Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 18

Thread: will the 60 kWh battery be enough for me?

  1. #1
    #14,427
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Marlborough, MA
    Posts
    33

    will the 60 kWh battery be enough for me?

    I've put down my deposit on a Model S and I'm incredibly excited. I'm currently back in the queue past position 14k, so it's going to be a long time waiting..

    Anyway, I'm trying to decide if the 60kWh battery will be enough for a regular weekend trip I make from Marlborough, MA to Brandon, VT. It's about 200 miles, with the final 80 miles being mostly 40-50mph on curvy, mountainy roads. I'll pass near some chargers in Concord, but I'd rather be able to do this in a single charge. There are no real charge stations past that, though I might be able to find a house willing to let me steal some power if its an emergency. People are nice in Vermont

    Does anyone else make similar trips with their Model S? Any idea how claiming a small mountain will affect driving range, since there's a lot of regent potential on the downhill?

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Woodinville, WA
    Posts
    313
    there are no 60kWh's produced yet, or EPA ratings so no one knows for sure. Some articles have mentioned a 180 EPA range for the 60, so 200miles would probably be stretching it. Stopping mid way for an hour and picking up 30 miles of range would likely be in order. Once you've done it a few times you can probably tune a minimum pit stop would need to be...

    Also there is mention of a 'range driving mode' in the latest software update, perhaps that will help a bit.

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Metro Boston
    Posts
    167
    At first glance I'd say "no way", but you have the advantage of driving right by what will likely be a supercharger location at White River Junction. WRJ is about 140 miles from Marlborough. I do a trip from the western 'burbs to Stratton, which is about 140 miles as well. I'm doing the 85kWh, but will still have to charge overnight, even if I charge in range mode. In my opinion forget any charger except the supercharger when you're actually trying to get somewhere--the J1772's around here are too slow if you need more than about 50 miles of incremental range. I'm counting on getting about 220 miles of range going up to Stratton if I charge in range mode (fortunately it's very infrequent). For you, the supercharger plus an overnight charge would probably do it. Since you go regularly, though, I'd recommend doing the 85 kWh just for some peace of mind. If you do the 60kWh, absolutely do the supercharging option. There are other threads for estimating the effect of elevation--I believe around 7-8 miles per 1000 feet of elevation is the general view, with only a fraction recovered coming back down. Also consider posting on the New England thread if you don't get a good enough answer here.

  4. #4
    Sig Perf #236 VIN #484
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    243
    I would definitely buy the 85kwh. I have a 180mile trip that I take regularly - it saves you from range mode charging and the worry if ou have to detour or run an errand.

  5. #5
    Model S VIN P01536 Robert.Boston's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Portland, Maine, USA
    Posts
    5,866
    Sounds like you go up I-93 to I-89. You might look at taking I-495 to MA-117 to I-195 to MA-2 to MA-140 to MA-12 to US-5 to VT-103 to US-7. It's a lot shorter (~150 miles) and not much slower. Nice roads, too, and much more scenic. That route should be achievable with the 60kWh.

    But, you should get the 85kWh battery. The EPA rating on the 60kWh pack is likely to be 200 to 205 miles (derating the 230 mile advertised range by the same 265/300 ratio of the 85kWh pack). With your drive, the you'll have that long run (84 miles) on I-89, which usually moves along at a 70+ mph clip. While you'll make up some of that on the ~40 miles through Vermont on slower roads, you'll be cutting it close -- with a range charge and a new battery.

    Those last two points are why I shifted from the 60kWh to the 85kWh battery. Like you, I have a long drive (up to Maine, for me), that I make >30 roundtrips each year between houses. Range charging isn't good for your battery, and so I was concerned that ~60 range charges per year was going to create risks. Second, as the battery degrades (in part because of those range charges), the trip just becomes too long for a single charge.

    I also concluded that New England is perfectly sized for the 85kWh. From your (or my) house, you can go to Tanglewood and back. pr Chatham (Cape Cod) and back, etc. Until the charging network is built out a lot more than it is, the "and back" piece is important to me. The 60kWh gets you there; the 85kWh gets you back.

  6. #6
    S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13 jerry33's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    7,829
    I agree that the 85 is what you should be looking at. The small mountain range will add the equivalent of seven miles for each one thousand feet of elevation gain. You don't get it all back going downhill because regeneration is similar to lossy compression on audio.
    1. Do not copy anything that I post outside of the TMC forum without permission.
    2. Any advice or opinions posted here are to be taken as my personal opinions only. There is no implied warranty, fitness for purpose, or official statements from any company I may have been or am affiliated with.
    3. Even the best recommendations are wrong when used inappropriately.

