Help with Charging in Manhattan

Jack · Apr 25, 2013

I'm a Boston MS owner who would like to find a way to charge in NYC during theater hours - without paying $3/Hr to charge and with the ability to self-park the car (no one else driving my MS). In Boston, all garages with ChargePoint stations are self-park with free charging, as well as choice parking spots. Does anything like that exist in Manhattan? Beam parking seems to be $3/Hour everywhere, which is essetnially $3/20 miles of range, which is worse than an ICE car. Everyone else i've called off the chargepoint site requires valet parking.

I'd really appreciate help from anyone local.

Thanks.

yobigd20 · Apr 25, 2013

Jack said:
I'm a Boston MS owner who would like to find a way to charge in NYC during theater hours - without paying $3/Hr to charge and with the ability to self-park the car (no one else driving my MS). In Boston, all garages with ChargePoint stations are self-park with free charging, as well as choice parking spots. Does anything like that exist in Manhattan? Beam parking seems to be $3/Hour everywhere, which is essetnially $3/20 miles of range, which is worse than an ICE car. Everyone else i've called off the chargepoint site requires valet parking.

I'd really appreciate help from anyone local.

Thanks.

There are no self-park garages in all of NYC. Ok, well maybe there's like 3. But there is also no free charging anywhere in NYC. Everything is Chargepoint or Beam at $2.95/hr, not including the already ridiculous parking rates themselves. So you're basically completely out of luck. NYC is not EV friendly. Garages even charge a higher 'luxury rate' for Tesla. One garage told me that "normal cars" were $450/month parking, but a Tesla Model S would cost me $850/month as that is the same "luxury rate" they give their Maserati's and Jags. See that $15 early bird special? Not for you, it's $23 early bird special for you and your luxury car. Yeah...that's NYC. Not EV friendly and not big/luxury car friendly.

AprilDelivery?? · Apr 25, 2013

Charge at Tesla Store on 511 W.25 st. , 10th ave and w.25 st.

JohnQ · Apr 26, 2013

AprilDelivery?? said:
Charge at Tesla Store on 511 W.25 st. , 10th ave and w.25 st.

Call ahead first, there were some issues with the parking lot management there (don't recall where that thread is). In addition, you can always stop at the Milford SC on the way down so you won't need to worry about charging in Manhattan. Costs you some extra time, though.

Check out Jim's thread about his NE road trip, there's some information about charging in NYC as well. Not sure where the charger was and I believe he had to pay. As someone above said, welcome to Manhattan.
East Coast Model S Road-Trip: Eight States and Two Six-Strings, a Father and his Son

EdA · Apr 27, 2013

Call the Tesla store and speak with the manager, he'll provide hints on where to charge.

Jack · Apr 28, 2013

Thanks for the comments above.

Had quite a day yesterday, with the EV rally in Westport, dinner and show in NYC, and back to Boston after the show.

Here are some notes on my experience:

- Most garages in NYC are as indicated above - not EV friendly, and not Tesla friendly - and we should all boycott Beam - the net price is more than for petrol
- There are exceptions - i found a garage on 24th street and 6th that has two free 1772s and was reasonably civil on the phone - and would allow self-park as the 1772's were at the entrance - this was very close - but they insisted on leaving the keys, and cars were crammed so close i didn't feel ok with that - but its a consideration - also, there is a list of 30 or so self-park garages, such as port authority - don't recall the link, but easy to find
- I ended up using the Tesla store's garage, and this time they were reasonable friendly (last time very nasty - seems like one employee there) - they allowed me to self-park (hard 90 degrees against a stone wall with a large utility truck next to the tesla spot - but it worked ok and was able to top off in just over two hours (charged to 250, slightly over normal, but not range)
- Spent some time in the NY store - THEY NEED A NEW DOOR - they have more than enough space for their demo car and 3 customer cars, but the S doesn't fit throught the door due to it's architecture - cmon George - this one is a no-brainer for the store and NE customers!
- The store is ok with a few hours of usage, but needs the spot back at night for charging for demos - especially on the weekend - good news is garage doesn't charge your $44 if you use the Tesla slot, which was great - Paul and Ken were most helpful
- After charging and having dinner at the Half King (pretty good pub food), we found that several blocks in NYC open for parking at 7PM free of charge - e.g., 50th between 8th and 10th - which is convenient to theatre. So our routine is now charging in Milford (or soon to be Darien), topping off on 25th street, and heading uptown to park
- After theater, we had 241 miles rated for our trip back to the PRM. On the Merritt, i told my wife we'd land with 15 miles. Had to set cruise to 67 to be safe, but better than going up 95 or topping off at Auburn 1772's. We pulled into the garage with 13 miles - and put the car in park - and just then the low battery warning presented - just perfect! If i range charged, would have made Boston city.
- Met a CT DOT guy at Westport - he was raving about how great it was to work with Tesla - he was the initiator of Milford, and indicated we'll see a Darien station by fall - as Milford usage is up - and likely to see reservations for charging slots soon

yobigd20 · Apr 28, 2013

Jack said:
Most garages in NYC are as indicated above - not EV friendly, and not Tesla friendly - and we should all boycott Beam - the net price is more than for petrol

I actually think Beam's rates are good compared to the standard Chargepoint rates in NYC.

