malcolm

Thanks doug

Quote:

"Our association with Martin, Marc, and James has shown us that they are prescient at identifying customer needs that can grow into large market opportunities," said Navin Chaddha, Managing Director at Mayfield Fund. "We look forward to working with them to incubate or invest in the next great cleantech or software company."

Hopefully, we'll get some details in the next few weeks?

TEG

Some interesting quotes from Martin to be found here:

EVWORLD FEATURE: Shysters and Vapourware: Battery | EEStor | cityZENN

graham

Very interesting quotes, TEG. I had not read anything suggesting that Martin was so critical of Project Better Place before this. His criticisms do make some sense.

stopcrazypp

I agree on this. My hope for BEVs is that they eventually get cheap enough that we don't need an elaborate subscription model for them to work. I think most people want to own their cars.
The article also mentions Martin's interest in solid oxide fuel cells, which I believe wasn't mentioned here before.

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JRP3

Nice to see that Martin agrees with the points I've been making against battery swapping. More surprising was the almost rational comment from our favorite Kent Bot

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Joseph

From the article,

"The next problem Eberhard highlights is harder to deal with. The expensive thing with a battery pack is the container, not the contents, and every time you use the container it wears down slightly, so a battery back that's been used a hundred times will offer shorter range than one that's never been used."

OK, I understand that the more you use the battery the more it wears down (duh) but what is this talk about the "container" ???

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Takumi

I think he means the connectors. I see that as the weakest point in a battery. The more you swap, the more wear. Worn connectors will result in a slight gap which results in resistance and whatnot. Those who are more mathematically inclined around here should be able to give us stats on this.

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TEG

My take:

Electricity is/are the "contents" and that part is relatively cheap.
The "container" being the batteries themselves are expensive, and they slowly wear out. The usual overarching point is that people buying a brand new car aren't going to be thrilled to have to trade their new pack for a recharged one (at a swap station) that may be on its' last legs and offers much less range. It's a tad analogous to taking your new propane tank to the filling station and being given a rusty old one in exchange (although in that case the tank isn't worth a whole lot more than the propane inside).

JRP3

Yes, contents = electricity, container = battery.

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vfx

While I agree with the new battery (or Propane tank) swap for an old grimey one argument I would make is in pointing out that it's a short-lived problem. If the swap station guarantees a certain milage from a battery, who cares if it's ugly under your car for two weeks?
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And on another note, I believe with the PBP model you never own the battery anyway. It's always a "loaner" or Rental. I guess that means you are buying a glider.

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