Martin Eberhard sues Elon Musk and Tesla Motors - Page 9

James · 06-15-2009, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lancelac

I kind of agree with this sentiment. I think the majority have accepted that Elon is always lying and Martin is always truthful. I understand the respect that people have for Martin, both as a person and innovator, but the actual truth is largely unknown. I've been pretty much in the middle thus far, but honestly this lawsuit, and the way it's worded makes me lose a lot of the respect I had for Martin. 90%+ is frivolous and doesn't even concern issues of law. That doesn't mean I "like" Elon or the way he often does business, but that really isn't the issue here for me.

That is sort of how I feel on the entire ME vs EM battle.

I reserved my Tesla Roadster in September 2008. So I was not really paying attention during the time period when Martin Eberhard was CEO or how he was pushed out of Tesla Motors.

At the end of the day, it was a battle of money, power and ego. It is a common tale in many companies. But this is a high profile celebrity company with a lot of drama. So it gets more attention in the media.

I really appreciate Martin Eberhard for having the innovative dream to start Tesla Motors. It is very unfair that he was completely removed from his startup.

I really appreciate Elon Musk for putting up the major cash, and recruiting more investors, that made Tesla Motors a reality.

They both played a very valuable role in the creation of the Tesla Roadster that we all admire. But unfortunately their personalities did not work well together. It happens. Certain people just are meant to never get along.

Chris H. · 06-15-2009, 12:58 PM

Those of us that have been following Tesla Motors since 2006 remember what the company was like when Martin was at the helm. We know that he made a sincere effort to be as transparent as possible, and to share as much information as he could with the people who were interested in TM and the Roadster. We admired his enthusiasm for what he was doing, and the intelligence with which he approached his task. Martin did all the heavy lifting at TM, from coming up with the original idea for the car and the company, assembling an engineering team, finding early funding, lining up production & engineering partners, developing and refining the ESS and PEM, working with Barney Hatt on the styling, building models, mules, and prototypes, FMVSS testing, and communicating with the fan base and customers. Martin put his heart and soul into this company for nearly five years, only to be shown the door just before the Roadster went into production.

In contrast EM spent relatively little time on Tesla between 2004 - 2007. He was preoccupied with SpaceX. He would show up after the work was done and demand changes that would ultimately result in delays and cost overruns. EM stacked the Board of Directors with family, friends, and other allies and, just as the Roadster was almost completed, and literally days before the roll out to the automotive press, EM fabricated a reason to eject Martin from the company that he had founded and had worked so hard to build into a viable manufacturer. Afterwards EM made every effort to minimize and denigrate Martin's role in the development of the Roadster and the building of Tesla Motors. To add insult to injury, EM blamed the delays and cost overuns that his interference had caused on Martin. He tried to claim the mantle of "Founder", and through not-so-subtle means, he continues to claim as much credit as he can for the development of the Roadster.

One of these men is the Real McCoy, the other is a pretender to the throne.

There are no prizes for guessing which is which.

johnr · 06-15-2009, 01:08 PM

The press is still referring to Elon as the "founder" of Tesla Motors - although, to be fair they do include Martin as founder too.
Why can't EM and ME both be satisfied with the title of "co-founder"?

[Wired] "Tesla Motors Founder: Let Me Run Detroit"

AnOutsider · 06-15-2009, 01:46 PM

To be honest Chris, I'd have to take your post with a grain of salt as it's clear which side you're pushing for. Ideally, I just want to hear TM's response to the claims so that we can have 2 sides of the story and be closer to the ever-elusive 3rd side - the truth.

It's hard to get to the truth when you've got haters and zealots on either side spinning events in their favor and no one being objective.

Johnr: just another article to add to the suit I guess.

*edit* one thing I'm REALLY interested in hearing, is details about the delays. What exactly caused the original cost claims to be inflated? Was it Elon nitpicking and adding things that may not be needed (even if they were later accepted)? Or was it a mistake on Martin's part when it came time to put on the CFO hat?

I thought I remembered reading a while back that ME did actually say he couldn't (or didn't want to) handle the CFO bit and asked to be excused -- essentially saying if the board had replaced him sooner, the CFO position would've been helmed properly?

Chris H. · 06-15-2009, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnOutsider

To be honest Chris, I'd have to take your post with a grain of salt as it's clear which side you're pushing for.

I'm glad that it's clear which side I support. I certainly wasn't trying to hide it. There's a reason that I've chosen one side over the other though. I've been following the progress of TM since late 2006, and over that time I have read hundreds of articles, watched hours of interviews, and participated in dozens of blogs on the subject. This doesn't mean that I consider my POV to be automatically better or worse than anyone else's, but I do think that I've managed to develop some perspective over that time.

You still need more input before you come to any conclusions, and that's fine. It's normal to want to gather as much information as possible, from as many perspectives as possible, before you take a position. I encourage you to continue that process. However, just because you have not completed the process yet, do not assume that the same is true of everyone else. Also, do not assume that just because someone has reached a conclusion, and taken a position, that it automatically lacks merit.

WarpedOne · 06-15-2009, 03:19 PM

Well put Chris.

TEG · 06-15-2009, 03:34 PM

I certainly have opinions on all this, but with the courts involved, I expect they want facts, not opinions. So, lacking facts, I keep my opinions to myself.

I suspect this topic could go around and around, and never settle anything.

vfx · 06-15-2009, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarpedOne

Well put Chris.

Ditto.

And this line

Quote:

I've been following the progress of TM since late 2006, and over that time I have read hundreds of articles, watched hours of interviews, and participated in dozens of blogs on the subject.

Goes for me as well.

AnOutsider · 06-15-2009, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris H.

Also, do not assume that just because someone has reached a conclusion, and taken a position, that it automatically lacks merit.

Fair enough, but the very fact that you have come to a decision as to which side to support means that I have to take your statements with a grain of salt. Why? Your mind is already made regarding the issue which means you're less likely to process new information objectively and more likely to mold it to match your preconceived notions.

There's no offense meant there, just stating how I see it. I think it's a bit unfair to have basically only heard one side of the story (mainly from the underdog of the situation) and form a conclusion based on that. You have, and that's fine, but I'm not ready to do that just yet.

*edit* TEG put it best. We need facts, not inferences and opinions (no matter how long you've been watching Tesla). Let's let this play out and go from there.

xcelero.ii · 06-15-2009, 03:58 PM

To be honest. Although this isn't a popularity contest, I like EM and I like ME. I like them both and believe that much of TM is a result of them both.

I can't say that I disapprove of EM as the CEO. He may need some refining when it comes to integrity but I don't think he is a bad guy.

I do think it's rotten that ME was removed completely. And I think it was unnecessary.

I hope that through this legal process, they can find common ground because I would like to see ME back, if for no other reason than, TM being his baby.

Think Steve Jobs and Apple several years ago. He had a similar departure but returned better than ever.