Beam's per hour rate is $2.95/hr which you're right, seems pretty crappy. But AFAIK that's still cheaper than pretty much all chargepoint stations in NYC. They all charge $0.49/kWh. A single charger in the M.S. connected to J1772@30amp which is most of NYC will use about 6.8kWh per hour. That's $3.36/hr using chargepoint stations. So Beam is actually cheaper than the Chargepoint. If you daily drive in, Beam's unlimited charging monthly is $98/month. And that is very good if you have a long commute. Even better if you can completely charge there (e.g. don't charge at home).

From my house to NYC is just over 100 miles, and I'll use up a good 40kWh of battery to get there (too much to get there and back on a *standard* charge). So far I've done this twice. Only 2 times I've ever used chargepoint. My acct is showing 96.1 kWh used to charge total, so approx 48kWh pulled per trip there. That makes sense since charging efficiency is estimated to be around 84%, (actually that's pretty much spot on, 84%*48kWh wall = 40.32kWh battery).

Anywho, using chargepoint it would cost me $23.52 to "fill up" at 0.49 per kWh for 48kWh. However, at 30 amps it takes exactly 7 hours to complete. Using beam, that would be 7 hours * $2.95=$20.65. So beam is cheaper.

Jack said:
There are exceptions - i found a garage on 24th street and 6th that has two free 1772s and was reasonably civil on the phone - and would allow self-park as the 1772's were at the entrance - this was very close - but they insisted on leaving the keys, and cars were crammed so close i didn't feel ok with that - but its a consideration

I'm assuming no tip then if self parked? I might take advantage of that next time I'm up there... do you think they'd be ok with a daily commuter self-parking and plugging in for 8 hrs 5 days a week?

Jack said:
also, there is a list of 30 or so self-park garages, such as port authority - don't recall the link, but easy to find

yeah i've seen it, but they're all pretty much 30th and below or north of 65th. http://parkitnyc.com/parking-nyc/nyc-parking-garages/self-parking-nyc/ sucks really for any commuters coming from NJ that work in midtown. besides, I doubt any of those garages has EV outlets, let alone free electric vehicle charging.

Jack · Apr 29, 2013

Thanks for the info Yobi.

I believe the 24th street j1772's are free - said so on Chargepoint, and confirmed when calling the garage. Spots were right next to the entrance like they said. However, quite cramped - makes me nervous. They would let me park, but i had to leave the keys which was not ok. Different perspective when you come in only for theatre on Saturday rather than day-to-day. Many more options.

Found on street free parking on 50th street at 7PM - however, i was 15 feet from the hydrant and they gave me a ticket for $115 and claimed 8 feet - i think you're right about prejudice against high end cars - hey - would you be willing to be a witness for me on that (if so, please send private email) - i can send pictures - really pissed me off - last time they gave me a ticket for not paying when i had the pay slip right where is was supposed to be - that one was overturned.

I've now gone about 2 months without using my home HPW - 100% of charging stations up here in the people's republic are free - charging at Logan now, pays for the parking. Best you can do is move to Boston!

Smallfootprint · Apr 29, 2013

Jack said:
Thanks for the info Yobi.

I believe the 24th street j1772's are free - said so on Chargepoint, and confirmed when calling the garage. Spots were right next to the entrance like they said. However, quite cramped - makes me nervous. They would let me park, but i had to leave the keys which was not ok. Different perspective when you come in only for theatre on Saturday rather than day-to-day. Many more options.

Found on street free parking on 50th street at 7PM - however, i was 15 feet from the hydrant and they gave me a ticket for $115 and claimed 8 feet - i think you're right about prejudice against high end cars - hey - would you be willing to be a witness for me on that (if so, please send private email) - i can send pictures - really pissed me off - last time they gave me a ticket for not paying when i had the pay slip right where is was supposed to be - that one was overturned.

I've now gone about 2 months without using my home HPW - 100% of charging stations up here in the people's republic are free - charging at Logan now, pays for the parking. Best you can do is move to Boston!

