| Electric Vehicles Discussion about Electric Vehicles other than Tesla Motors |
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12-04-2008, 01:33 PM
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#71 | | Super Moderator
Join Date: May 2008 Location: Winchester, UK Posts: 2,975 | Quote:
Originally Posted by 1n5p1r4t10n  Even now, all but Chrysler merely refer in passing (almost as a hindsight when questioned "what about?") to developing/implementing new sources of powering our vehicles while they've (Chrysler) placed it squarely at the forefront of their reorientation plans with the ENVI program https://www.chryslerllc.com/en/innovation/envi/overview/, which has three solely electric powered vehicles). | I wouldn't say the Volt is in passing and Ford seemed to make a big deal in their recent statement. Perhaps Chrysler have just gone about this in a smart way... | 
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12-04-2008, 01:44 PM
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#72 | | Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Aptos, California Posts: 1,551 | Darryl Siry's take: Horseless Age: Rethink State Franchise Laws in Bailout Quote:
So the Big 3 should kill some of their brands. That's fine, and it has already been suggested and considered. So what's the problem?
The problem lies with the state franchise laws. Because of these laws, killing a brand is a very expensive proposition. The most recent example being the elimination of Oldsmobile, which cost GM over $1B. The state franchise laws require the manufacturer to buy out each dealer because, it is reasoned, the dealer has invested a very large amount of time and money and care in building their business and must be compensated for this. Sounds like a great deal to me. If the manufacturer of a product is going out of business and can't afford to support the product anymore, the distributors of that product should bear their share of the unfortunate consequences.
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12-04-2008, 02:04 PM
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#73 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 199 | Quote: |
Originally Posted by graham Quote:
So the Big 3 should kill some of their brands. That's fine, and it has already been suggested and considered. So what's the problem?
The problem lies with the state franchise laws. Because of these laws, killing a brand is a very expensive proposition. The most recent example being the elimination of Oldsmobile, which cost GM over $1B. The state franchise laws require the manufacturer to buy out each dealer because, it is reasoned, the dealer has invested a very large amount of time and money and care in building their business and must be compensated for this. Sounds like a great deal to me. If the manufacturer of a product is going out of business and can't afford to support the product anymore, the distributors of that product should bear their share of the unfortunate consequences. | Which goes far in explaining why the automakers have procrastinated about doing something to salvage their long-failing stake in the industry (this fiasco didn't just happen overnight), i.e., they've been waiting for a number of the dealers to go "out of business" so that they (the "Big 3") wouldn't be saddled with the financial burden of "buying them out"...cynical I know, but it's just that this whole scenario seems, what's the word, " premeditated", to me. | |
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12-04-2008, 02:11 PM
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#74 | | Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 199 | Quote:
Originally Posted by dpeilow I wouldn't say the Volt is in passing and Ford seemed to make a big deal in their recent statement. Perhaps Chrysler have just gone about this in a smart way... | Yes, it does appear that Chrysler is more so inclined to develop and deploy an entire fleet of EV's, whereas those of GM/Ford are merely "token" offerings (the dangling carrot) to secure the loan(s)/bailout so that they can then continue on their course of providing a viable medium (petroleum fueled vehicles) for the oil companies (which they seem to have some stake in as well) by concentrating only on developing new methods to increase fuel economy. | |
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12-04-2008, 02:15 PM
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#75 | | Super Moderator
Join Date: May 2008 Location: Winchester, UK Posts: 2,975 | Quote:
Stupid expensive programs driven by misguided government policy, such as billion dollar hydrogen fuel cell programs, should immediately be eliminated.
Better incentives should be put in place that reward high gas mileage, and also encourage consumers to buy high gas mileage cars. (How about a gasoline tax that pays for the war in Iraq, anyone? This war really is about oil, you know.)
| Interesting Martin talks about programs for better mileage but not specifically battery electrics. Quote: |
Many people have asked me about Tesla’s application for a piece of the bailout pie. I absolutely think Tesla should get their piece. Their fair share should be a percentage of the total bailout proportional to the number of cars they have sold compared to the number sold by the other companies being rescued… (You do the math.)
| OK. From Ford November sales down 30.6 percent - Business First of Louisville: we can see that Ford have sold circa 2m cars this year to date. I'll assume the other two have sold the same. Tesla have 1,200 sales.
So 6,000,000 / 1,200 = 5,000.
$25bn / 5,000 means Tesla's share would be $5m. | |
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12-04-2008, 04:28 PM
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#76 | | ERIC VFX
Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: CA Posts: 4,655 | Horseless Age: Rethink State Franchise Laws in Bailout
That was a bunch of information not being disseminated to the general public.
Wow. The whole dealer model needs to be totally reworked for the new century.
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The world loves to be deceived.
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12-05-2008, 08:41 AM
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#77 | | Tesla Fan
Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 5,992 | | |
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12-05-2008, 01:47 PM
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#78 | | Head Moderator
Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Stanford, California Posts: 3,606 | Bailout fatigue hurts Big Three on Capitol Hill - SFGate 
I wonder if I'm the only one that saw this photo in the paper this morning and thought Congress should make them compete for the funds in a televised cage match. | |
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12-05-2008, 02:27 PM
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#79 | | Super Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Aptos, California Posts: 1,551 | Quote:
Originally Posted by doug Congress should make them compete for the funds in a televised cage match. | Thunderdome! | |
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12-05-2008, 11:52 PM
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#80 | | Tesla Fan
Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 5,992 | | |
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