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Thread: Climate Change / Global Warming Discussion

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    Senior Member SwedishAdvocate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ggies07 View Post
    Any of you guys big music fans? Music is part of my life, I started drumming in school in 6th grade and went all the way through high school doing drumline. I love all different types of music. If you are, do you have any songs about the world that inspire you? I'll list some of mine (and some lyrics) that really bring me back to the basics of humanity, nature, and earth. /…
    I guess we could use something like what Sam Cooke’s A Change Is Gonna Come was for the Civil Rights movement.



    Someone should tell Lady Gaga about AGW.
    Last edited by SwedishAdvocate; 04-13-2014 at 02:41 PM. Reason: Amended the first sentence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JRP3 View Post
    Certainly some people live in more sustainable ways than others, and most of us can do more to reduce our impact. I just have a negative view of "native" populations trying to play the "holier than thou" angle, especially when obviously benefiting from modern conveniences.
    Most of the people who will suffer first and most substantially are those who are living much closer to a sustainable way of life -- the poor in agricultural cultures. They've done exponentially less harm to the planet than those of us who are privileged and, I would argue, spoiled. The holier than thou attitude lands squarely on the shoulders of the people who are doing the most harm -- us. If the US and China don't mend their ways we all are screwed.

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    Senior Member SwedishAdvocate's Avatar
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    Last edited by SwedishAdvocate; 04-13-2014 at 03:08 PM. Reason: Updated graph to include more countries. Omitted UEA and Qatar though...

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    ....AND the reality is much worse than that since most of Chinas CO2 emissions is caused by making crap for the US...

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    Quote Originally Posted by nwdiver View Post
    ....AND the reality is much worse than that since most of Chinas CO2 emissions is caused by making crap for the US...
    There are two denominator views:
    One is per country like the one above (production), the other by consumption.
    I have yet to see a good consumption based comparison, that prorrates emissions with domestic use/import/exports. In such a view yeah, China's goes lower and us and European emissions grow drastically. A consumption view is good for educating consumers and population at large.
    A reason why the production perspective (per country/per capita with no adjustment for supply chains) is useful for some conversations is because arguably China (as an example exporter) wants to be able to continue to have so many exports while decreasing emissions. Whether it's physically even possible is to be seen, but that's a reason why policy makers who care more about global trade use that view so much.

    Of course it's idiotic not to use the consumption view more often. It's like buying all your bread from your neighbor and then blaming him for having the oven on.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EchoDelta View Post

    Of course it's idiotic not to use the consumption view more often. It's like buying all your bread from your neighbor and then blaming him for having the oven on.
    Exactly why any Carbon Tax MUST... MUST be coupled with a Carbon Tariff.

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    BBC News - Asian air pollution strengthens Pacific storms

    Air pollution in China and other Asian countries is having far-reaching impacts on weather patterns across the Northern Hemisphere, a study suggests.

    Researchers have found that pollutants are strengthening storms above the Pacific Ocean, which feeds into weather systems in other parts of the world.
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