I have an apartment on 50th street and have parked the performance Model S around here many times and never been ticketed. If there is discrimination, I'm guessing it's against out of state license plates rather than luxury cars in general. In fact, the local police on horseback have given me the thumbs up when they saw me driving by silently.

RDoc · Apr 29, 2013

One comment on the cost of charging. IMHO it's perfectly reasonable to be charged as much for EV power as gasoline. We need the infrastructure and it's not going to be built unless there's a profit motive. As it is now, there are so few EVs on the road that charging stations are more of a good will effort and/or because of government grants than to make any money. What's being paid for really isn't the power, it's the convenience.

yobigd20 · Apr 29, 2013

Jack said:
I believe the 24th street j1772's are free - said so on Chargepoint, and confirmed when calling the garage. Spots were right next to the entrance like they said. However, quite cramped - makes me nervous. They would let me park, but i had to leave the keys which was not ok. Different perspective when you come in only for theatre on Saturday rather than day-to-day. Many more options.

Yea I'm actually parked there right now and frankly I'll never park there again. First, he said I needed to stay until he parked it so I can plug it in which it took a good 15 minutes. it took a while because there was 2 cars blocking the spots that they had to move. Second, he couldn't figure out how to turn the car on (he wouldn't let me park it, btw he couldn't figure out how to "turn it off"). When he was parking it, maaaaan is it ever close. He kept going forward and backward until it was as close as humanly possible to the railing. Probably about a centimeter or two. WAAAY to close for my comfort. When I was just joking around saying "wow you really park close in here" he was like "yup gotta cram as many cars in here as possible". He also kept the key. Finally, I arrived at about 7:57am but first he waited until about 8:02am to go over to the machine and print out the ticket for me (while waiting for the other 2 cars to be moved before he parked mine). Their "early bird" rate ends at 8:00, so instead of paying $23 now I have to pay $43. NEVER AGAIN will I use this garage. I just hope it isn't scraped by the time I get back to it or when he moves it out when I leave.

Jack · Apr 29, 2013

RDoc said:
One comment on the cost of charging. IMHO it's perfectly reasonable to be charged as much for EV power as gasoline. We need the infrastructure and it's not going to be built unless there's a profit motive. As it is now, there are so few EVs on the road that charging stations are more of a good will effort and/or because of government grants than to make any money. What's being paid for really isn't the power, it's the convenience.

Perfectly rational and defensible argument. I respectfully disagree however, since the value prop for EV's is at least partially much lower operational cost. We're the ones doing the pioneering and there should be some percentage in it for us, so the subsidized charging stations are of great value. I've used the Tesla Superchargers on multiple occasions and appreciate Elon's commitment to keep them free for us. Being able to charge for free anywhere in downtown Boston in prime parking spots is a huge benefit of EV ownership.

- - - Updated - - -

yobigd20 said:
Yea I'm actually parked there right now and frankly I'll never park there again. First, he said I needed to stay until he parked it so I can plug it in which it took a good 15 minutes. it took a while because there was 2 cars blocking the spots that they had to move. Second, he couldn't figure out how to turn the car on (he wouldn't let me park it, btw he couldn't figure out how to "turn it off"). When he was parking it, maaaaan is it ever close. He kept going forward and backward until it was as close as humanly possible to the railing. Probably about a centimeter or two. WAAAY to close for my comfort. When I was just joking around saying "wow you really park close in here" he was like "yup gotta cram as many cars in here as possible". He also kept the key. Finally, I arrived at about 7:57am but first he waited until about 8:02am to go over to the machine and print out the ticket for me (while waiting for the other 2 cars to be moved before he parked mine). Their "early bird" rate ends at 8:00, so instead of paying $23 now I have to pay $43. NEVER AGAIN will I use this garage. I just hope it isn't scraped by the time I get back to it or when he moves it out when I leave.

Really sorry to hear of your experience and hope everything is ok when you get your car back. I became quite uncomfortable and did not leave my MS with them. You were right - no easy solution in NYC. Glad for what we have in Boston.

yobigd20 · Apr 29, 2013

Jack said:
Perfectly rational and defensible argument. I respectfully disagree however, since the value prop for EV's is at least partially much lower operational cost. We're the ones doing the pioneering and there should be some percentage in it for us, so the subsidized charging stations are of great value. I've used the Tesla Superchargers on multiple occasions and appreciate Elon's commitment to keep them free for us. Being able to charge for free anywhere in downtown Boston in prime parking spots is a huge benefit of EV ownership.