  7. #7
    #14,427
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Marlborough, MA
    Posts
    33
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert.Boston View Post
    Sounds like you go up I-93 to I-89. You might look at taking I-495 to MA-117 to I-195 to MA-2 to MA-140 to MA-12 to US-5 to VT-103 to US-7. It's a lot shorter (~150 miles) and not much slower. Nice roads, too, and much more scenic. That route should be achievable with the 60kWh.
    It's been a long time since I've done that route, but it seems very likely to be manageable with the 60kWH battery. I think at sub-interstate speeds most of the way I should easily be able to do that trip in one charge.A lot of people are suggesting the 85kWh battery because it will get you "there and back". In new england, the farthest I'll probably ever want to go on one charge is NYC, which is also about 200 miles for me. I don't know that I'll take many road trips in this car, and if I do I'd probably try to plan to find a charge point at the destination. Most places I randomly visit are < 100 miles each way, so I would still probably make it back on a charge. It is cutting it close though, so I'm strongly considering upgrading the battery.Thanks for the input!

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Woodinville, WA
    Posts
    313
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert.Boston View Post
    But, you should get the 85kWh battery. The EPA rating on the 60kWh pack is likely to be 200 to 205 miles (derating the 230 mile advertised range by the same 265/300 ratio of the 85kWh pack). With your drive, the you'll have that long run (84 miles) on I-89, which usually moves along at a 70+ mph clip. While you'll make up some of that on the ~40 miles through Vermont on slower roads, you'll be cutting it close -- with a range charge and a new battery.
    I'm expecting the EPA rating to be more like 182-187 -- given the reports with the 85kWh that only 80 is used before you hit zero, something like 5 is kept as a reserve (maybe the reserve is a % though so it will be 3.5). If I take 5kWh out of both and scale 265 that's where the 182 comes, 187 if the reserve scales. We'll all know soon enough when the EPA rating come out... Maybe it will be higher if the weight of the 60 is lower, which would give us a hint of either ballast or different battery chemistry being used if the weight tis the same..

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Seattle area
    Posts
    864
    here is how we are approaching it, for what it's worth as a Leaf owner of 24 K miles over almost two years, we are buying the S as a keeper, long term, as our experience with driving electric has been awesome! I assume that even with the S that in the worst of scenarios we'll get half the rated range in say a heavy head wind, crossing a mountain pass, snow and rain and cold etc, and that over ten to fifteen years we can expect to see a 15-30% loss in range from normal aging of the battery. Also, I assume that the ideal place to keep the battery charged on a daily basis is somewhere around 50% SOC, that is our plan based on my study of Li-ion batteries. From owning the Leaf, albeit a shorter range car, you want a lot more range than you think you will need on a regular basis, a cushion for the unexpected, enough range that keeping the car near 50% SOC is still plenty for daily commuting and errands and enough range for the occasional long range trip with minimal public charging. We have had all sorts of ideals about slowing down, being more zen and getting used to waiting for the car to charge, but we've concluded that given that we are a family of 4 and are generally in a hurry, we really don't hardly ever want to wait for the car to charge. Given all these factors, combined with the presumption that the 85kW will hold it's value better (in case we do decide to upgrade down the line) we are almost certain we are going to finalize our order with the maximum range.

    you may not think it now, but you will likely want to drive your S in less than the most efficient manner at least on occasion ... I'd recommend assuming that that means 200 miles with some breathing room, is a reasonable expectation for the P85 driven liberally, about what Motor Trend got with "hard driving".
    Last edited by 100thMonkey; 2012-12-02 at 04:05 PM.
    Region: Seattle area (US)
    P85+, metalic grey, black interior, carbon fiber accents, sound, full Xpell Ultimate wrap, Alloygators...
    Solar Powered

  10. #10
    Senior Member steve841's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Ft. Lauderdale, FL
    Posts
    1,179
    You've got plenty of time to make the financial jump to the 85 battery ... do it.

    Who knows? Maybe by then, the 85 will be a 350 or 375 battery as technology moves ahead.
    Hello, I'm Sig 957!
    VIN 748

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 16
    Last Post: 2013-02-26, 09:04 PM
  2. +100 Kwh battery
    By NielsChr in forum Model S
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 2012-11-10, 07:37 PM
  3. HPWC and 60 kWh battery
    By chmod a+wrx in forum Model S: Battery & Charging
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 2012-08-06, 04:39 AM
  4. HPWC and 60 kWh battery
    By chmod a+wrx in forum Charging Standards and Infrastructure
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 2012-08-06, 04:39 AM
  5. Speculation on EPA 5-cycle ranges for 85 kWh Perf, 60 kWh and 40 kWh
    By gg_got_a_tesla in forum Model S: Battery & Charging
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 2012-06-15, 03:04 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •