.

In my test account with OptionHouse, I have seed money of $5000, which I grow to $50,000 by TSLA within 2 months. Then I put the money to KNDI and the account value is $85,000 now.

View attachment 31238

Since it is a small account, buying call is all I did.

In my main account, I did a lot of combination by selling OTM put, Selling In the money put, and buying calls as well. All of them did very well for Sep. August was not so good but it is a small loss. Again go big until proven right.

Kevin, I just gave KNDI a try, I was dying to buy something today.

kevin99 · Sep 23, 2013

gene said:
Kevin, I just gave KNDI a try, I was dying to buy something today.

Owoh gene, start small until proven right!

I don't know what you did by 'giving a try',

Did you buy shares? Selling In The Money put is probably a better trade at this time, which I did earlier today. i.e. I sold Oct KNDI @7.5 for $1.4 today. That means i will lose money only if it drops below $6.1, that is the margin of error I've been talking about.

- - - Updated - - -

ckessel said:
Damn, the more I read about LEAPS the sadder I am I didn't know 2 years ago when I put my money into the stock . There was a pretty clear points at first deliveries and again at first profitable quarter that if hit would send things skyward. Now it's less clear, the stock is heavily valued on future things already.

I think it is important to remember what was your thought process at that moment 2 years ago, and not right now after all the facts have been played out.

I suspect 2 years ago most people are worried about Tesla will go bankrupt, no matter how good the cars they are producing. They will be burning cash too fast that they wouldn't be able to make it profitable and then go under, the sort of doom picture the naysayers been painting.

The only dependable evidence did not come until Q4 ER 2012, in which Elon declared Tesla will have a profitable quarter in Q1. Amazingly most people does not pay attention, or not willing to believe that. Perhaps when people in the down mode for too long, it takes more than a declaration to shift the sentiment.

On the contrary, I was fortunate not to be bothered by the doom theory as I was just getting started. Having test drove the car gives me a lot of confidence. Then all signs are coming together this is one epic storm in the forming.

- - - Updated - - -

TSLAopt said:
thanks, I thought so but glad you've vetted him already...I just hope this place doesn't get spammed with so many trolls ever that its hard for new legitimate investors to decipher. The yahoo stock message boards I use to read years ago but there are so many trolls in there now they are useless now to look at for most stocks.

Isn't there a way to give these trolls negative feedback so that if they get enough from different people it either bans them from forum or puts some label on their username signaling their bad feedback?

Add them to your ignore list!

kevin99 · Sep 23, 2013

gene said:
Kevin, I'm a buy TSLA common and hold long kinda' guy. Bulk of my TSLA was around $35, I've continued to buy all the way up to $160. When I met you at the factory, TSLA was $99. My overall average is at $70 right now. I love watching this thread for the info I can garner on it, but I don't do any short-term/options. I probably should, but I'm lazy to learn and afraid I'd make mistakes. I bought a measly $3,000 worth of KNDI common. Mostly 'cause I felt the urge to have something fun to watch!
.

Oh my god gene, you just made a great trade! You certainly did better than me in one hour. It is above $7 now.

. You do get something exciting to watch now...

In the longer run, like in 2 weeks or a month, I will probably still win the race...

kevin99 · Sep 24, 2013

kevin99 said:
Oh my god gene, you just made a great trade! You certainly did better than me in one hour. It is above $7 now.. You do get something exciting to watch now...

In the longer run, like in 2 weeks or a month, I will probably still win the race...

Holy smoke, KNDI is already $8. Gene you certainly had a great trade.

My account value rise from $84k to $140k in one day! It is an account intent to test Optionhouse's execution, but the money is as real as any $140k.

kevin99 said:
As a speculative play, I think KNDI is attractive. It is the most relevant stock with the theme of "EV in China", which I speculate will have a wide ride in the next 3-6 months.

I've been building up the position and it is doing very well. It is sort of validating my approach how to start small on a speculative stock and go big until proven right. The same approach I employed with TSLA. It is never a big bet and then wait for one year to see if you lose it all or get 10X return.

In fact my KNDI position is doing too well that I am guilty not to devote enough time to take better advantage of it.

In my test account with OptionHouse, I have seed money of $5000, which I grow to $50,000 by TSLA within 2 months. Then I put the money to KNDI and the account value is $85,000 now.

View attachment 31238

Since it is a small account, buying call is all I did.

In my main account, I did a lot of combination by selling OTM put, Selling In the money put, and buying calls as well. All of them did very well for Sep. August was not so good but it is a small loss. Again go big until proven right.

borat99 · Sep 24, 2013

kevin99 said:
Holy smoke, KNDI is already $8. Gene you certainly had a great trade.

My account value rise from $84k to $140k in one day! It is an account intent to test Optionhouse's execution, but the money is as real as any $140k.

Yeah, is this another TSLA or what? I added a position yesterday after Gene said he jumped it. Great stock pick! Thanks!

sleepyhead · Sep 24, 2013

kevin99 said:
Holy smoke, KNDI is already $8. Gene you certainly had a great trade.