- - - Updated - - -

Really sorry to hear of your experience and hope everything is ok when you get your car back. I became quite uncomfortable and did not leave my MS with them. You were right - no easy solution in NYC. Glad for what we have in Boston.

car was fine btw. But the crammed parking was too close for my comfort Zone. I'll keep scouting out other places.

Galve2000 · Jun 13, 2013

yobigd20 said:
I actually think Beam's rates are good compared to the standard Chargepoint rates in NYC.

Beam's per hour rate is $2.95/hr which you're right, seems pretty crappy. But AFAIK that's still cheaper than pretty much all chargepoint stations in NYC. They all charge $0.49/kWh. A single charger in the M.S. connected to J1772@30amp which is most of NYC will use about 6.8kWh per hour. That's $3.36/hr using chargepoint stations. So Beam is actually cheaper than the Chargepoint. If you daily drive in, Beam's unlimited charging monthly is $98/month. And that is very good if you have a long commute. Even better if you can completely charge there (e.g. don't charge at home).

You are right that for a Model S with its 10 kW on-board charger the per-hour rate (even at $2.95) is cheaper than paying per kWh. In the past CarCharingInc. (chargepoint) was charging $3.00/hr and the meter stopped running after 6 hours so you could, in theory, get a full charge for $18. At least in my garage the vellets would probably unplug you agter 8 or 9 hours b/c the spots with the EVSE were prime spots where they left cars ready to be picked up, espcially during the morning rush. but anything over and above 6 hrs was free of charge which was very nice.

In february they switched to $0.49/kWh which is a more fair system b/c you pay for what you consume. The model S with its large battery capacity has to pay more to "fill up" -- so yes, Beam, with their redicilous per hr rate is cheaper.

znino · Jun 13, 2013

Jack said:
Thanks for the comments above.

- I ended up using the Tesla store's garage, and this time they were reasonable friendly (last time very nasty - seems like one employee there) - they allowed me to self-park (hard 90 degrees against a stone wall with a large utility truck next to the tesla spot - but it worked ok and was able to top off in just over two hours (charged to 250, slightly over normal, but not range)

Can you tell me what type of setup they have at the store in the parking garage? How many amp? Which charger? In other words, how many miles can i expect to put back per hour of charge if i have the twin chargers on my MS? I will be traveling from Montreal to NYV this August and, after topping off in Albany, i will really need to recharge to full in NYC for the trip back. Any other tips on where to park overnight, potentially with a charger in Manhattan would be welcome information.

DFibRL8R · Jul 29, 2013

Does anyone have any knowledge of/experience with the 3 NYC area fast chargers listed on plug share? 2 in Manhatten look like they were set up for NYC Taxis but public can use. One is in Flushing NY at a 7-11. I will be travelling through NY in August and am trying to plan my route accordingly. Not sure if the fast charger can work with the Model S (J-1772 versus CHademo).

yobigd20 · Jul 29, 2013

DFibRL8R said:
Does anyone have any knowledge of/experience with the 3 NYC area fast chargers listed on plug share? 2 in Manhatten look like they were set up for NYC Taxis but public can use. One is in Flushing NY at a 7-11. I will be travelling through NY in August and am trying to plan my route accordingly. Not sure if the fast charger can work with the Model S (J-1772 versus CHademo).

They are Chademo so no, the Model S cannot use it. You're best bet is one of the public charge point stations. There's a few free ones scattered around the city. U need a charge point card.

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DFibRL8R · Aug 20, 2013

I'm planning a drive from Virginia through Manhattan tomorrow and I called the Tesla store to see if I could use their outlet for a few hours during the day. I was told Tesla owners may not use the 14-50 outlet since it is in a private garage with restricted access. This is unlike every other Tesla store in the US which advertise access for owners (in fact Tesla's website lists access to chargers by owners for all locations but not Manhattan). I see other posters on this thread have successfully charged there so this may be a matter of who answers the phone at Tesla or a change in policy.

SamGarber · Oct 22, 2013

Well, I am going to be driving to Manhattan tomorrow for work! Will be nice to get mileage expense return with no gas spent. I prepared by getting a bit of gratuitous juice from a Nissan dealer today and the rest from the HPWC. I plan to park near my destination at the garage for Roosevelt Hospital. It says there is a "free" J1772 there, so hopefully it is not ICEd or taken when I get there. Work is paying for parking, so should be free if I can hook in. Either way, I am planning for the worst and making sure I have enough charge to get back! Sure wish they had that Edison SuperCharger already...

EdA · Oct 22, 2013

Sam,

Might want to recon the nearby Tesla locations (SC's/sales) for a charge in case you need something...

/Ed

Help with Charging in Manhattan

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