Martin Eberhard sues Elon Musk and Tesla Motors - Page 17

xcelero.ii · 06-22-2009, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kardax

Ouch.

I've followed Tesla since they came out of "stealth mode" way back in June 2006, and I have to say that nothing in the document conflicts with what was publicly known at the time. It actually fills in quite a lot of gaps, for me.

I'm eager to see Martin's reply to this. I'm especially interested in hearing his side regarding the alleged concealment of the numerous problems with getting the roadster to production... it's a very nasty claim that will shape the rest of his career...

-Ryan

. . . . b u m p.

Kardax · 06-22-2009, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xcelero.ii

. . . . b u m p.

I should clarify, though, that not much of what Elon says was publicly known at the time, either. We all knew that the Roadster was taking longer than anyone was expecting, but we never knew the full scope of the problems. Bits and pieces started coming out following Martin's departure, but this is the first time we've heard Elon's side with no punches pulled. This sort of thing has been boiling for years and we're finally seeing it explode.

It's really a landmark document that I hope is well preserved.

Martin's response is absolutely critical if he wants to protect his name. I hope it's as thorough as Elons.

-Ryan

vfx · 06-22-2009, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brent

To me, the crux of TM's contribution to EVs is the laptop battery idea,

Don't know whose idea it was but I think I remember Martins saying he paid AC Propulsion to build the TZero with lithium batteries.

Chris H. · 06-22-2009, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vfx

Don't know whose idea it was but I think I remember Martins saying he paid AC Propulsion to build the TZero with lithium batteries.

Yes, that's right. Martin invested in ACP and paid for the first Li ion ESS in a tzero. As a result Martin got to drive the tzero as his daily driver for several months. Martin worked with Li ion batteries at NuvoMedia, and that's where the idea of using commodity cells to build a large automotive ESS came from. Martin asked Alan Cocconi about using Li ion cells in cars and Alan showed him some Li ion batteries that he (AC) had used for his airplanes. Alan had also developed a prototype ESS using prismatic cells for auto use. The ACP ESS and the Tesla ESS were different designs since ACP used prismatic cells whereas Tesla (Martin) used the 18650 cells.

JRP3 · 06-22-2009, 07:37 PM

Personally I don't think the commodity cell concept is going to spread and will be a small footnote in EV history. Larger prismatics offer many advantages for manufacturers, and most seem to be using them, and they continue to improve.

Kardax · 06-22-2009, 08:04 PM

The transmission problem as described by Elon may not be 100% correct. He states that he and JB always wanted to go with a simple single-speed transmission from the beginning, using a higher torque motor. However, by all indications such a motor wasn't possible until mid-2007 (already missing deadlines) when higher-quality IGBT technology became available. This technology eventually became "drive train 1.5", which shipped after roadster #35 or so.

Since a two-speed was (at the time) the only way to reach Musk's performance goals, Martin can't be held entirely responsible for that fiasco.

I've got nothing on the other issues, though :|

-Ryan

Picasso · 06-22-2009, 11:57 PM

I wonder what movie will be out first? The Story of Tesla, or Revenge of the Electric Car? Or how much of Revenge will be about Tesla? Seems we have a good screen play going here.

ME should get a differnt lawyer. Not sure his current pick is best to fight this beast.
Yosef Peretz
http://www.kletterperetz.com/peretz.html

WarpedOne · 06-23-2009, 12:01 AM

Quote:

I've got nothing on the other issues, though :|

I have. Everyone that expects me to believe that a competent electrical engineer thinks that problems will disappear just by ignoring them is insulting my intelligence and EM is doing just that. I'm not buying his spin. He still thinks he can treat people like objects and distort the things to his likings.

Money does not buy truth.

James · 06-23-2009, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarpedOne

Money does not buy truth.

But it does buy PR.

AnOutsider · 06-23-2009, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WarpedOne

I have. Everyone that expects me to believe that a competent electrical engineer thinks that problems will disappear just by ignoring them is insulting my intelligence and EM is doing just that. I'm not buying his spin. He still thinks he can treat people like objects and distort the things to his likings.

Money does not buy truth.

Not that it matters in the end, but out of curiosity, is there ANYTHING TM could release that would change your mind on what really happened?