My account value rise from $84k to $140k in one day! It is an account intent to test Optionhouse's execution, but the money is as real as any $140k.

View attachment 31300

I would be taking my profits right about now if I were you.

hoang51 · Sep 24, 2013

KNDI is quite interesting over the past week. I'd probably buy puts just for the heck of it. It shot up too much and is screaming for a pullback before shooting for the moon again.

kevin99 · Sep 24, 2013

sleepyhead said:
I would be taking my profits right about now if I were you.

It is a small account of mine. I don't have the energy to time it out and in. Besides, I am going for double digit, and I have Dec and even next year for it. Call me greedy, but the "EV in China" theme is too big to count the money. Let the Tesla storm play out in China, and carry all these little guys with it.

sleepyhead · Sep 24, 2013

kevin99 said:
It is a small account of mine. I don't have the energy to time it out and in. Besides, I am going for double digit, and I have Dec and even next year for it. Call me greedy, but the "EV in China" theme is too big to count the money. Let the Tesla storm play out in China, and carry all these little guys with it.

Kevin - Can you PM me some reading on KNDI? One or two good articles on it would be sufficient. I don't really have the time to start studying a whole new industry.

What kind of growth is KNDI expecting? Are their cars any good? Do they need to raise capital, etc.?

ckessel said:
Point taken. Things before the Q3 report seem sort of, well, unknowable I guess. The Q3 report should be more of a known catalyst for those of us obsessively reading threads here each day. I was wondering more about when it makes sense to position for the Q3 results.

Whenever you think is a good time. I started positioning myself for Q3 a week ago when TSLA was consolidating in the $160s. I will position myself further during the next pullback. It is a constant ongoing theme for me, and my strategy is very flexible depending on the movements of TSLA.

Convert2013 · Sep 24, 2013

borat99 said:
Yeah, is this another TSLA or what? I added a position yesterday after Gene said he jumped it. Great stock pick! Thanks!

Kandi is no Tesla for sure. They make small electric cars for China's home market (which is huge) and is the largest EV maker in China. Considering the massive subsidies just announced by the Chinese Govt for EVs (don't forget their pollution problem), KNDI is a play for sure in my mind... they will likely enjoy the EV wave.

kevin99 · Sep 24, 2013

sleepyhead said:
Kevin - Can you PM me some reading on KNDI? One or two good articles on it would be sufficient. I don't really have the time to start studying a whole new industry.

What kind of growth is KNDI expecting? Are their cars any good? Do they need to raise capital, etc.?

Alright I started a topic on my site. I add some background and my theory:

Kandi Technologies - A speculative play for the EV in China wave | Investnaire: Focused Investing to Millionaire

gene · Sep 24, 2013

kevin99 said:
Holy smoke, KNDI is already $8. Gene you certainly had a great trade.

Thanks Kevin, I wish I had bought much more!

Mario Kadastik · Sep 24, 2013

Well I opened a very minor position in KNDI (or well am waiting for the orders to complete) by selling the 7.5 Jan'15 put for 3.55 and buying the Jan '15 7.5 call for 2.5. This way I'm $1 in credit meaning it's as if I had bought KNDI at $6.5 for me to come net zero, max downside is $650, upside however is unlimited at this point. I've started with a really small position and plan to monitor how it goes possibly adding as I go along

bhuwan · Sep 24, 2013

Thanks for the info Kevin. I'm hoping to get in shortly.

tftf · Sep 24, 2013

I would invite everyone to check the numbers (and read up in general on auditors, ownership structure and the history of Chinese reverse mergers listed on US stock markets) before investing real money in KNDI.

A starting point may be here, also includes links to other sources for further reading:

Kandi Technologies: Weighing The Evidence - Forbes

It may all be true, but it may also be too good to be true...I don't know, I would just be extra careful.

PS: And just to be clear, I have no position in KNDI nor won't touch this stock long or short.

gene · Sep 24, 2013

I don't have the nerve to put substantial money into KNDI yet. I only know of it because Kevin mentioned it yesterday and I was itching to buy something! I only bought a few thousand dollars worth. Maybe there will be an opportunity for more tomorrow with a pull-back.

borat99 · Sep 24, 2013

gene said:
I don't have the nerve to put substantial money into KNDI yet. I only know of it because Kevin mentioned it yesterday and I was itching to buy something! I only bought a few thousand dollars worth. Maybe there will be an opportunity for more tomorrow with a pull-back.

I bought calls yesterday when I saw your post saying you just picked up some. Got nervous this morning and closed the position with a 64% gain. No complains. I may get in again when things are calmer.

Bonken · Sep 24, 2013

I have been holding a small position in KNDI since they were trading around $3,50 mark. It is very speculative as it is hard to get a real understanding of the chinese market and what information is actually true and what is just completely made up. However, if the information is somewhat true and they can achieve only half of what they say they will, this will be an explosive stock within the next couple of years and I am willing to bet a small portion of my portfolio on it as the reward could be tremendous.

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